Comparisson: Avatar 2x12 vs Bogner oversized 2x12

[kingsxman]

I know, I know....there probably IS no comparison. However, I own an Avatar 2x12 (V30 and GH30). It's ok...and does the trick...but I'm wondering if its worth the upgrade to a Bogner 2x12. I'm looking for just a larger dispersion in front with better overall sound and easier to hear. I currently tilt my avatar back about 2 inches off the ground in front to hear it better...

Anyone had one and switched to the other?

On the downside were talking about a weight difference of over 30 lbs!!! ouch.

Thanks
-Jeff


PS. I dont want to go the 4x12 route.

 

[r9player]

Could try a detuned 1x12 I find they disperse well, but they do dramatically increase low end.

 

[sws1]

Not sure about the Avatar, but the baffle on the Bogner is slanted upwards, so it is pointing a bit more towards your head when playing with it.

I love mine.

 

[kingsxman]

Yeah, the Avatar isnt angled at all, so thats a definite plus for the Bogner.

 

[drbob1]

Originally posted by kingsxman
Yeah, the Avatar isnt angled at all, so thats a definite plus for the Bogner.

Or you could invest in an 18" piece of 1X2 to tilt the cab up a bit. Wait, no, this is the GEAR page, can't have a low tech solution

 

[kingsxman]

Dr. Bob....how dare you suggest something that doesnt cost a fortune! That is sacriligeous on these pages.

Seriously, what I actually do now is to take 2 small kids blocks (you know, the kind with letters on them that baby's play with) and put them under the front of the cab. It tilts it up about 2 inches. helps quite a bit. I'd probably still do that with the Bogner unless the dispersion was so good that I woudnt need to.

My history of cabs is that I had a Marshall 1936 (particle board) before the Avatar. That was closed back and had such a laser beam dispersion pattern that I litterally couldnt hear the amp on stage no matter what I did. The Avatar was a pretty big step up as far as that goes with the partial open back. I really just want to know if the Bogner offers a big enough upgrade in sound over the Avatar to justify spending $350 to upgrade from Avatar to Bogner. My thinking is that the Bogner is kind of the "Creme De Le Creme" of cabs and no matter what head I threw with it it'd be good. Not nuts about adding so much extra weight however to the equation...but for good tone...I'd do it.

 

[devbro]

Love my Bogner OS. I can hear myself much better on stage than my Mesa 2x12 Recto.

Just wish the casters were a little more heavy duty.....

 

[kingsxman]

I've head the casters arent anything to write home about...which is unfortunate being as how much you pay for this cab.
Is the amp so heavy that you really need the casters?

 

[Sharkey]

I have both. 1st off the Govener loaded 2x12 Avatar open back cab is a great bang 4 ya buck cab as you allready know. The Bogner OS 2x12 with V-30's is the best I have played too date. Sounds bigger than most 4x12's I have played through. Funny thing is I didn't think I would like the V-30's but they sound great with my XTC. The casters are crap!!! But the tone is Heavenly

 

[kingsxman]

Sharky, thanks. My Avtar has a vin30 and a GH30 in it. Would you say that you can definitely hear yourself better with the Bogner over the Avatar? Much better dispersion?

How about portability comparison?

I'm just trying to decide if its worth the extra green to make the switch... I currently am playing with a Marshall JCM 800 2205 but I just purchased a Budda SD30. (Arrives tomorrow!) I will need to decide which amp to keep....and spending a bunch extra on a cab if its only a slight upgrade would be tough.

 

[casazera]

Hi Kingsxman,

Have you considered a Tone-Tools 2x12?
It may solve some or all of the issues.
I usually stay on the side lines but....well just check it out before you decide.

Best of Luck.


http://tone-tools.com/

 

[kingsxman]

Cas, I checked it out. Stunning looking cabs. I didnt see anything there that seemed to be a replica of the Bogner cab. Do you know if there would be something that would be similar?

 

[ixsaves13]

If you're looking for a cab that has the dispersion and tone of the oversized Bogner 2x12 I think you should get that one. Since you have experience with that particular one, you're taking a lot more risk testing out another one(buying). Through all my gear aquistion, i've learned that if your heart is set on a particular piece of gear, your level of satisfaction will never be met until you get that specific piece. i know others may disagree, as they have gone off the whim and took a chance on a new piece of gear, but better safe than sorry.

I am particularly tired of hoping that this next piece of gear will be the end all. All i know now is when you find something that works with your setup, use that.

Hope this helps,

Eugene

 

[jockman]

Please excuse my ignorance here, but what is a "deTuned" 1x12 cab?
Also, what differance does a ported cab make to the overall sound? I have seen a 2x12 cab with 2 port hole things, does this give better disspersion and bass response?

Jon

 

[kingsxman]

Thanks IX, actually..thats my problem: I have NO experience with the Bogner...hence all the questions. I started this pursuit purely on what I've heard....which has been that they are like a 4x12 in a 2x12 body. It sounds like thats the case.

 

[riffmeister]

Originally posted by drbob1
Or you could invest in an 18" piece of 1X2 to tilt the cab up a bit. Wait, no, this is the GEAR page, can't have a low tech solution

hey man, it all depends what kind of rare rainforest tonewood you use, it makes all the difference in the world for the sound, ya know.....

 

[tonedaddy]

Originally posted by jockman
Please excuse my ignorance here, but what is a "deTuned" 1x12 cab?
Also, what differance does a ported cab make to the overall sound? I have seen a 2x12 cab with 2 port hole things, does this give better disspersion and bass response?

Jon

From the Mad Sound Cabs website:
http://www.madsound.com/process.htm

"In his book, "DIY Speaker Cabinets for Musical Instrument Applications", Kevin O'Connor of London Power describes the ideal speaker cabinet. This design uses baffle diffusers and a detuned port to achieve the optimum balance of air, punch and spread. The result is phenomenal; a single cabinet that optimizes the sound of any speaker and maximizes the gear's performance for any guitarist's style. Whether it's metal, country, grunge, punk, classic rock, acoustic, Motown, jazz, or any combination thereof, the detuned cabinet delivers what no other design can, anywhere you put it; the richest amplified guitar sound on Earth."


From the Vintone website:
http://www.vintone.com/detuned.html

'DETUNED' SOLUTION
"What's the best cabinet design? Something between a large sealed cabinet and a slightly smaller but still large bass reflex design: a "detuned" cabinet with a single driver. This is essentially a cabinet built for two identical drivers with one driver left out and it's mounting hole left open. The port is not tuned to any specific frequency but instead allows a broad range of frequencies to be reversed through the shallow duct. Instead of having a brick-wall bass roll-off, the low end rolls off gradually but slightly slower than the raw driver. The large cabinet does not sound boxey so mids and highs sound three dimensional, unlike a sealed cabinet which sounds comparatively sterile. We sometimes call this an "open-front" design since it is like having an open-back cabinet where you bring along your own wall. The closed back gives consistent sound regardless of room placement; therefore the port cannot be on the back. The only caveat is one that applies to every other design: that elevating the cabinet seriously reduces low frequency output, so -always leave it on the floor."

From the book 'LONDON POWER DIY Speaker Cabinets for Musical Instrument Applications' by Kevin O'Connor:
http://www.londonpower.com/books/spkr.htm

 

[Sharkey]

Kingsxman,
The only drawback about the Bogner is the portabilty. It's big & bulkey and has poor quality caster's. But for the tone of this cab I will deal with these issues. As far as sound dispersion, my Bogner cuts very well . We have two guitars a Keyboard player and a very loud drumer. Hope this helps

 

[kingsxman]

Sharky, thats the exact config of my band. Stage noise gets very loud..but you cant turn up because sound guy gets on you. Plus..that just adds to the volume wars. Its just key to be able to hear yourself.

THanks.

 

[vanborgen]

Just so you are aware, Germino makes probably the best sounding 2x12 cab I have ever heard. I'd say that if you are considering the bogner, you should also consider the Germino....top shelf build quality, custom colors available and reasonably priced for what you get!!

www.germinoamps.com