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Celestions>>Scumbacks: Worth the switch?

TubeStack

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,292
So, I've had a Scumback M75 (65W) in my Traynor DarkHorse 1x12 cab for a few days now, and I gotta say... I FREAKING LOVE IT! :) :) :)

It was WELL worth the switch from the stock Celestion G12M-25 Greenback RI - I absolutely love the sound of the M75 and it's a dramatic difference from the GB RI. For me, it's a huge step forward.

This M75 is honestly the greatest guitar speaker I've ever heard, for my sound. I just keep playing for hours and hours, reveling in pure tonal bliss. No exaggeration, this has been one of those "quantum leaps" in tone, for me

I'm now on a mission to immediately replace the Celestions in my Z Best with Scumbacks (H75 is on its way, currently looking for an M75). I'm also planning, in the future, to gradually swap over the Greenbacks in my Hughes & Kettner 4x12.

Thanks for making such incredibly wonderful speakers, Jim! Love 'em. :beer
 

se7en

Senior Member
Messages
366
So, I've had a Scumback M75 (65W) in my Traynor DarkHorse 1x12 cab for a few days now, and I gotta say... I FREAKING LOVE IT! :) :) :)

It was WELL worth the switch from the stock Celestion G12M-25 Greenback RI - I absolutely love the sound of the M75 and it's a dramatic difference from the GB RI. For me, it's a huge step forward.

This M75 is honestly the greatest guitar speaker I've ever heard, for my sound. I just keep playing for hours and hours, reveling in pure tonal bliss. No exaggeration, this has been one of those "quantum leaps" in tone, for me

I'm now on a mission to immediately replace the Celestions in my Z Best with Scumbacks (H75 is on its way, currently looking for an M75). I'm also planning, in the future, to gradually swap over the Greenbacks in my Hughes & Kettner 4x12.

Thanks for making such incredibly wonderful speakers, Jim! Love 'em. :beer
Hey man, what do you like so much about the M75 over Celestions? I'm thinking of upgrading from my V30/H30 cab.
 

TubeStack

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,292
Hey man, what do you like so much about the M75 over Celestions?
Well, hard to describe, but the words "sweeter" and "warmer" come to mind. Also has more of a "brown sound" vibe to it, in general.

Everything that is harsh and piercing in the Celestion is sweet and warm in the Scumback. There's an upper-mid sharpness to the GB RIs that never goes away, at least hasn't with any of mine, some of which now have 20+ hours of break-in on them. And there's kind of a crinkling-paper, crackly thing in their breakup. There's none of that in the Scumback.

Also, the Scumback has much richer mids - just a wider, deeper, more complex mid thing in general, and better, more musical breakup. And it's more 3D-sounding, even with a single speaker. Just huge. The GB that was replaced by the M75 sounded thin, tight, and small in comparison. Both these speakers are around the same level of break-in, which is not a lot - they're basically new.

I think the GB RIs are voiced to be more of a modern, agressive, cutting speaker, with less of a sweet, warm vintage vibe, the former of which may suit some better, but not me. I've even waited out the honeymoon period before posting this, wanted to give it a few days, but nothing has changed - I'm still absolutely smitten with this M75. :)
 

TubeStack

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,292
Okay, interesting development with my Z Best 2x12: I replaced the 70th Anniv G12H30 with a Scumback H75, but left in the Celestion G12M Greenback RI.

The cab sounds great!

The H75 smooths out whatever harshness the GB RI has, while the GB RI give the H75 a nice amount of cut and slice. (Side note: this GB RI is a lot more broken-in than the one in my 1x12 was.) The GB RI and H75 actually blend together really nicely, way better than with the G12H. I always felt I could hear the cleanness of the G12H too much, and it overrode/dominated over the GB RI's breakup, but with the H75 it's harder to tell where one speaker ends and the other begins. This seems to be due to their complementary voicing, but is also helped by the GB RI/H75 being closer in sensitivity than the GB RI/G12HM (98/99 dB as opposed to 98/100 dB). The H75 also has richer mids than the G12H, which blends and gives depth to the mids of the GB RI.

The G12H did have a bigger bottom end than the H75 - there's a noticeable drop in low-end chunk, as well as less sparkly-clean highs. But the overall payoff of a richer, warmer, crunchier tone is well worth it (and I found the highs of the G12H annoying, anyways.)

I'm not in a hurry to replace the G12M Greenback RI in this Z Best cab at all, anymore. Loving its sound right now. The G12M/H75 mix is a very cool thing.
 
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ski_fast

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
1,269
This is a great thread. I am going to make a change to my Mojave 2x12 cab. It currently has two G12H30's and I want to mix things up. On hand I have a Celestion greenback and an alnico blue. So after reading this thread I could go:

G12H30/greenback
G12H30/alnico
Greenback/alnico
Greenback/ order a Scumback H75

Wattage isn't an issue.. I run 33 cathode biased watts maximum. I usually run two 6V6's which are around 20 watts maybe. Classic rock type tones, nothing too extreme.

The nice advantage also seems to be you have a choice which speaker to mike. Are you miking that Z cab? If so which speaker are you miking?

I think Pete Thorn likes those H75 also?
 

Scumback Speakers

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
10,797
If you have patience the ice pick in the Anni will dissappear. Bob
At what point did you think guitar player GAS and patience were going to work well together? ;)

Sorry, I couldn't resist, as I've been there with speaker break in, too. Waiting just sucks.
 

Laplacian

Member
Messages
469
Ski fast, I tried the Scumnico, H75 and M75 all 65w all broken in in a mojave 2x12 (slot back) that I have. Scumnico and H75 both sound good. M75 is way bright in that cab in my opinion. I swapped it in and out a couple times to make sure, alo tried mixes. For that cab, I would either go with a Scumnico/H75 mix or just H75's. Based on your thoughts.

FWIW, I'm actually going to try 2 30w Scumnico's in the Mojave 2x12, next.
 

Scumback Speakers

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
10,797
Ski fast, I tried the Scumnico, H75 and M75 all 65w all broken in in a mojave 2x12 (slot back) that I have. Scumnico and H75 both sound good. M75 is way bright in that cab in my opinion. I swapped it in and out a couple times to make sure, alo tried mixes. For that cab, I would either go with a Scumnico/H75 mix or just H75's. Based on your thoughts.

FWIW, I'm actually going to try 2 30w Scumnico's in the Mojave 2x12, next.
An M75 was bright in that cab? Very odd, it should have been darker. When an M75 sounds bright I usually find I've accidentally wired a speaker out of phase, or the speaker mounting bolts were over-tightened which can cause a speaker frame to warp slightly and cause a bright tone.
 

rockon1

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
12,774
At what point did you think guitar player GAS and patience were going to work well together? ;)

Sorry, I couldn't resist, as I've been there with speaker break in, too. Waiting just sucks.
Tell me about it! If I was the type that actually sold stuff like speakers they probably would have been long gone a few times. Im really glad I was pesistant and tried them on and off and in combination with other speakers. One day I tried one alone and realised it had totally changed. One of my favorite speakers now and tough as nails for a 30 watter to boot! Bob
 

rockon1

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
12,774
Break in your speakers before spending more $$ and those spikey highs may not sound too nice, but sometimes that's what you need in your mix to help with articulation. Sometimes dark and warm sounding gear will not be a articulate or responsive as the brighter stuff....everything is a trade-off.

But....Scumbacks nail ZZ Top, especially with a JMP. :dude
Those spikey highs will be a memory after 100 hours. The speaker truely transforms,well at least the two I have did. Every Celestion Ive owned needed a good bit of time to break in (at volume) some more than others like the Anni.I wonder if a speaker that sounds "right" out of the boxy will sound too mellow or muxshy after a few 100 hours...... Im betting my anni's will sound great for a long time now after that looonnngg break in period....of course who knows....just speculation ....
 

908SSP

Member
Messages
5,801
So I got this M75.
I had a Peavy Scorpion in my amp that actually sounded pretty cool. I put the M75 in. Very thin, bright, and quiet. Papery crinkle noise every now and then. I put the Scorpion back in and everything sounds fine.
Either this speaker doesn't sound like what I thought or I just got screwed on teh ebayZ.
Totally out of character for a Scumback. You got screwed on teh ebayz [whatever that means].
 

TubeStack

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,292
Revisiting this topic: I just bought an 8 year old Marshall 1960bx cab, looks like it's seen a lot of gigs, and it has fully worked-in Greenback RIs in it. These speakers sound f*cking great! What a difference a complete break-in process does, holy cow.
 




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