Anybody know the turnaround changes to "All Blues"?

Discussion in 'Playing and Technique' started by MightyGuru, Aug 7, 2008.

  1. MightyGuru

    MightyGuru Member

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    I don't have a fake book....please help. I can approximate the changes but if anyone knows the real changes please help me.
     
  2. Swain

    Swain Member

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    It's a G7 type Vamp for the first 8 Bars.
    Bar 9 is D7#9.
    Bar 10 is Eb7#9 to D7#9.
    Bars 11 and 12 are usually G7 again.

    There is a "Miles Davis Real Book" available. Probably a good idea, if you're a Miles fan.

    Happy Hunting!
     
  3. MightyGuru

    MightyGuru Member

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    That's pretty much the way I am playing it now. I also add the F/A double stop to G/B double stop and back to F/A and add the G w/E in the bass.....but there's more.

    Thanks for your help, Swain.
     
  4. brad347

    brad347 Member

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    I have a different opinion of the second four bars. While the bass does remain on "G," the mode clearly changes... it's sort-of a typical "IV chord" blues sound, but over a G pedal point. You could call it Gm6, or you could call it C7/G, but I definitely don't hear it as being one chord for eight bars. YMMV. :)
     
  5. Guinness Lad

    Guinness Lad Silver Supporting Member

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    Not correct guys, the last past is:

    a partial diminished chord, take your d7#9, eliminate the D and put a high A on it by playing the 1st string. Repeat this process with the E flat chord as well and you will have it.

    The chord is called a A flat13 flat9 = an almost D7#9
    Same for the Eflat7#9, 1/2 step up or A13flat9
     
  6. Jay Mitchell

    Jay Mitchell Member

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    Depending on the bass note, it is either a D7#9 or its tritone sub, Ab13b9. My recollection, without going back and checking specific versions of the song, is that the bass in this part usually plays D-Eb-D. Adding those bass tones to your voicings makes them simple inversions of D7#9-Eb7#9-D7#9.
     
  7. JonR

    JonR Member

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    Yes, except the bass still plays D and Eb on those chords.
    Essentially, they are HW dim chords: b9 and #9, but a perfect 5th in the melody (although the Bb on the Eb chord is held as it goes back to D7, making it a #5 there).
    OTOH, the soloists seem to treat both chords as altered dominants, playing (mostly) altered 5ths as well as altered 9ths on both. (I once transcribed all the soloists' phrases over these two chords. There is no total consistency in scale choice, however; while Miles plays almost nothing but b9s and #9s, the others (along with the b9s and #9s) play b5s, #5s(b13s), perfect 5s, 13s, and even perfect 4s here and there.)

    BTW, brad347 is right: bars 5-6 (of the 12-bar) are Gm7. There's a 4 bar vamp on G7 (or rather G mixolydian), then the first 4 bars of the tune are G7. (Maybe that - 4+4=8 - is what was confusing Swain ;).)
    The switch from G mixolydian to G dorian - instead of going to C7 - is one of the crucial aspects of this tune, that many people miss when covering it. The bass stays on the G riff, it doesn't go to C. All that changes is that the B in the harmony falls to Bb: IOW, a change from mixolydian to dorian.
    It's completely missing the point of this piece (IMO) to play it as an ordinary blues. (A bit like playing "So What" and improvising in aeolian or phrygian... :rolleyes: )

    The last 2 bars are not really a "turnaround", in that the bass just returns to the G mixo vamp riff, and the horns play harmony lines in that mode (with A-B-A-G on top).
     
  8. Swain

    Swain Member

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    Yeah, it does have more to it. But, I figured this was more of a "Basics" question. I didn't want to make it tricky, for someone who is just learning the tune. Maybe I mis-judged the OP's question?
     
  9. Swain

    Swain Member

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    VICIOUS! :RoCkIn
     
  10. JonR

    JonR Member

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    Well I didn't want to say you were WRONG... ;)
     
  11. Guinness Lad

    Guinness Lad Silver Supporting Member

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    I did a clip using this tune as a base when demoing an Ethos pedal. Actually, I'm not a fan of playing this tune, in all honesty I kind of think it sucks to jam over...a little lifeless for me.
     
  12. shigihara

    shigihara Member

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  13. Guinness Lad

    Guinness Lad Silver Supporting Member

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    Still lifeless, I heard those clips when I needed some inspiration...just tired of hearing it I guess. BTW, by voicing the chords like I described you effectively play the melody line which gives the tune more strength IMHO then playing the low note. I could also add the D and E flat as well.

    Although not asked it should be noted when going up to the C portion, there are four chords played...I'll post on this later if no one does it in the mean time.
     
  14. shigihara

    shigihara Member

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    whatever...

    this one by scott henderson covers a lot of ground:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRp-ifFwODQ
     
  15. 7/4

    7/4 Member

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    Maybe it's just been played to death?



    .
     
  16. dewey decibel

    dewey decibel Supporting Member

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    One important thing to remember is the melody note over the D7-Eb7-D7 section only follows the first two chords. What I mean is it's an A over D7, then Bb over Eb7, but then it stays on Bb while the chords drop down to D7 again. It's something most people miss. Also on the part following that the rhythm vamp doesn't come back- it's sustained chords built in 4ths over G mixolydian. Another thing most people miss.

    Of course people can interpret the tune however they want, but it's just one of those tunes that irks me because people try and read it out of a book, and it's so basic if they just sat down and actually listened to the thing once they wouldn't have to read it.




    I don't know what to say, I love playing it, but only when the rest of the group is playing it right. It does suck when people are playing straight 7th chords or otherwise trying to treat it like a standard blues. It's a tune that if they call at a jam session I'll try and get off stage, but in the hands of capable players can be a lot of fun.
     
  17. brad347

    brad347 Member

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    any tune can be a lot of fun, even in the hands of less-capable players, if it's approached from a creative mindset.

    Being a technician and a craftsman is a lot of fun. But let us not forget that it's okay to be an artist, too. :)
     
  18. JonR

    JonR Member

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    I know what you mean, but that's the challenge. There's nothing in the tune itself which is "lifeless". It's simple, to be sure. But it's the way it's played that gives it life (or doesn't).
    (And I've been in many bands that don't... :( )
    Strictly speaking, there isn't a "C portion". (At least the bass in the original never plays a C note.)
    I think you mean the G dorian bars.
    The horns on the original do indeed suggest a chord sequence, but it's still essentially a G dorian harmony. Basically it's a CESH (Contrapuntal elaboration of static harmony.)

    I think in general this tune probably is over-played. It's a historical classic (as are other tunes on that album), but there's a reasonable argument for saying it belongs to the past: that we should take its lessons and build on them.
    Same (more so) with "So What". It's a dorian exercise. So what, indeed! We can all do dorian exercises now.

    It's important (IMO) for jazz players to learn and play these tunes as beginners - just as they should play all kinds of historic classics, to understand the development of the music. It's more the attitude of that album that matters, that is still relevant (as well as its historic importance), not the actual material on it.
    IMHO... ;)
     
  19. MartinPiana

    MartinPiana Supporting Member

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    rockinrob mentioned fourths. here's one of the voicings i use in accompanying for the so-called turnaround (played on the G-B-E strings)

    G C F (open, 1st fret, 1st fret)
    A D G (2nd, 3rd, 3rd)
    G C F (o,1,1)
    G C E (o, 1, o)

    Those who find this tune boring to play know a lot more than me. I'm still discovering many possibilities.
     
  20. Clifford-D

    Clifford-D Member

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    It has been played to death, and that's the problem.
    It needs to be played to life. :)
     

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