Deluxe Memory Man Question

Jess 1971

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
4,453
I am considering adding a DMM XO to my pedalboard, but I have a few questions I was hoping someone could help with. My amps (a Marshall JCM800 and a Friedman DS40 [Plexi]) are generally run pretty dirty, so I have always placed my delays in the effects loop. I have read a few people suggest that a DMM should really only be used in front of the amp and not in the loop. I've generally never really liked the sound of delay out front, largely because tend to play pretty dirty. If I get a DMM, am I heading for a bad time, or is it ok to run these in the effects loop?

There seems to be a lot of discussion on how to power the DMM XO. Do I need to use a dedicated wall wart, or can I power it off a dedicated pedalboard power supply like a Cioks unit with a 24v output with 100mA?
 

Grendel2000

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
1,798
The expansion outlet on the Cioks works great for a DMM XO if you grab the adapter (24v lead - green tip). I run my XO downstream/after a Kingsley Constable (JTM/Plexi) so it's more or less like having it in the loop - can't help you with the FOA question, sorry.
 

analogmike

Vendor
Messages
7,330
DMM does not have much headroom (though it can be increased with mods) so it does not work well in many effects loops.

Guitar pedals are designed to work at low level signals like the output from a normal guitar pickup. A line level (keyboard, pro audio, or effects loop) level will often overload a guitar pedal.

Most effects pedals do not work well in an amp's effects loop, unless the loop has SEND and RETURN level controls. With those controls, you can lower the signal to match what a stompbox expects to see.

If there are no controls, the loop is probably meant for line-level rack effects units.
If your loop does work well with effects pedals, the ones you might want to put in the loop are delays and maybe other delay based effects like reverb or chorus. Most other pedals will sound better before the amp.

If you use amplifier distortion then a delay will sound and work better in your effects loop. But if you use effects pedals for distortion, you can put delays at the end of your pedalboard.

There are pedals available that will convert a signal to/from line/guitar level, if you really want to use guitar pedals in a line level loop.

Hope that helps!
 

Tiny Montgomery

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,277
I should add that my big box is AM modded, but both trimmers are set to the AM-marked settings. I can’t remember if that’s less than stock or not.

I don’t use that amp as often as my modded sf bassman I run into the front end of, but I don’t remember having any issues with it when I have. If I weren’t out of town right now, I’d double check.
 

Jess 1971

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
4,453
DMM does not have much headroom (though it can be increased with mods) so it does not work well in many effects loops.

Guitar pedals are designed to work at low level signals like the output from a normal guitar pickup. A line level (keyboard, pro audio, or effects loop) level will often overload a guitar pedal.

Most effects pedals do not work well in an amp's effects loop, unless the loop has SEND and RETURN level controls. With those controls, you can lower the signal to match what a stompbox expects to see.

If there are no controls, the loop is probably meant for line-level rack effects units.
If your loop does work well with effects pedals, the ones you might want to put in the loop are delays and maybe other delay based effects like reverb or chorus. Most other pedals will sound better before the amp.

If you use amplifier distortion then a delay will sound and work better in your effects loop. But if you use effects pedals for distortion, you can put delays at the end of your pedalboard.

There are pedals available that will convert a signal to/from line/guitar level, if you really want to use guitar pedals in a line level loop.

Hope that helps!
This is super helpful. Thanks, Mike.

I'm currently using a Source Audio Ventris reverb and a Diamond Memory Lane Jr. in the effects loop of my Friedman DS40, and they both sound great. The Friedman does not have a control to adjust the level of the signal in the effects loop, but since these two pedals sound great in the loop, can I therefore assume the DMM will sound good in the loop as well?
 

analogmike

Vendor
Messages
7,330
This is super helpful. Thanks, Mike.

I'm currently using a Source Audio Ventris reverb and a Diamond Memory Lane Jr. in the effects loop of my Friedman DS40, and they both sound great. The Friedman does not have a control to adjust the level of the signal in the effects loop, but since these two pedals sound great in the loop, can I therefore assume the DMM will sound good in the loop as well?

Hard to say, those pedals probably have a lot more headroom. Good luck!
 

Jess 1971

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
4,453
So I ordered a DMM XO. (Yay!) Anyway, I've decided to keep my digital delay on my board and continue running it through the effects loop, and I will place the DMM out in front of the amp. That said, where out front should it reside? Should it be the last pedal in the chain (i.e., after overdrives, fuzzes, and compressor)? Again, I tend to play with my amps already cooking, with the ODs meant to push them over the top. So will the DMM sound ok between ODs and the amp?

I do plan to experiment a bit with placement once the DMM arrives, but just doing some pedalboard mapping now to see what's feasible.
 

John Mark Painter

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
14,287
So I ordered a DMM XO. (Yay!) Anyway, I've decided to keep my digital delay on my board and continue running it through the effects loop, and I will place the DMM out in front of the amp. That said, where out front should it reside? Should it be the last pedal in the chain (i.e., after overdrives, fuzzes, and compressor)? Again, I tend to play with my amps already cooking, with the ODs meant to push them over the top. So will the DMM sound ok between ODs and the amp?

I do plan to experiment a bit with placement once the DMM arrives, but just doing some pedalboard mapping now to see what's feasible.
Last
 

Guppie

Member
Messages
1,724
The downside to placing the delay in front of your drive/fuzz pedals is that it can create total mayhem because the delays will be compressed overdriven. The upside is that it can create total mayhem because the delays will be compressed overdriven.
It's a matter of taste, function and style of playing. In my effect chain I always keep a muff style pedal after my reverb and delay specifically for this purpose (into a clean Bassman). It's a cascading and resonating wall of sound.
 

Jess 1971

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
4,453
There are no rules Jess! I like tame impala and incubus, for me it goes second after my phaser and before fuzz! :)
Understood. I will absolutely tinker with placement once I have everything in hand. I'm just new to the DMM and to using delays in front of the amp, so I was a little unsure and wanted to know if there is a more widely understood approach. I've historically only used digital delays, which I run through the effects loop, so this is a whole new setup for me.

Anyway, thanks for the feedback.
 

Cosmo-D

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
10,326
I have always run my 2000's DMM Big Box in my exf loop with no issues. The overload light is always on when I play, but sonically it still sounds great. It sounds even better since I had AM mod it. :) I just don't like delays in front of dirty amps but it's easy enough to experiment with both.
 

slowerhand

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
2,481
Could you destroy the pedal by feeding it too hot of a signal? Or is it just causing unpleasant distortion without damaging the pedal?
 




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