As of July 1, 2017 No More Ads Requesting PayPal Gift in the TGP Emporiums

Discussion in 'Announcements To The Membership' started by Scott Peterson, Jun 15, 2017.


  1. hdahs143

    hdahs143 Supporting Member

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    And when it is not associated with TGP in any way to include their emporium, that is exactly what you have. It is incredibly short sighted and naive to think that just because you represent yourself to be an honorable seller, that should be enough for a buyer to send you money on complete faith with no possible avenue for recourse if you turned out to be less than what you presented yourself to be. The days of the handshake deal are over. This is the internet and deals are not face to face, and thinking it silly for one side to want some form of protection is absurd.

    And lastly, the few of you who don't like this, seem to be complaining because you aren't getting things 100% your way. You can still do PPG deals all day long. You just can't do it in TGP's back yard or with their knowledge or approval. It's comical that you want to blame those who complain to TGP about a deal that is 100% in the sellers favor, and does nothing for the buyer in case things go south. And occasionally they do. And sometimes its just dumb luck and has nothing to do with anyone's negligence. **** happens.

    Using PPG for sales is not in keeping with what it was designed for and is fraud. You can spin it any way you wish, but that doesn't change. You have choices, and using a service without paying for it as you agreed is a choice. And choices come with consequences.
     
    stevieboy, QRSS and Broomz like this.
  2. FrankHendrix

    FrankHendrix Telephile Gold Supporting Member

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    Haha, yes I did.

    I would burn my own nipples off with my Zippo before I knowingly ripped someone off. I have been disappointed a couple of times with stuff I paid for with PPG, but I have done hundreds of transactions. Most people are essentially decent and honest, and sometimes we even communicate with each other over differences. I have a 100% rating here, on Reverb, on eBay with about 2000 unique feedbacks (plus hundreds of feedbacks that don't count because they are from repeat buyers, etc.) Paypal has burned me quite a few times as a seller on eBay, in coordination with their masters, but it's not hard to understand their recent shift to a 3.5% fee for guitars - guess they're moving to put Reverb out of business. I try to price my stuff at a fair amount, but I don't like giving it away. When a buyer expects me to drop my price, pay for the shipping and eat the fees, well, that's probably a sale that isn't going to happen. We shall see how it shakes out. If a buyer wants to see a discount, and comes up with the idea of paying with F&F and suggests it, I won't know which way to turn though.
     
  3. FrankHendrix

    FrankHendrix Telephile Gold Supporting Member

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    That's happened to me more than once. It's not a common thing, but ... it only has to happen the once and you never forget it.
     
    SnidelyWhiplash likes this.
  4. FrankHendrix

    FrankHendrix Telephile Gold Supporting Member

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    Too many idiots at the post office and UPS, Fedex, etc. leave packages outside the property on the sidewalk. It's happened to me at least 8 times in the last few months. They mark it as "delivered" and it's free to first person who happens to walk by if they aren't too lazy to reach down and pick it up.
     
    SnidelyWhiplash likes this.
  5. Guitardave

    Guitardave Member

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    Honestly - I don't really care if someone walks away from buying something because I won't take Paypal. I wouldn't ship you a $4k car and give you a 6 month open-ended return option all at my expense. There's no difference here...

    I think that most folks are fairly uninformed on PP policies and safeguards for sellers. It doesn't take long to get educated on the risks though. A quick net search will cure you of any illusions quickly. And hopefully it won't be after you get burned on a $4k piece of gear. At least around here you can look up histories, comments and get some references.

    But ignoring legitimate PP concerns and moralizing about my motives as a seller is just BS.

    I will however, abide by the TGP policy if I choose to do any more sales on here. PP Gift really isn't fundamentally much safer than regular PP when it comes to getting scammed buy a buyer.

    I stopped selling on eBay a decade ago - at this point it's pretty much CL with cash and carry.

    On the rare occasions I ship something it's usually personal check or USPS money order only unless I know you. And I always talk with everyone I deal with to make sure all questions and concerns are addressed up front. Anything seems off then I'm quite happy to just walk away. And often I end up giving stuff away.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2017
  6. Broomz

    Broomz Member

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    I don't understand this. What could be safer than having the cash in your pocket before you have delivered a product with no ability for the buyer to get it back whether or not they actually receive anything in return? Unless I'm missing something that seems to be literally the safest situation you could dream of. What else is there?
     
  7. Guitardave

    Guitardave Member

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    The short answer is that PP is all about the funding source for the money you receive. If the person funds their "gift" with a credit card - they can still dispute it with their CC company. I only take checks (and allow them to fully clear before shipping - call the bank and verify - usually takes about 5-7 days) or USPS Money orders - they can be verified, unlike all the fake cashiers checks/money orders the scammers use.

    What's funny is I personally have had zero issues as a seller - but I do have close friends who have. As others have pointed out - TGP is generally a solid place and I believe most people are fundamentally honest. But I also know the stress and aggravation that a bad deal causes me - and I just don't want the headache. For little stuff - pedals, etc. I typically don't care about PP - but it's the larger stuff like amps/guitars that it's just not worth it.

    Read up on PP/eBay issues - a quick Google search will quickly yield plenty of info on the risks. Decide for yourself how you want to approach things.

    My $.02
     
    skydog likes this.
  8. tonedover

    tonedover Supporting Member

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    Thumbs up on the new policy.

    As much as I love this community/forum, I always remember that is ONLY what it is. Its a message board.
    Its not my personal used gear store front.
    Its not a 3rd party flea market equivalent where you can set up a virtual booth (Reverb) to gain advantage of the traffic.
    And its not some exclusive club where only trustworthy people can enter.
    Its an internet forum, where a bunch of some-what like minded music folk can virtually message board to interact, talk, debate, laugh and sometimes trade gear, usually for $$.
    And there are rules that we have to follow if we want to participate, regardless if we love the rules or not.

    "I feel" like some folks may not agree with my thoughts above. And that's ok. That's why we are all here - to talk and express ourselves. Just wanted to express myself by adding to the thread. Thanks!
     
  9. SlyStrat

    SlyStrat Supporting Member

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  10. Mickey Shane

    Mickey Shane Supporting Member

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    PayPal is good, but that gift stuff was custom made for a scammer.
     
  11. FrankHendrix

    FrankHendrix Telephile Gold Supporting Member

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    Probably so. In my case, over dozens or hundreds of transactions, I found it to be the best possible way to save a few bucks as a buyer and help the seller save a few bucks and hope like h*ck nobody who ever bought anything from me using it felt like they got scammed.
     
  12. Mickey Shane

    Mickey Shane Supporting Member

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    Yes, qualified honest people can save a bunch by using the gift option. Those people need a round of applause!
     
  13. Mickey Shane

    Mickey Shane Supporting Member

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    PayPal won't cover you unless you pay the 3%. IMHOO
     
  14. FrankHendrix

    FrankHendrix Telephile Gold Supporting Member

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    The savings DO add up on these multi-thousand dollar purchases but then again, those are the ones that potentially could blow back the most cruelly on someone. A guy sent me six thousand dollars - as a friend - for a guitar he wanted to buy from me. Luckily he was more than satisfied with the guitar and, in fact, bought one of my Bunnynose builds from me a year later.
     
    Mickey Shane likes this.
  15. old crow

    old crow Supporting Member

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    So what good options do we have ?
    I recently found out about the 6 mo no questions asked refund policy and
    was not impressed. the buyer and I finally resolved it but I’ve quit
    PayPal.....I’m saving $ now and happy with my gear, but there will
    be something I need to buy or sell....then what ?
     
  16. sezna

    sezna Member

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    Venmo? Bank transfer? I'm sorta new but I don't see anything against it in the emporium rules.
     
  17. mojocaster.com

    mojocaster.com Supporting Member

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    I still see plenty of posts in the emporium that asks buyers to pay the fees, so I guess nothing's really changed.
     
    gkelm likes this.
  18. Scott Peterson

    Scott Peterson Staff Member

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    We handle every single reported post. It is not allowed to do so.

    There is no rule except against using Paypal Gift. What members do in deals or how they conduct them has nothing to do with us. Paypal Gift is not allowed in ads on TGP.
     
    Guitardave likes this.
  19. Darasick

    Darasick Supporting Member

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    I’m fairly neutral on the subject, but this statement seems to contradict itself, unless I’m reading it incorrectly
     
  20. sezna

    sezna Member

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    I think it's just that they've had issues with PP Gift payments in the past, so they're gone. If issues arise with other payments, perhaps then it will be gone then. When it comes down to it, they have the right to moderate the content of posts, so if PP gifts are causing a hassle, so be it?
     
    Darasick likes this.

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