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Bogner Shiva or Bogner Shiva 20th Anniversary

Daprofessor

Member
Messages
577
Which do you prefer? I am partial to the silver back non reverb original Shivas. But, how good are the upgrades on the 20th anniversary. Videos on youtube are not as reliable as you may think.
 

vchizzle

Member
Messages
778
There’s a healthy amount of Shiva threads if you search. I know because I just picked up a 20th and did a fair amount of reading. I think it comes down to a couple of things.

-How important is the fx loop to you? I’ve heard from people who think even the last version before the 20th, although useable, they still feel there’s some tone suck there and the amp loses something. I can’t really say. I haven’t played all the versions enough to know.

-What level of gain do you want to achieve without external boost pedals?
Personally, I like to get into the heavier gain tones. I like the mode switch on the 20th to push it to the more modern side. I find my favorite tones are the standard shiva gain mode with the boost on or the more modern mode with the boost off. All of the tones are really good, that’s just where I “live” most of the time. I’ve played a silver el34 and I do like the overall tones, just like to be able to go a little further. I’m sure there’s people who have both or played them side by side that can compare better. The 20th was a no brainer for what I like and it sounds great. I’ve heard plenty tout the virtues of the original and say it’s better overall. YMMV.
 

Daprofessor

Member
Messages
577
There’s a healthy amount of Shiva threads if you search. I know because I just picked up a 20th and did a fair amount of reading. I think it comes down to a couple of things.

-How important is the fx loop to you? I’ve heard from people who think even the last version before the 20th, although useable, they still feel there’s some tone suck there and the amp loses something. I can’t really say. I haven’t played all the versions enough to know.

-What level of gain do you want to achieve without external boost pedals?
Personally, I like to get into the heavier gain tones. I like the mode switch on the 20th to push it to the more modern side. I find my favorite tones are the standard shiva gain mode with the boost on or the more modern mode with the boost off. All of the tones are really good, that’s just where I “live” most of the time. I’ve played a silver el34 and I do like the overall tones, just like to be able to go a little further. I’m sure there’s people who have both or played them side by side that can compare better. The 20th was a no brainer for what I like and it sounds great. I’ve heard plenty tout the virtues of the original and say it’s better overall. YMMV.
Thanks for the reply. I’ve owned a silver back EL34, non reverb, which was a beast. I’d prefer the non reverb models as the reverb versions had less bite to them, wasn’t as ferocious sounding.
 

RAG7890

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
1,003
IMHO the standard Shiva in either 6L6 or EL34, Reverb or no Reverb.

I have both.

IMHO I always felt as though the 20th was a rush job that wasn’t done quite right.

:beer
 

Daprofessor

Member
Messages
577
Is that a generally-accepted statement? I hadn’t heard that before, but I’d be curious if it were true.
This was the word on the Shiva's back in the day. Also, I mentioned this to the Bogner people (shop) in North Hollywood and they gave me a wink. I am not sure what that meant, but that's been my experience.
 

Jabby92

Member
Messages
3,415
The 20th has some more gain overall. Basically just a hot-rodded Shiva in a sense to me. I think either version is great and if you decide boost either one it will crush for soaring lead sounds. Even plugging straight in its a great amp of course. I'd just go with the one that fits your budget.
 

Daprofessor

Member
Messages
577
I’ve definitely read that multiple times. I’ve never played a reverb model.
I have actually compared two Shivas side by side back in the day. A non reverb model versus my buddies reverb model. The non reverb model was a BEAST while the reverb model was a kitty. I verified the theory which was all over the internet about 12 years ago.
 

RyanPitch

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
271
Man, I’m so interested in this from an amp builder’s perspective. What in the WORLD (for example, in the circuitry) could make such a difference, and why would Reinhold have allowed/accepted/wanted it?
 

RAG7890

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
1,003
What makes you say that?
I was the Bogner Distributor here for quite a few years & the distinct impression we got (from what we saw & were told) was that this project was rushed because Bogner felt they had to have something new, hence the 20th Anniversaries.

Same with the Twin Jet..........the Uberschal is a better option IMHO......& same again with the Duende, the 30W version was not as good as the 15 - 18W versions. It was also rushed with less development work.

IMHO the standard Shiva is the one, with or without Reverb.

As I mentioned, I still own mine (6L6 & EL34) & very much doubt I'll ever sell them.

Edit: Just wanted to add that if you are happy with your 20th Shiva that is all that really matters. Just so many Amps to choose from these days & we all like different things.

:beer
 
Last edited:

RAG7890

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
1,003
I have actually compared two Shivas side by side back in the day. A non reverb model versus my buddies reverb model. The non reverb model was a BEAST while the reverb model was a kitty. I verified the theory which was all over the internet about 12 years ago.
What year were these 2 x Shivas? What were the Tubes & Bias?

I have some NOS Amps lying around (~ 2008 or earlier), maybe I should look at this again.

Mind you, a friend had an older Silver Chassis Shiva that was an awesome Amp.

:beer
 

IanRubbish

Member
Messages
327
I have a 20th with KT88’s, it sounds massive and i feel like it gets closer to the really heavy sounds than a standard Shiva can. I love the clean sounds, especially with the bright switch. The only thing that sucks is if i leave the bright switch on and kick on an overdrive, it fizzes out. I actually was playing it in stereo today with a Mesa Mark V and they went together very well.
 

ldizzle

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
5,286
I love my <100 serial shiva. It's a DIFFERENT amp than the kt88 anni. KT88 is a massive gain monster.
But... my low serial amp CLEAN is insane. The gain is just midgain on it's own. It needs a booster.
There is a substantial amount more gain in the kt88
 

Daprofessor

Member
Messages
577
What year were these 2 x Shivas? What were the Tubes & Bias?

I have some NOS Amps lying around (~ 2008 or earlier), maybe I should look at this again.

Mind you, a friend had an older Silver Chassis Shiva that was an awesome Amp.

:beer
I don’t recall the years of the two Shivas, but they both were silver backs. My non reverb model had Wing C power tubes, I don’t remember what his had. However, we both talk about it to this day as the difference was distinct. He recently bought a silver back non reverb shiva that needs new capacitors. He got me thinking about getting a 20th anniversary as I loved my old shiva.
 

Stormin

Tele's and Plexis
Messages
4,123
I gigged a silver-back EL34 NR Shiva that had a factory variable boost mod for about 10 years. Prolly did 350 gigs with it. The original amps are definitely less flexible, but absolute tonal beasts. I made the special cable and always used a TC Nova Reverb in the loop. That would be my recommendation. Add a way and OD pedal up front and that’s all you need.

The 20th would be next, but it’s definitely a different animal - more modern sounding. It has way more tonal options, but I never thought they were as raw as the originals.

This was my rig: the open back cab for at home and an OS 2x12 for gigs.

 




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