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Am I crazy, or would this be awesome?

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
We need a standardized modular system like Eurorack for guitar!

I started thinking about an SY1000 for guitar modeling. But then I thought I'd rather have Fractal amp models. And then I realized how huge a board would have to be to fit an FM3 and an SY1000, and I started to think I don't need all the footswitches and other stuff in the SY1000, I wish I could just get a small module that only had the guitar modeling in it!
And next I started thinking, it's too bad there's no FM0, a small module with the Fractal amp models without the bulk of the FM3.

Imagine this:

I select my Roland guitar modeling module, then my Wampler Ego Comp module, next plug in my Line 6 Drive module, then my Kemper amp profile loader module, next my Strymon Big Sky reverb module, an MXR Carbon Copy module, the Line 6 Delay module, and finally my PS100 module. Then out to my speaker cab.

Or maybe for another gig I take out the PS100 module, and add a ML IR Loader module. Maybe add my TG Mastering Chain module and UA LA 2A module after it...
Maybe replace the Kemper module for a Fractal Amp Modeling module.
Or throw in a DC30 tube preamp module, or a Herbert tube preamp module.
For bass gigs start with a Line 6 Pitch/Synth module, add a Cali76 module and an Ampeg B-15 tube preamp module.

Any module could be either pure analog, or digital, or any combination and everything could be fully MIDI controlled so we can implement our own control of whatever we want.


The format of something like Eurorack seems like it would make much more sense for this type of gear than a rack mount.
We already have Synergy starting to make modular preamps, and we have companies like Eventide, Strymon, and Earthquaker already making Eurorack modules.

This seems like a great concept to me. Am I crazy?
 

phil_m

Have you tried turning it off and on again?
Gold Supporting Member
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13,260
Yes, you’re crazy… :D

For a whole hosts of reasons, the whole modular concept has never seemed to stick with guitarists. There’s been a few attempts at it, but I think a snowball has a better chance in Hades than getting all these companies to adopt a universal hardware standard now.

One of the biggest impediments to it is probably just the fact that there’s so many vintage pedals out there still, and people want to incorporate those with the new stuff. And rather than committing to buying a rig based on a entirely new modular platform, people can just go buy a pedal or two as they desire and throw it on a pedalboard.
 

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
Yes, you’re crazy… :D

For a whole hosts of reasons, the whole modular concept has never seemed to stick with guitarists. There’s been a few attempts at it, but I think a snowball has a better chance in Hades than getting all these companies to adopt a universal hardware standard now.

One of the biggest impediments to it is probably just the fact that there’s so many vintage pedals out there still, and people want to incorporate those with the new stuff. And rather than committing to buying a rig based on a entirely new modular platform, people can just go buy a pedal or two as they desire and throw it on a pedalboard.
But there is a precedent for it, and some companies have already started experimenting with it.

Synergy has a whole system of modular preamps from various different companies.
Several guitar effects companies make Eurorack modules.
I've seen internet chatter about finding ways to use Eurorack for guitar.

It seems like there's a definite path towards something like this.

I think guitarists would catch on to the idea if they actually saw it and saw how it could work for them. And it could potentially be highly marketable for various companies to make content for it.
 

LaXu

Member
Messages
9,167
Guitar pedals would make a helluva lot more sense as Eurorack units that are switched with a MIDI switcher on the floor while the pedal controls are somewhere higher.

With digital modelers, the form factor is limited mainly by screens and I/O jacks in the back. I would definitely be interested in "brain" type units that are not big bulky rack units.

As an example I don't use the onboard switches on my FM3 at all anymore. I have a CME WIDI Master hooked up to the MIDI ports and use an XSonic Airstep combo configured for 8 scenes, tap tempo/tuner and I still haven't figured out what I want to do with the leftover button (suggestions are welcome!). The controllers are small, I can use only one of them if I don't need more than 4 scenes and it's wireless!

A PS-100 module most likely would not be possible due to heat dissipation tho.
 

Astronaut FX

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
8,134
Actually, Pittsburgh Modular attempted this. I suppose it didn't sell, so they abandoned it.

Click here for details




However, you can really do this yourself with any existing Eurorack modules. They do make modules that are intended to take in a guitar (instrument level) signal and convert it to modular level so that you can run it through any modules, and then convert it back out to instrument or line level depending on where you want to route it next.

So we don't really need a new system. It already exists, and it's simply Eurorack.



 

LaXu

Member
Messages
9,167
Actually, Pittsburgh Modular attempted this. I suppose it didn't sell, so they abandoned it.

Click here for details
That's a stupid product tho. I could see people wanting Eurorack modules of pedals but I can't see why anyone would want to put them on the floor. I don't think anyone particularly enjoys having to crouch down to adjust stuff but deals with it because that's how pedals are and making them remote switchable is expensive.
 

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
Guitar pedals would make a helluva lot more sense as Eurorack units that are switched with a MIDI switcher on the floor while the pedal controls are somewhere higher.

With digital modelers, the form factor is limited mainly by screens and I/O jacks in the back. I would definitely be interested in "brain" type units that are not big bulky rack units.

As an example I don't use the onboard switches on my FM3 at all anymore. I have a CME WIDI Master hooked up to the MIDI ports and use an XSonic Airstep combo configured for 8 scenes, tap tempo/tuner and I still haven't figured out what I want to do with the leftover button (suggestions are welcome!). The controllers are small, I can use only one of them if I don't need more than 4 scenes and it's wireless!

A PS-100 module most likely would not be possible due to heat dissipation tho.
The Fractal AxeFX III screen and 5 knobs below it would fit on a 3u Eurorack module.

And there are much more powerful power amps that run much hotter that are rack mounted. I think that would be possible.
 

Will Chen

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
7,226
That's a stupid product tho. I could see people wanting Eurorack modules of pedals but I can't see why anyone would want to put them on the floor. I don't think anyone particularly enjoys having to crouch down to adjust stuff but deals with it because that's how pedals are and making them remote switchable is expensive.
Oh right...not bending to the floor. Check. Modular. Check.

 

phil_m

Have you tried turning it off and on again?
Gold Supporting Member
Messages
13,260
But there is a precedent for it, and some companies have already started experimenting with it.

Synergy has a whole system of modular preamps from various different companies.
Several guitar effects companies make Eurorack modules.
I've seen internet chatter about finding ways to use Eurorack for guitar.

It seems like there's a definite path towards something like this.

I think guitarists would catch on to the idea if they actually saw it and saw how it could work for them. And it could potentially be highly marketable for various companies to make content for it.
There are a bunch or reasons why it could make sense, but I just don’t know if that’s enough to make it thrive in the marketplace. Maybe future guitarists will be more forward-thinking, but I just think there’s so much of an emphasis on the classic guitar designs and vintage gear, that it would be a tough sell. I’ve always thought the Eurorack synth stuff is probably a relatively small market as well. It’s just that is that it has the advantage of having some really dedicated fans.

One thing regarding the Synergy modules, I believe that all the brands that have modules for it are associated with Boutique Amp Distribution (as is Synergy itself), which as far as I understand, is kind of like a OEM builder for these different brands.
 

Watt McCo

Supporting Member
Messages
12,365
Oh right...not bending to the floor. Check. Modular. Check.

What eurorack solves that these don't solve is getting rid of redundant power supplies, and how on earth would any of that gear be used in a modular way given that there is no patchbay. What's shown here is basically a big multi-tiered, multi-synth setup, which is not "modular" as that word is used within the synth world.

I don't think guitarists would get on with the amount of crowding of controls involved in a eurorack setup. And a useable patchbay would...wind up looking kinda eurorack-like. Which is to say, not something that works so well for fast setup/teardown or easy portability.
 

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
Oh right...not bending to the floor. Check. Modular. Check.

I don't think that's going to fit in the back of my CRV...

There are a bunch or reasons why it could make sense, but I just don’t know if that’s enough to make it thrive in the marketplace. Maybe future guitarists will be more forward-thinking, but I just think there’s so much of an emphasis on the classic guitar designs and vintage gear, that it would be a tough sell.
Isn't this the exact same thing people were saying about digital amp modelers 25 years ago? :)
 

phil_m

Have you tried turning it off and on again?
Gold Supporting Member
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13,260
Isn't this the exact same thing people were saying about digital amp modelers 25 years ago? :)
Well, and people are still saying it today… Yes, headway has been made, but it’s not like most guitarists are still using modelers.

The most recently released digital amps that generated the most hype are the Fender Tonemaster series, which are almost exact copies of their tube counterparts, especially from an aesthetic perspective. It’s like companies have decided that they have to disguise their technology to make it appear vintage.
 

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
I don't think guitarists would get on with the amount of crowding of controls involved in a eurorack setup.






And a useable patchbay would...wind up looking kinda eurorack-like. Which is to say, not something that works so well for fast setup/teardown or easy portability.
I don't see how it would be any different than setup/teardown/portability of a pedalboard?
 

Watt McCo

Supporting Member
Messages
12,365
The most recently released digital amps that generated the most hype are the Fender Tonemaster series, which are almost exact copies of their tube counterparts, especially from an aesthetic perspective. It’s like companies have decided that they have to disguise their technology to make it appear vintage.
I'm a dyed-in-the-wool digital diehard that has zero interest in owning anything tube at this point and when I custom build my own digital combos...I try to disguise the digital technology and make them appear vintage.
 

metropolis_4

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
6,737
Well, and people are still saying it today… Yes, headway has been made, but it’s not like most guitarists are still using modelers.
Is it not a viable market today?

Is line 6 still around?

We're sitting here having this conversation in a forum dedicated to it :)
 




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