Best way to set up a wet/dry rig with two combo amps?

archtopjazz

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I'm trying to set up a wet/dry rig with 2 combo amps. I am running the following pedals for effects, Wha, 2 OD, chorus and 2 delays.
The dry amp is a Mojave Sidewinder. It has no effects loop but does have a line out.
The wet amp will be a Fender Princeton 1x12 combo.

What would be the best way to do this?

TIA
 

tubetonez

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I'd say try this, get an A/B/Y switch:
GTR>Wah>OD1>OD2>A/B/Y switch
A>Mojave
B>Delay1>Delay2>Chorus>Fender

I prefer Chorus after delay, you can change this if you like. Unless you desire some blend of clean + OD tones, put the OD's before the A/B switch. Wah alone into one amp with no Wah into the other is going to sound funky - not necessarily in a good way.

You can also experiment with just a "Y" cable vs. a switch, which you may not need depending on what you're going for.
 

DaveKS

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Looks like sidewinder has adjustable line out, might be best to put your wet pedals there and then feed that to the wet amps input. That way your wet amp gets a feed from same preamp as dry side.

Either way (this way or with ABY) you still might have to deal with phase and ground hum issues. Only way to know is to try it.

Are any of your pedals capable of doing a wet/dry split?
 

archtopjazz

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Are any of your pedals capable of doing a wet/dry split?

What do you mean? Are they stereo pedals?

Thanks
 

DiPa

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I'd say try this, get an A/B/Y switch:
GTR>Wah>OD1>OD2>A/B/Y switch
A>Mojave
B>Delay1>Delay2>Chorus>Fender

I prefer Chorus after delay, you can change this if you like. Unless you desire some blend of clean + OD tones, put the OD's before the A/B switch. Wah alone into one amp with no Wah into the other is going to sound funky - not necessarily in a good way.

You can also experiment with just a "Y" cable vs. a switch, which you may not need depending on what you're going for.
This is a solution, and looks good.
 

Blues Lyne

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Are you using dirt from the dry amp? If so, I'd definitely take the line out from the Sidewinder and run it into your delays (chorus too if you prefer chorus after dirt) and then into the the wet amp. That's the way I do it, though I'm not running the second amp wet only.

Using an ABY pedal can work. and I've done it that way, but the delay will be fed with a cleaner signal than what is coming out of the dry amp. You still get the echos, but they sound different than the wet amp. To me it sounds better to have the dry amp feed the delays. The line out on the Mojave amps is wired off of the speaker out, so you get the sound of the full amp (including power section) feeding the delays. That's how you do it in the studio or live if you mic the dirty amp and add delay at the board.

If both amps are clean, the ABY pedal idea might work just as well, but I can't think of any sonic advantage it has over using the line out from the dry amp. It will require one less cable between the board and dry amp.

What are you trying to accomplish with the wet/dry rig? That might help zero the answers in to your needs. In my case, I wanted to be able to have my amp breaking up a bit, but don't like reverb and delay before dirt. I use a Suhr ISO Line Out to give me the same sort of line out that your Sidewinder has and then run it to my reverb and delay pedals and into the second amp. Works great for me.
 
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archtopjazz

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Are there any advantages/disadvantages of going line out or ABY box?
Who makes a good ABY box?

Thanks
 

archtopjazz

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What are you trying to accomplish with the wet/dry rig? That might help zero the answers in to your needs.[/QUOTE]

I'm just trying to fatten it up a bit, but I'm not sure what advantage this would have over running a stereo rig or just adding a 2nd cab. I played thru a wet/dry rig a while back and it was the best tone I ever had.

I run the dry amp with just a bit of dirt, but the pedals are what really get me the overdrive tone.
 
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bard2dbone

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A guitar player that I worked with in (ahem) the previous millennium used a set up something like that. He had the A/B/Y pedal, too. But he also used a Stereo/Pan/Volume pedal that let him blend between the two rigs for variable mixes.

Say for example: Your solo starts with heavy delay, chorus, and vibe to be all spacy. So it's 80% left amp/20% right amp. But as the solo builds towards its peak moment you want less spacy sound and more simple aggressive sound, so 40% left amp/60% right amp. But blending slowly, not switching.

It was pretty darned effective. But it requires a pedal like his Stereo/Pan/Volume that I haven't seen one of since 1990. And it took a BUNCH of tapdancing to control his pedalboard. It's more than I would recommend on purpose.

I should include that at the time we wrote the song with the solo that I was referencing, he used a Groove Tubes Soul-O 75 for his dirty channel, and a Roland JC-120 for the clean. I don't know what would be the modern equivalents of those. I actually really miss that Soul-O. It was the best recording amp ever.
 

Blues Lyne

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Are there any advantages/disadvantages of going line out or ABY box?
Who makes a good ABY box?

Thanks
I'm just trying to fatten it up a bit, but I'm not sure what advantage this would have over running a stereo rig or just adding a 2nd cab. I played thru a wet/dry rig a while back and it was the best tone I ever had.

I run the dry amp with just a bit of dirt, but the pedals are what really get me the overdrive tone.
The advantages of the line out are that you already have it, you don't have to add another pedal to your board and you are feeding your delay pedals with the full sound of the pedalboard and dry amp (preamp, eq, power section). With the ABY pedal you are feeding the delays with a signal that doesn't sound like the dry amp because it's split off before the amp. It will still work, but in my experiments, it didn't sound as good. Many pros go so far as to mic the dry amp so they get the sound of the amp and speaker(s) feeding the wet effects.

The only disadvantage I can see to using the line out is that you will have to run 3 cables from your board to your amps. One to the input of the dry amp, one from the line out to the wet effects, and one from the wet effects to the wet amp. I don't see any sonic disadvantage to using the line out.

The only sonic advantage I can see to the ABY pedal is if you want to be able to switch between the amps. But, if you are doing wet/dry I can't see that being useful. Everything else that you can do with the ABY you can do with the line out. If you mount the ABY pedal on the board, you would only need two cables going from the board to the amps, because the cable feeding the wet effects would be on the board between the ABY pedal and the input of the first wet effect. A disadvantage to the ABY pedal is that depending on the ABY pedal you use, you may lose some signal strength to both amps. This isn't an issue using the line out.

When running two amps there is always the possibility that you will have ground loops or phase issues, but that can happen with either method of splitting the signal. Some of the more expensive ABY pedals use a transformer to isolate the two signals and some may have a phase switch. That's one of the advantages of the Suhr ISO Line Out, it has phase and ground lift switches.

For what you are doing, I'd recommend using the line out. My guess is that it will be the best sounding and you already have it, so might as well give it a try first. If it works well, you are done. If you have any phase or ground loop issues, you can then address them. If I hadn't compared both methods, I would probably have been fine with the ABY pedal. It didn't sound horrible or anything. I just don't think you'll gain much of anything over what you already have.
 
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rippingrudy

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If you have two amps do this:

Guitar > Wah > Overdrive > A/B/Y switch > send one signal directly to one amp > Send the other signal through your delay, chorus, phaser, flanger > into the other amp. Run the rig with both amps going at the same time OR kick in the wet rig when you want to.

You can also run another OD into the wet rig for leads (that's what I do).

Mine looks like this:

Guitar > Tuner > Compressor > OD > Wah > ABY box > Output 1 into a JCM 800 4010 combo > Output 2 into another OD, delay, chorus, flanger and whatever else into another JCM 800 4010 combo.

The "dry" amp is set with less gain off the hop so I can cover more ground (clean to mean). The second "wet" amp is maxed out on the preamp gain.
 

Blues Lyne

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If you have two amps do this:

Guitar > Wah > Overdrive > A/B/Y switch > send one signal directly to one amp > Send the other signal through your delay, chorus, phaser, flanger > into the other amp. Run the rig with both amps going at the same time OR kick in the wet rig when you want to.

You can also run another OD into the wet rig for leads (that's what I do).

Mine looks like this:

Guitar > Tuner > Compressor > OD > Wah > ABY box > Output 1 into a JCM 800 4010 combo > Output 2 into another OD, delay, chorus, flanger and whatever else into another JCM 800 4010 combo.

The "dry" amp is set with less gain off the hop so I can cover more ground (clean to mean). The second "wet" amp is maxed out on the preamp gain.
Am I understanding this right, your delay, chorus and reverb are going into the dirtiest amp?
 

rippingrudy

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Am I understanding this right, your delay, chorus and reverb are going into the dirtiest amp?
Yes - but only because I use the dirtiest for leads and "ambience". You could run both amps with equal gain... Then you could use a tube screamer in front of one and something nastier in front of the other. There are a lot of options.
 

rippingrudy

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..... With a JCM 800 like I have it's very hard to run delay with a distortion pedal. The distortion pedal overloads the delay.
 

Blues Lyne

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Yes - but only because I use the dirtiest for leads and "ambience". You could run both amps with equal gain... Then you could use a tube screamer in front of one and something nastier in front of the other. There are a lot of options.
I know it works well for some, but I use a wet/dry rig specifically because I don' like delay into dirt.:D So, you are using the wet/dry set up for a bigger sound and to be able to switch between two different dirt tones?
 

rippingrudy

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I see what you mean. Yes, I want the first, dry amp to have less dirt so I can go from clean to AC/DC. I also use an OD pedal with the dry amp. The second amp is set dirtier for leads but that is because I can't run a delay pedal with an OD pedal at the same time. Basically it's clean to mean on the dry amp and mean to meaner on the wet. All manipulated by the guitar's volume knob. That's just me though - I'm sure there are better ways.
 

Funky54

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I'd say try this, get an A/B/Y switch:
GTR>Wah>OD1>OD2>A/B/Y switch
A>Mojave
B>Delay1>Delay2>Chorus>Fender
This but I'll add something, try taking a second guitar output from the last delay and connect it to the second guitar input on the Mojave. "Some" stereo effects only send a signal out from the second out put if they are engaged. If you set the second delay to only a dedicated repeat without an original signal you get an almost dual guitar sound.

Using your A/B if you select just the fender amp and then the Mojave only gets the dedicated repeat.

I do it with three amps Left / right stereo panning wet and the third amp is dry but gets a dedicated second repeat only by using the second guitar input. No signal comes into that input unless I engage delay otherwise it's dry.

What this does is the first original signal comes through two or three amps but then the second repeat is far left, the third is far right. I do this sorta tight almost ping, pong, ping if you get my meaning.
 
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Blues Lyne

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Looks like a lot of votes for the ABY pedal. For those recommending it, what do you see as the advantage to using it over the line out from the Sidewinder?
 

DaveKS

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Are any of your pedals capable of doing a wet/dry split?

What do you mean? Are they stereo pedals?

Thanks
Some pedals actually give you a wet/dry splitter built in, like the new DM-2w, some older boss delays or my Akai Headrush can do this.

 

archtopjazz

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Looks like a lot of votes for the ABY pedal. For those recommending it, what do you see as the advantage to using it over the line out from the Sidewinder?
Good question, and what kind of ABY box are you using?
 






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