Could Someone Please Explain..

Discussion in 'Amps/Cabs Tech Corner: Amplifier, Cab & Speakers' started by Bloozman, Feb 18, 2009.


  1. Bloozman

    Bloozman Member

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    Im going to be in the market for a Fender Tweed Vintage repro from one of the boutique amp makers. This may be a lot to ask, but could someone lise the different type of tweed replica chassis that were made by Fender and are being reproduced today?
    I get confused when amp makers use terms like "super" chassis, "5E3", "5E7" chassis etc, and I'd like to know how each one differs. If someone could explain that to me, or give me a link to a site that explains it??..Thanks in advance Bloozman
     
  2. mbratch

    mbratch Member

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    For starters, there are different amp platform names, and then the chassis/circuit "number". The names are things like Pro, Deluxe, Super, Tremolux, etc. The numbers are 5E3, 5E7, etc (not in that order). Deluxe, for example, happens to be 5E3.

    You'll also see different letters. These are older or newer designs. So 5E3 is the last of the Deluxe tweeds. The prior version of their Deluxe tweed was 5D3, etc.
     
  3. wyatt

    wyatt Member

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    The 5 is nearly universal for tweed circuits, and the Letter is the circuit, Leo started with A and worked his way up, most Tweed clones are of E or F models, which were the last models of most and came in the narrow-panel cabinets, they have the most headroom and gain. Some also offer earlier octal preamp versions, like the C series circuits. The third digit is the amp model:

    1 = Champion or Champ
    2 = Princeton
    3 = Deluxe
    4 = Super
    5 = Pro
    6 = Bassman
    7 = Bandmaster
    8 = Twin
    9 = Tremolux
    10 = Harvard
    11 = Vibrolux
    12 = Concert
    13 = Vibrasonic
    14 = Showman
    15 = Outboard Reverb Unit of the Pre-CBS Period
    16 = Vibroverb

    Each has a different power output/speaker configuration. Some had their own pre-/poweramp designs as well.

    With this, you can do some of your own research at:

    http://www.ampwares.com/fender.asp
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2009
  4. Bloozman

    Bloozman Member

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    Damn...This is confusing..I have some reading to do...Thanks
     
  5. phsyconoodler

    phsyconoodler Member

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    Just go to www.schematicheaven.com and look up the fender amp you want to know about.It has a layout and schematic that tells you what controls there are,what tubes it uses and the number designations.
     
  6. wyatt

    wyatt Member

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    I'll simplify some:

    5F1 Champ - small 5W option. This is a great all-around option for people who don't play out on stage. A favorite amp for recording.

    5E3 Deluxe - A favorite and it's popular has surged in the last 5 years or so. 12 watts. It breaks up early, not audible until 2 on the dial, starts to break up around 3, great fat clean tone, but after 3 or so, you're just dialing in more saturation. The unused Volume can be used to dial in a little more or less midrange. A dark amp to begin with, so most people keep the Tone turned up pretty high.

    Both of these are small, usually options for people who don't play out a lot. You can gig with a dirty 5E3, especially if it's propped up on chair or stand. These amps have a nice warm, middy clean tone, and then break up in a loose, undefined, unfocused organic distortion.

    5F6A Bassman, the '59 Bassman. Big, warm, good cleans loud. Good, tweed breakup, but is tighter and more definied than the lower amps. The basis for the marshall JTM-45. Imagine a JTM-45 with a cleaner, brighter tone. These amps introoduced Presence to get more highs, and in generally can be fat and round yet still nice and defined.

    5E7 Bandmaster. Used to be more popular a decade or so ago. Low output and a less refined sounding than the Bassman. A sort of inbetween amp between the rawer tone of earlier Tweeds and the tighter Bassman.

    For years, the four above amps were the mainstays of the Tweed repro world. Then the Tweed Twins became popular. These are offered in lower and higher output versions. The lower output version is most similar to the Bassman, but in a 2x12 form. The higher-output Twin is for clean headroom, which isn't often what people want form Tweeds, so they seem less popular.

    The Super and Pro's are pretty much the same amp as the Bandmaster in different speaker configurations, both seem far les popular than the Bandmaster, but offer different weight and size options.

    Vibrolux and Tremulux's are off-shoots of the other small Tweeds, these seem cloned less often, as is the Princeton, which was kind of a more versatile Champ in the Tweed days, and the Harvard, which was more of the halfway point between the Champ and Deluxe that the Princeton would fill in the Brownface and later years.
     
  7. Bloozman

    Bloozman Member

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    Wyatt. Thanks a lot. You really simplified it for me. Again Thanks!!

    Im looking for someting around 30 watts, that will break up around 5 or so. I was recommenbed to the 35210 from Victoria. I like the 10" speakers better than 12's they're not so boomy with an old archtop with P-90's or P-13's. I asked about the 35310, and was told its pretty much the same amp with an extra speaker and it will be louder which I dont want
    I really wish someone made a 20-25 watt amp with 10's in it. maybe the Victorilux?
     
  8. Bloozman

    Bloozman Member

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    Thanks..Great Link!!!
     
  9. phsyconoodler

    phsyconoodler Member

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    Here's a picture of a pair of 30 watt amps I build with a 12" and an 8" speaker.Sound great with hollow body guitars.
    This exact look is not available anymore.
    [​IMG]



    They are called 'Rebel Rouser' and have trem and reverb too.As I said,this 'look' is not available from me anymore
     
  10. wyatt

    wyatt Member

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    Well,the 35210 is the Super, 35310 is the Bandmaster.

    Yeah, Fender had a bit of a void in between 15 watts or so and 35 watts in the Tweed years.
     
  11. TweeDLX

    TweeDLX Member

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    While it's not a Tweed clone, I'd like to recommend the Allen Accomplice. 25 watts with 6V6's and 30 watts with 6L6's. Has a "raw" control which can dial in a real "tweedy" tone, tube reverb, and a master volume to dial in breakup at lower volumes. Starts breaking up around 5. Can be ordered as a kit or pre-assembled, head, 1x12 combo, or in any speaker configuration you desire. I'm loving mine.
    http://www.allenamps.com/accomplice.php

    Mike
     
  12. wyatt

    wyatt Member

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    I have one too. Actually, I just modded to to be closer the Fender tone (thank you all at TGP for the threads on it).

    I don't think the RAW control really gives it a Tweed sound because it keeps the tighter power amp. If anything it makes it ...RAWer. But it also dumps your tone controls, the nice thong about Tweed Supers is tyou can still dial in a few more sounds.

    I had consider recommending a Brownface Fender depending on what kinda tones he wanted out of those archtops.
     
  13. Trout

    Trout Member

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    I test drove one of these, pretty much as tweed as it gets and covers the 2 X 10 - 30W range well.

    Great breakup at around 6, but damn loud as well.
    http://cgi.ebay.com/Richter-Supra-Luxe-Signature-Series-35W-Tweed-5E3_W0QQitemZ120380718038

    These are very raw basic amps, all of the charm of the low power version.
     
  14. Swarty

    Swarty Member

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    Dang, those are cool looking! Sort of like art deco meets the Jetsons. :drool
     
  15. drgonzoguitar

    drgonzoguitar Member

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    Very cool!
     
  16. Bloozman

    Bloozman Member

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    How bout some audio clips?

    Also, I know the Tone King Imperial isnt a tweed clone, but I hear that it's a great amp (20 watts). Plus, they just came out with the Metropolitan (40 watts) which has a built in attentuater like device that allows you to keep your tone even at bedroom levels. Anyone know anything about them??
     
  17. Brewmaster

    Brewmaster Member

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