Digital Delay that doesn't digitize dry tone?

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by JKoeth, Sep 7, 2008.

  1. JKoeth

    JKoeth Supporting Member

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    I'm looking for a Digital delay to compliment my analog one. I'd like one that has digital clarity but does not convert my dry tone to digital or change it. I also like the ability to do modulated repeats.

    Any suggestions?
     
  2. Passenger84

    Passenger84 Member

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    The Damage Control Timeline, the Boss DD20, and the Empress Superdelay leave the dry signal completely untouched, and all 3 have modulation. I would recommend any of them, although my humble personal choice right now is the Timeline.
     
  3. Hugo Da Rosa

    Hugo Da Rosa Silver Supporting Member

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    Boss DD-7 has a very nice dry signal sound. The wet signal sounds very organic as well. Plus it's a decently small footprint and not that expensive. Also has your modulated delays that you are looking for :)
     
  4. Mitch T

    Mitch T Member

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    Ibanez DML(10/20). You can find 'em used.
     
  5. 22Top

    22Top Member

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    Not to drop dime on Passenger84, but I think that the Empress does affect your dry tone when engaged, though it is still true bypass. I may be wrong, but I seem to remember talking with Steve from Empress about this. I can't notice the difference though... not much tonal coloration.
     
  6. fizbin

    fizbin Member

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    Are you guys with the Boss digital delays sure that it isn't digitizing the dry signal? Boss does not publicize this info and specifically avoids answering this question regarding their reverbs and delays. I believe it does digitize the dry signal. Most all digital delays do, unless specifically otherwise stated.
     
  7. Osga

    Osga Member

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    The Carl Martin delays do not convert the direct guitar signal, but they might not sound as digital as you want.
     
  8. Ben C.

    Ben C. Member

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    Specifically, regarding the Digitech Hardwire DL-8, Digitech support said:

    "When the delay is off, it is in true bypass. When the delay is on, the dry signal is completely analog (no AD or DA conversions) and the wet signal is digital. The "Level" knob on the pedal is an analog control of the wet signal."

    -Ben
     
  9. JKoeth

    JKoeth Supporting Member

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    Actually, the Empress does convert the dry signal to digital. Steve from Empress has stated this. The Eventide Timefactor does too which bums me out.

    I just got the Empress which is a great delay but I lose some of the fullness in the low end of my dry tone.
     
  10. JKoeth

    JKoeth Supporting Member

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    You are correct.
     
  11. forum_crawler

    forum_crawler Member

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    I see that you own a DL-8, and obviously you have chosen it to be on your board over other better known delays. I find myself in the situation of needing a digital delay to complement my H2O, and also wondering how you would rate it against something like Boss dds or the subdecay? Or maybe even the DL-4 (which I am not familiar with at all, but many people have).
     
  12. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    As guys are noting here, some delays do not convert (A-D/D-A) the dry signal to digital, but I doubt (I could be wrong) that that means it is not changed...I think no matter what it is going to be going through a buffer, so as you said, you want one that doesn't convert dry to digital at all, but also that has a buffer that isn't going to change the tone...if that is possible.

    Small distinction, but I thought I would mention it.
     
  13. rawkguitarist

    rawkguitarist Member

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    Hey Jamie!

    I've never, seen a perfect delay. With all the possibilities, there's always a drawback. Such as no tap tempo, great delays and tone but no modulation, too big, the tap tempo requires holding the footswitch for 2 secs before tap mode... etc, etc.

    My point: The Line 6 Echopark is the best delay solution available compared to the other pedal's drawbacks.

    It sounds great (quite organic sounding), much better than the DL4 (either way, it definitely is a different tone). Supposedly the analog signal never gets ADA'd, almost like an internal effects loop. I'm not 100% sure on this point but it definitely doesn't sound like it's digitizing the entire signal like the DL4 in say the tape models.

    The modulation features are killer too; how you can simply add in a little modulation on each of the 3 models (wow and flutter on the Tape, chorus on the Digital and Vibrato on the Analog). The vibrato that can be added to the analog model; this spacy/unique sound alone makes this delay the coolest on the market. And the way the tap tempo works is ingenious, dual function switch; stop all the way through to bypass, tap twice light for tempo.

    IMO the only drawback to the Echopark is that there's a slight volume *boost* when it's engaged. Isn't a real problem unless your amp is set on the verge. And noise has *never* been a problem for me (unless I put it on a daisy chain).

    Delay's I choose the Echopark over:

    Fulltone TTE (I know it's not digital, but I'm saying I'd still choose the Echopark).
    Mad Professor Deep Blue (sorry bro...)
    TRex Replica
    DLS Echotap
    Line 6 DL4
    All the Boss ones
    TC Nova Delay (sounds great, but pretty "perfect" sounding)
     
  14. JKoeth

    JKoeth Supporting Member

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    This is a great point and one that I meant to imply earlier.
     
  15. JKoeth

    JKoeth Supporting Member

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    Hey Aaron!

    So is the Echopark True Bypass? I recently sold my MP Deep Blue. It is killer but a little too dirty by nature. I've got the dirty repeats with my analog delay. I'm looking for something cleaner that doesn't mess with my base tone.

    Did you own the TTE?
     
  16. Passenger84

    Passenger84 Member

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    Ha. :hide Guess I spoke too soon. Sorry guys. I've not owned the Empress delay, but have been very interested in it, and could have sworn I read on the site that it did not convert the dry signal. Oh, well. Guilty as charged.

    However, the Damage Control Timeline is a delay I own, and they are very clear on the site and the manual that it leaves the dry signal completely untouched. Best delay I've heard.

    Wow, that does really bum me out about the Empress. (Both the fact that it converts the dry signal, and the fact that I was wrong.....for the first time ever....kind of....no not really.....;))
     
  17. Ben C.

    Ben C. Member

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    I use delay pretty simply... I don't engage in self-oscillation (sounds dirty), don't use tap-tempo (even though the DL-8 has it), and only use the loop function of pedals for songwriting - not for performance.

    My main use of delay is for a 700ms. or so ambient trail. 'Adding space' kind of like reverb, but without the issues with reverb which I find muddles up the signal a bit more than what I like in this particular application. I've had a DL-4 and thought it was ok although for my simple purposes it was a bit of overkill and the sounds were 'allright'. The Boss DD series served me well (spec. the DD-6 and 7) but the DL-8's quality of sound is better than the Boss offerings at this time, IMO. More natural, not 'over the top', and the true-bypass of the DL-8 really let me hear how my DD series pedals were lopping some high-end off my tone. Additionally, the straight-up digital delay setting doesn't sound as... harsh... as the DD-6 or DD-7's.

    I actually prefer the DL-8's Analog and Lo-Fi modes to real analog delays I've used, as they're not as noisy and you don't have headroom issues. So I'm in a minority here ;) . Hope this answers your q's!

    -Ben
     
  18. IvIark

    IvIark Member

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    The DLS EchoTap leaves the dry signal unprocessed and is a great sounding digital delay. As a low cost option, so does the Marshall Echo Head.
     
  19. iggs

    iggs Member

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    Retroman KopyKat ... no modulation but it has a send/return loop so you can add any mod type pedal that you like. Sounds amazing.
     
  20. rawkguitarist

    rawkguitarist Member

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    No the Echopark isn't true bypass, it's a buffered bypass which I prefer from the pedal at the end of my chain. Much of the time I have to play with my amp in an iso booth, far from my rig. At least one buffer is a must. I think a good pedal board has a good mix, properly laid out, of buffered and TB pedals. Case in point, I received a Make'n Music/Guitar Hup pedal board tour box that had all true bypass pedals. The signal was anemic coming out at the end. To be able to actually hear the pedals at a proper level, I put a boss pedal in front, problem fixed.

    No I’ve never owned the TTE, but have played one extensively. It’s the coolest delay I’ve ever heard. The only reason I don’t have one is that Tap Tempo is #1 priority for me in a delay.
     

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