cryo treated tubes?

Discussion in 'Amps/Cabs Tech Corner: Amplifier, Cab & Speakers' started by Axemeister, Mar 14, 2008.

  1. Axemeister

    Axemeister Member

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    I am trying to sort out hype from truth: so is their any validity the claims of benefits with Cryoset or cryogenically treated tubes?
     
  2. rockon1

    rockon1 Member

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    How would I know if they have actually been cryo treated? Bob
     
  3. Axemeister

    Axemeister Member

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    There is a company marketing Cryo Treated tubes under the name of Cryoset.
     
  4. rockon1

    rockon1 Member

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    I realise that but just say a batch slipped thru without being treated- how would you know? bob
     
  5. III

    III Member

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    Haha... I'm skeptical too, but you could get the same brand tube and compare it to the "cryo" dipped tube.
     
  6. AndyT

    AndyT Member

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    Having been an aerospace engineer before I quit to be a full time musician (best move I ever made), but not a metallurgist, I can say that from my view I don't buy into the hype. Cryogenic treatment is simply deep freezing the part to realign the molecules, The effect is to stabilize it and make it more durable. They use this for metal cutting tools and drill bits. It does seem to help.

    In the case of a tube, it goes through thousands of hot and cold cycles. Tubes tend to fail because they lose vacuum or simply cook and break the internal components. IMO no amount of freezing will stop vacuum loss or wear on the internal metal parts. You could argue that the process will make the metal in the tube more stable and less likely to "tweak" when heated, but.....

    You can buy pickups from a company that are cryogenically treated. They claim it makes them less harsh. Hogwash, the Tele pickups I bought were like spikes in the ears! I bought the pickups because I was ordering parts and needed some, not because I thought they would be better. I wind my own Tele pickups now and they sound great without freezing them.

    Comparing 2 tubes is like comparing two puppies form the same litter. No 2 are alike. hehe

    Anyone else?
     
  7. Blue Strat

    Blue Strat Member

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    Even if it "works", since no two people agree on what sounds better in anything regarding tone, how could anyone possibly claim that cryo tubes sound "better"?
     
  8. The Pup

    The Pup Supporting Member

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    Hyperbole ad infinitum
     
  9. Lex Luthier

    Lex Luthier Member

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    Sounds like more of that high end audiophile BS creeping into the guitar world.
     
  10. uberpict

    uberpict Member

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    There is one thing that it may do; the ones that don't crack when put under near liquid nitrogen temperatures (<-300°F) may not crack as bad in use. Glass gets super brittle at those temperatures so if they hold their vacuum after getting frozen they may last longer in use. Glass doesn't have a grain structure so if they are annealed properly to begin with I don't see it changing the glass. I'm as skeptical as you guys, seems more of a marketing tool than a value added process.
     
  11. Blue Strat

    Blue Strat Member

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    I've had customers tell me that they hear the difference. I'm not going to comment on something I haven't heard but since there's no consensus on what sounds best......
     
  12. fyrwyr

    fyrwyr Member

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    This is a good time to add my experience for what it's worth...

    Over the last 5 years I have experimented with Dynamic Thermal Tempering which is a more effective way to treat materials than simple Cryogenics. I have "treated" Cables, tubes, speakers, pickups, pedals, transformers, switches, jacks and hookup wire. I learned some good and sometimes hard lessons along the way for sure.

    The cables I treated in conjunction with Tony at Evidence Audio had some of the most noticeable changes, we did blind testing and both of us had the same test results, the treated cables were noticably brighter and louder. "Better" is up to the individual, if someone needs a brighter cable then they may say treating a cable is the best thing in the world, if someone has a bright enough sound already then they may say the process "stinks"; it is really just different and not always better with every rig.

    Pickups are pretty much the same. Treated pickups tend to have more bass response, not good for some neck humbuckers as I found out!! But for some bridge pickups and especially for bass, it was just what the doctor ordered-for ME that is.

    Speakers have glue that does not like the cold or heat whatsoever, trust me on this!

    I wrecked a vintage Ross Phaser in my haste to "improve" things, some parts literally explode when subjected to extreme temperatures:( I still have hopes of fixing it in the future...

    Transformers, jacks, switches and wire I still treat and long lengths of speaker cable I plan on doing as well, these things are worth it for better performance and/or longer life. Tubes I throw in occassionally just because I can, in one test it seemed to make a difference, (but it wasn't a perfect test situation so I may have fooled myself) plus they take up very little space in the tank... I agree with the vacuum of the tube being critical, that is where tube coolers really help, I use those on my power tubes, preamp tubes don't get hot enough to worry about.

    Hope this helps;)

    Bill
     
  13. fullerplast

    fullerplast Senior Member

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    Anybody that actually wants to experiment with it can do so pretty cheaply. You can cryo just about anything....it's like going to the dry cleaners; you pay by the pound. It does change things. Good or bad, worth it or not, I'll leave as an exercise to the experimenter.;)
     

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