Badger 30 ideas for reducing fizz

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by odranreb19, Feb 10, 2015.

  1. odranreb19

    odranreb19 Member

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    Hi guys, I'm new here and would like some help to solve a Badger 30 ~problem~ (I could call a minor inconvenience). I think the amp sounds great clean (gain until 4) and with a little crunch (gain 4-6), takes all my pedals very well, etc.

    The thing is... when I put the gain over 6, it starts to create some high freqs that don't seem to mix very well (I think that's what you guys call 'fizz'). When I boost with my OCD, I can get rid of those frequencies by setting the tone very low. But I would call that cheating :p. I would really like the amp to sound great without needing an external solution.

    So, to fix my problem I've done my homework and thoroughly searched all topics on the subject and have some ideas I would like to share with you, to get some feedback and suggestions:

    1. Break in the speaker: It's a 112 suhr cab with Vintage 30. I've done some gigs with this amp over the past 3 years, but nothing too heavy. So, I'm trying to push the speakers e probably get some results in a few weeks. Or am I wasting my time?

    2. Change the tubes: I don't know what tubes are in the amp, but I could change the power tubes for Mullards EL-34 and the preamp for JJ ECC83s or 12ax7 Mullards. Any other suggestions for a smoothier drive?

    3. Change the speakers: I think the overall impression is that the V30s are fizzy amps. Considering the wattage limitation (30w amp in a 112 cab) what do you guys recommend? G12-65? ET-65?

    4. Change the pickups: I usually play with my maple strat which is a pretty bright guitar, specially in the bridge pickup. Any recommendations for a pickup swap too?

    Thanks! :aok
     
  2. Optimus Rhyme

    Optimus Rhyme Member

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    How low are you running the power and drive knobs? If you have the power knob low and the drive knob up high - that will create lots of fizz in those amps. The way to get good amp distortion with the Badger series is to set the Gain knob to the desired level of grit, put the Power up full and use the Drive as your overall master volume. You should also try lowering the Power in conjunction with the Drive to lower the overall wattage of the amp. A Celestion G12M Creamback might also be a better fit for that amp as well. I'd start there before rolling tubes though. The Badgers come stock with new production JJ tubes supplied by ARS in California (they are a tube wholesaler to amp companies).
     
  3. Echoplexi

    Echoplexi Silver Supporting Member

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    I had a 30 and tried every suggested setting I could find multiple speakers, preamp tubes , and guitars. I found it to be fizzy like you said no matter what. Just not the amp for me and kind of turned me off to power scaling. Many people love these though so it was just not for me I guess
     
  4. mscotts

    mscotts What?! Silver Supporting Member

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    Agreed, be careful that you are not running the drive too high, it can get fizzy.
    Suhr recommends running the power and drive controls within 2 numbers of each other if you're not running the power full up and using the drive as master volume.
    The Badger cab comes (these days) loaded with a WGS "Veteran 30" which is like a less spikey Vintage 30.
    As mentioned G12M type speakers also sound great in this cab, I'm currently running a Scumback M75 in mine and it sounds great.
     
  5. donbarzini

    donbarzini Member

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    very fizzy, fuzzy overdrive tone, I had a couple of the Badger 30's….
     
  6. Ali

    Ali Member

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    Same. I tried the Badger in the hope it would be a cheaper, smaller alternative to the OD100/PT100 but, nope. Had to buy a PT100. Which I love to bits!
     
  7. odranreb19

    odranreb19 Member

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    Yeah, I know that. I forgot to mention that I normally use this amp at bedroom levels, so my power knob is usually around 2-4 with the drive knob around 0-4.


    I also forgot to mention that I live in Brazil, so it's pretty hard to get high quality gear (like Scumbacks) around here. I think that I can find Celestions and, not without some effort, Warehouse speakers - that's why I asked about the G12-65 and the ET-65.

    :( And I went for the Badger in the first place trying to get away from pure preamp tube distortion (which are very fizzy) trying to push the power amp (more warmer) with the Power Scalling.
    Well... adding a 5th option to my list, which low wattage amps do you guys recommend for a smoother (the less fizz, the better) British/ Marshally tone? Fargen, Germino, Friedman, Metroamp...?
     
  8. LPMojoGL

    LPMojoGL Music Room Superstar Supporting Member

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    In my brief times trying out the Badger, I found the best gain sounds to be had by setting the amp for mild breakup, and hitting it with a boost of some sort for dirtier sounds.

    Marshally sounding amps that don't sound fizzy at low volumes, that I've owned:
    Fargen Olde 800 MkII, Rockitt Retro 50, Germino Masonette used with an attenuator, Marshall DSL, Friedman BE100, Smallbox 50, JJ100...
     
  9. odranreb19

    odranreb19 Member

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    That's exactly what I've been doing since I bought it.

    Tks for the tip! I'll try to find some of these amps around here, otherwise I'll just go for another blind purchase.

    You mentioned an attenuator... If I replace my Badger 30, and lose the power scalling feature, which attenuator do you recommend?
     
  10. Jerrod

    Jerrod Silver Supporting Member

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    What's the problem with just using the pedal?
     
  11. Randy Van Sykes

    Randy Van Sykes Member

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    With fizzy type amps I use the presence for the high end attack and back the treble off to where you don't mind the highs (fizz).
    Don't be surprised if the presence is at 7 or 8 and the treble is at 4.

    ...also the speaker matters a lot. A non-broken in speaker can have an unpleasant high end.
     
  12. Echoplexi

    Echoplexi Silver Supporting Member

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    Those are great suggestions. I can vouch that the Friedmans have such an excellent master volume you wouldn't need an attenuator or anything regardless of wattage. Down to a whisper they still sound amazing
     
  13. Rusty G.

    Rusty G. Member

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    I think that a certain amount of fizziness is just something that's inherent in the EL84 power tube amps. I find that setting my EL84 amps to just breaking up, and hitting them with a smoother pedal, like a TubeScreamer tends to take away from the grit and give more gain. I find a Timmy or Klon KTR can make for more grit, whereas the TubeScreamer adds more compression and gain. If you don't like the TubeScreamer circuit, you could try hitting the front end with a Zendrive.

    Also, I have an always on pedal with my EL84 amps. . .a Keeley Compressor. It's the last thing in my pedal chain, and just adds enough sustain to keep things interesting.
     
  14. Rusty G.

    Rusty G. Member

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    Oops!
     
  15. odranreb19

    odranreb19 Member

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    Tks for the help FM1968! I actually don't play much high gain tones - at least not using my strat. I thought about swapping my pickups as an alternative to balance the brightness of the maple and the amp. I'll probably swap the speaker first. And than see what comes next.

    And I don't have any problem with using pedals. It's just that to remove the fizz and get more overdriven tones pushing the amp, I have to roll down the tone of the pedal (at least the ones I have: OCD or Shiba Drive) to less than 1. And that changes a lot of the tonal characteristics of the amp, the guitar, etc...
     
  16. JoeB63

    JoeB63 Supporting Member

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    How are you running the Power and Drive controls? Power should at least as high as the Drive control. If you run with Power set low and Drive set high, you get fizz. Otherwise, you should get no fizz. That's the way it was intended to be used.
     
  17. sinasl1

    sinasl1 Member

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    Ya, I'd set the amp for edge-of-breakup, like gain on 5-6, roll down guitar vol for clean, and hit it with a nice pedal for full bore grind, and I'd suggest an A-type speaker. They are a "fizz killer", for sure. That goes for any amp you'd like to smooth out. Pretty cheap way to refine your tone, if you ask me... less than most pedals, for sure, and speaker swapping makes a huge difference in tone. Also nice is the Veteran 30, if you want the V30 thing but with an overall smoother top end response
     
  18. coltranemi2012

    coltranemi2012 Supporting Member

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    Pete...how do you usually set the power and drive?
     
  19. sinasl1

    sinasl1 Member

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    Of say, power on 6 drive on 4- the amp is probably at 10-15 watts at that point and is a nice comfortable volume for small clubs, etc.
     
  20. odranreb19

    odranreb19 Member

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    Tks Pete! Curiously this was the first time I heard about using a A-type amp to reduce the fizz. I'll try to find one around here, but considering my somewhat narrow options (living in Brazil), what do you think of a G12-65 or WGS-ET65? Or any other high wattage celestion/wgs speakers?
     

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