Digital Delay that Can Take High Gain (solved)

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by Abram4235, Aug 29, 2019.

  1. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Ok, so I have a Dunlop Echoplex that I like to use for longish delays. The 2 things i don't like about it are that the modulation is always on and that it has a harshness when I hit it with a high gain signal.

    I have tried:

    DM2W, Rubberneck - they both sound super dirty and uncontrollable when used with high gain. Very dark as well

    DD2 - sounds brighter than the bypassed signal, also very grainy when used after distortion, produces feedback as well (edited to add that I am returning this as I believe it was a bad unit and may revisit)

    Belle Epoch Deluxe, Boonar - great pedals but both preamps sound bad with my amp

    I have also tried all of these before my OD pedals and that solves the graininess issue but I cant use the same settings with clean and dirty sounds because of the signal level change. (Either too loud or not loud enough when I switch between clean and dirty).

    I think I want a digital delay but none I've tried so far have worked out. What say you TGP brethren?

    Gear is a strat through various Kingsley ODs into a Two Rock Traditional Clean 100w & 2x12 cab.

    Thanks!
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
  2. FokenBusker

    FokenBusker Member

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    I'm really surprised that you weren't able to do anything with the Belle Epoch Deluxe. The preamp knob always helped me out, and I stack my dirt going into it.

    I do find that my placement of the BED can affect its sound quality, for example, if I place it just before the front of the amp, I want a clean channel and a little bit more gain from the BED's preamp. If I have it in my FX loop, I still use my amp's clean channel but I dial back the BED's preamp a good bit, and sometimes turn up the amp's volume to compensate.

    I'd also be interested in hearing if there is a better option than the BED, as this was one of my main reasons for buying one.
     
  3. JosephZdyrski

    JosephZdyrski Member

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    How much gain are you talking when you say High Gain.

    I think there is a limit in general and if you’re using too much gain nothing will sound totally great.

    There a difference in running a great saturated tone and and simply blasting close to 100% gain on pedals and/or amps.
    The later rarely get good results (actually I never heard anyone sound good blasting near 100% gain) and the former tones are not as heavy on the gain as one may believe but are a combination of a lot of factors in most cases or just the right circuits running at moderate gain.

    Now I’m not saying saying you’re running too much gain but if you are that my be part of the problem.

    Another thing to keep in mind is if you want pristine perfect repeats... that’s not really possible with a gained out tone in the same way it’s possible with a clean tone.
     
  4. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    I hear you man. I really wanted to make that pedal work. I tried everything. I really liked the sound of the delay and even liked the preamp before ODs. It had it's own sound and was great before ODs but the signal level dropped too much when I switched to my clean sound. And when I put it after my ODs, I got this compressed mess of a sound that sounded like a blanket was over my amp. I would have kept it if the signal didn't drop with my cleans.

    Since then, I test every new pedal in a single true bypass loop so I know what the affect on the signal it. I'm not expecting no change in sound of course, but an obvious negative effect is a no go.
     
  5. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Yeah, not super high gain at all. I'm using an SSL5 with a Kingsley harlot with the gain at about half way. Which is not very saturated at all. It even happens with a Page pushed by a tubescreamer type pedal. I'm just thinking worse case scenario here.

    Also, I am willing to accept that there is no solution and I may just keep the Echoplex or go for a different digital delay without modulation and a say F it.
     
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  6. JosephZdyrski

    JosephZdyrski Member

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    Cool .... just was curious as high gain means very different things to different people.
     
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  7. mici

    mici Member

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    I'm really suprised that DD-2 does not work for you. I find all Boss compact digital delays work great with high gain tones - I've never, literally never ever experienced any harshness, muddiness, brightness.

    I've used DD-2, DD-3 and DD-6 for years with my Orange Rockerverb MK1, great lead-stuff delays!
     
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  8. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Do you think I could have gotten a bad unit? It was feeding back quite a bit. I had really high hopes for that one and on paper it made all the sense in the world. I just used it last night and it is the reason for this thread because I've thrown my hands in the air. Like "nothing works, I'm taking my ball and bat and going home".
     
  9. mici

    mici Member

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    It might have been a bad unit, although I must say I find 80s Boss pedals very sturdy. DD-2 works especially great with distortion and hi gain since the whole "long chip" thing. Its repeats are still quite bright, but they decay in a kind of analog manner, with certain warmth and softness.
     
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  10. chrisr0712

    chrisr0712 Member

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  11. ry-guy

    ry-guy Member

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    Maybe a Korg SDD 3000? Use some of the preamp gain from the delay and it might mesh with your gain more?
     
  12. ThinPaperWings

    ThinPaperWings Member

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    As others have said, I'm surprised some of these are not working for you.

    I wonder if some of the more expensive Japanese ones would work, like the Providence Chrono or Free the Tone Flight Time or Future Factory.

    Pigtronix Echolution 2 might be worth a look if you can try one or get one cheap. Runs at 18 volts and it's not the darkest delay but can't get very bright either.
     
  13. Slideman

    Slideman Member

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    I would have also suggested the DD-2. It works great with high gain. Also the Boss RE-20 handles high gain very well.
     
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  14. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

    I've contacted the seller for the DD2 I just got and he's agreed to a return. The pedal did the same thing for him but I guess he thought it was normal? Either way, I dont feel right moving the unit onto someone else if there was something wrong with it.

    I may buy the DD2 again. I have a sneaking suspicion that it was a bad unit, mainly because I'd hit a note, stop playing, and it would oscillate in the background non-stop. I dont feel that is normal operation for a delay on minimal settings.

    I'm open to some other suggestions as well though so keep em coming.
     
  15. Tootone

    Tootone Member

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    I think the Strymon Timeline has high headroom inputs.... it will take Line level...
     
  16. Grimace

    Grimace Supporting Member

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    Is the mush on your original dry signal too, or only the delays? If you turn the delay on, then turn the mix/level all the way down, is your original signal basically intact?

    The only time I have had the issue you are having was when I ran a boost/distortion pedal into the delay at a high output level, not necessarily a high gain level. That would overdrive the delay input. Try this, keep you gain up where you want it, but lower the output level of your overdrive/distortion section. What does that sound like? If it is OK, then the solution is to get a boost pedal or a delay that has its own boost, and make up the output level after the delay.
     
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  17. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Ah ha, great point! I will test this tonight.
     
  18. Jimmy3Fingers

    Jimmy3Fingers Member

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    Came here to say this...blend.
     
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  19. Blix

    Blix Supporting Member

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    Are you using your amps effect loop? If not, you should!
     
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  20. Abram4235

    Abram4235 Supporting Member

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    Hey Blix - Typically I'd agree, but in my case it's a passive loop and it blows. Very dull sound. But also because my amp is 100w and has a ton of clean headroom, and since I'm no where close to maxing that out, I'm running everything out in front. So I don't know if using the loop would be helpful in my situation.
     

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