Defeating the "Boss sound" (GT-1)

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by mertay, Aug 25, 2017.


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  1. bbgie1223

    bbgie1223 Supporting Member

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    I'll probably get the "why don't you just read the thread" comments on this. Has anyone tried running the Boss through IR's?
     
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  2. Justin Hitchborn

    Justin Hitchborn Supporting Member

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    Why don't you just read the thread?

    Kidding. I did see it get mentioned elsewhere. But then it gets mentioned for everything, including the high end units like the Axe and Helix.
     
  3. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    i've tried with ir's ,big difference but you can hear the low quality sound after all. What i want to say is that the digitech sounds better in mix and i'm continously experimenting with the gt-1. off course nothing sound so bad like the mooer ge200 lol
     
  4. mertay

    mertay Member

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    Though cab. sim.'s in gt-1 is discussed most, the previous topic on "preamp level" would also benefit ir users too. Also we shared experiences with which amp for analog pedals, the high-low knobs on the master out...I also shared how to match ir's by analyzing as the gt-1 has very strong eq'ing.

    So the tech isn't flawed, Katana amps success (even when line recording) proves this. I guess Boss left a bit too much room for users to explore/experiment so simply thats whats done here.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  5. sunkidd

    sunkidd Member

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    But, you can roll them in glitter!;)
     
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  6. bbgie1223

    bbgie1223 Supporting Member

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    Thanks. I'll check this out.
     
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  7. mertay

    mertay Member

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    To quickly round-up my experience;

    -Full-range amp did it for me to be used with my analog pedals (amp-in-box style pedals). I have 3 presets, each has different drive settings (from 30 to 70) and slightly different eq settings to get different headroom feels. The drive type in this amp is amazing for such use. The jc120 (but only with very low drive) is also usable.

    -Using voxengo span to match tones from albums or ir cab.s was more educational for me than expected. Like, in many cases the gt-1 turned out to be not muddy but unnaturally flat.

    -pelaomedinaese's advice on keeping the preamp levels low helped.

    -I never pass 100 on the gain of any amp (80 is usually good), if more distortion is needed use a pedal inside (gain low-output high) gt-1 as boost. The blues driver is the default pedal for me in gt-1, boosts and sounds great.

    I'll probably focus more on making presets that don't use my analog pedals from now on. Will share them here if I feel they're worth it.
     
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  8. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    upload some patches for us :)
     
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  9. mertay

    mertay Member

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    My current experience about cab.s in GT-1;

    Non-origin cab.s

    To my ears the ?x10 and ?x12 are the 2 main vibes in this family, the "?" (spr. number) is the amount of bass and/or low-mids. Need an upfront/in-your-face sound? go with x10's, need to sound deep or blend more in the mix? go with x12's. Or if you want some-what of an in between sound, select an x10 and lower the amps presence all the way down then slowly increase it.

    As a "shred lead guitarist" thats how I categorize them. Not about character (they lack character, leaves more of that job to the amp) but how the sound sits in the mix/song, and they work nice with this logic. For example, its very normal to use the 1x10 in a dense mix (bass will be lowered without affecting the mid or highs+no amp eq mangling...). So post eq them according to a mix or backing track if needed (like lowering 500hz with a wide q for example...).

    Origin cab.s

    I refer to them as cab.s cause seems each amp has its own origin cab. (?) and just guessing but if the gt-1's cab. section ever gets updated, probably they'll let us blend these cab.s with other amps...

    These are the cab.s that have character (you'll love or hate), when analyzed they look more complicated too. Chords, powerchords, traditional sounds (which needs lots of air)...these are the cab.s you'll want to mangle and dig deep. Definitely try to nail with amp eq's first but if not enough try post-graphic eq but keep in mind, if its still too far from what you want to hear you'll probably need to select a different but similar amp (to change that cab...)

    Unlike non-origin cabs, be prepared for peaking frequencies or boomy low-end with these cab.s (which can happen with ir cab.s too...), if you have some mixing experience the parametric eq in the gt-1 should be helpful.

    Edit; So if I were to start a recording project from scratch (modern rock for example...), origin cab.s would be my rhythm guitars and if I needed to add a cutting solo non-origin. Sure this is just a clue rather than a rule (might not need non-origins at all for probably jazz, country...) but to save time this is how I suggest when starting to experiment.
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2017
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  10. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    another really good chapter from mertay's laboratory :dude:aok
     
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  11. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    i've been experimenting too, and i can add a tip for some of you: i think that i found the method, the answer... if you are in the mixing world like me, then you know that a impulse response is a eq shape from famous cabinets, "eq shape" is the important word, at this point you know that the cabinet section in gt-1 are basically impulses, i tried eq match using impulses and stock cabinets adding an parametric eq to shape the tone so... what i found is that the boss cabs eq shape collide with the eq match, basically means that you can't achieve a good final result also because the eq section is limited in this unit... so resuming i've been experimenting with the fallowing settings:

    1_ choose a preamp that you like but deactivate the cab simulation
    2_ after the preamp add a parametric eq and turn to -20 the low-mid gain at 20khz and the mid-high in 10hz and Q to 0 these knobs acts as a low and high cut
    3_ after that add graphic eq after tha parametric eq and adjust your tone as you want
    4_ in the master section cut the hiss (because in the gt-1 you don't have low and high cuts), this is a subjective parameter so you can tweak at your taste

    basically what we did is create a impulse response for your tone because the stock cabs add some frequencies that we can't erase.

    This method work me really well in high gain tones, i achieve a really bright and fresh tone, remember that boss high gain tones sound like the 80's hehe. So like many others said the boss problem are the cabinet simulations
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
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  12. mertay

    mertay Member

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    I can't remember the name, but there was a guitar channel on youtube where someone used an mxr 10 band to simulate cab.s.

    Various distortion pedals were demoed as if they were preamps, he used the mxr so there was no amp coloration when demoing which to me was very smart. I'll add a link if I can find it again.
     
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  13. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    Here's an example with the method that i mention above, i only add a high and low pass because is a mix. PD: I'm not really good mixing so, if you can... enjoy
     
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  14. stratcat1980

    stratcat1980 Member

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    sorry but thaT examples shows me nothing of how the tone is so different. I mean in a mix it sounds like any other modeler/amp tone to me.
     
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  15. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    that's gt-1 then, maybe you are not for cheap modellers because with ir's sounds the same. Compare it with any demo in youtube, the stock cabs add bad frequencies (high mids and low mids that even matching eq cannot resolve) i will upload the examples
     
  16. stratcat1980

    stratcat1980 Member

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    i have and use a gt-1 and think its fine in many ways.I just didnt think that that tone and song example was very good. Sorry but maybe its the tones i enjoy in the gt-1 like the bluesy just breaking up stuff i prefer.
     
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  17. mertay

    mertay Member

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    Aside the awesome playing I liked the example, cause when the tone suits and reminds the genre then the device to me is successful. But more importantly pelaomedinaese found his way of dialing tones he's hearing in his head rather than relying on whats available in there.

    I had a chat last week with 2 semi-pro electronica guys. One of them told me he had 1000's of loops and almost never used a vsti synth. and that was mind blowing for me. There is no right or wrong on making tones/music but while some guys work with whats given to them others prefer to craft.
     
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  18. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    here's a decent comparative my method is in between ir and stock cab hehe
     
  19. pelaomedinaese

    pelaomedinaese Member

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    i really love bluesy tones and mostly crunchy tones i will post demo of that
     
  20. jayman

    jayman Member

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    I prefer the 3Sigma by far. Fingers crossed that Boss decides to release a firmware update with IR loading for the GT-1.
     
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