Digitech RP1000 - Tone Request (Metallica)

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by jbealsmusic, May 27, 2012.

  1. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    I had an interesting adventure creating these presets... At first I tried to make them by ear just fiddling with different amps/cabs and EQ settings. It was taking forever and I wasn't getting anything better than average results. Then it dawned on me, why not just try and pick amps/cabs/stomps that model the actual amps/cabs/stomps they used in the original recordings. It worked really well for some of them, but didn't quite get me all the way there. Lastly, I used iZotope EQ to match the EQs. Rather than relying on that post-production trick I then tweaked the pEQ on the RP1000 to match the EQ curve iZotope created for the match. Thus, the presets don't rely on anything other than the RP1000.

    Most of them turned out pretty well (I think). Some of them, not so much. There's a lot of "roominess" in Metallica's guitar sound which was hard to re-create, but I did my best with some chorus and reverb. All that downpicking is pretty exhausting too...


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjEaTbirUKg

    Let me know what y'all think! I'd love some feedback...

    PS - Details about signal chain and some other stuff are in the video's description on YouTube.
     
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  2. VSK

    VSK Member

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    They all sound great man...I really liked the Kill Em All and Puppets versions. Great job nailing the HUGE guitar sound on Black with your doubles :D
     
  3. timmat

    timmat Supporting Member

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    Extremely good job on those. I'd like to replicate in my GSP1101...any way to view your settings, as I don't think I can download or view a patch from the RP1000. Screen grabs of your settings on xedit maybe?
     
  4. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Thanks man! Can't show the secret sauce (pEQ) with a screen grab. That's what made them work too... I'll type 'em out when I have some time later tonight.
     
  5. Will Chen

    Will Chen Member

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    On the whole, great job. IMHO Digitech's parametric EQ is what makes the RP/GSP so good.
     
  6. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Thanks Will. And, I couldn't agree more about the pEQ! It can take almost any model and dial out the crap while dialing in the awesome.

    Ask and you shall receive! Keep in my mind I built these specifically to go direct for studio purposes. Obviously you will need to modify a bit to suit your guitar/pups and the other stuff in your signal chain...

    Kill 'Em All - I read that they used JCM800s with matching 4x12s boosted by a Rat distortion. Once I selected those and cranked them up it already sounded pretty close.
    Dist - Rodent (D55,F30,L99)
    Amp - '83 JCM800 (G55,B6,M1,T4,L60)
    Cab - British 4x12
    pEQ - Low (-9dB@500hz,Q1); Mid (+6dB@1.5kHz,Q3); High (+5dB@5kHz,Q2)
    Reverb - LexAmb (0ms,D25,V25,L25)

    Ride The Lightning - The original sounds like they layered a dozen guitars using distant micing in a fairly wet room. I had trouble recreating all that in the RP as all the cab sims are very tight sounding...
    Dist - Amp Driver (G0,M0,L99)
    Amp - '83 JCM800 (G90,B8,M1,T6.5,L60)
    Cab - British 4x12
    pEQ - Low (-7dB@500hz,Q1); Mid (+3dB@1.5kHz,Q3); High (-4dB@4.5kHz,Q3)
    Reverb - LexRoom (0ms,D45,V45,L35)

    Master of Puppets - See note for Ride The Lightning. It didn't turn out quite like I'd hoped...
    Dist - Amp Driver (G0,M0,L99)
    Amp - DigiMetal (G50,B5,M1,T8,L60)
    Cab - DigiMetal 4x12
    pEQ - Low (-12dB@500hz,Q2); Mid (+7dB@1.12kHz,Q3); High (-12dB@3kHz,Q1)
    Reverb - LexRoom (0ms,D35,V35,L35)

    ...And Justice For All - This one has an obvious heavy saturated tube sound that really can't be captured in the RP1000. None of the models have that character. Aside from that characteristic sound, I think I pretty much nailed it.
    Dist - Screamer (G15,T75,L99)
    Amp - DigiMetal (G50,B5,M1,T5.5,L60)
    Cab - DigiMetal 4x12
    pEQ - Low (-12dB@500hz,Q2); Mid (+7dB@1.12kHz,Q3); High (-12dB@3kHz,Q1)
    FX - MultiChorus (S0,D0,Sine,L25) - Chorus might have been a little heavy here. Might want to lower the level to 15 or so...
    Reverb - LexRoom (0ms,D35,V35,L25)

    Black Album - Ah yes, the real test begins. Saturated tubes, comb-filtering, multiple mics, etc. Lots the RP can't recreate but I did my best.
    Dist - Screamer (G25,T75,L99)
    Amp - DigiMetal (G50,B5,M1,T5,L60)
    Cab - DigiRock 4x12
    pEQ - Low (-4dB@425hz,Q1); Mid (-12dB@1.12kHz,Q3); High (+12dB@5.3kHz,Q3)
    FX - MultiChorus (S0,D0,Sine,L15) - Maybe lower to 5-10.
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L35)

    Load - Load and Reload are actually my favorite Metallica albums. Less layering, no comb filtering (that I can hear), and a fairly dry room makes modelers happy when trying to recreate tones. The only thing lacking is that "tubey" character IMO.
    Dist - Screamer (G25,T50,L99)
    Amp - '89 RG100 (G50,B5,M5,T5,L75)
    Cab - DigiAlt 4x12
    pEQ - Low (+9dB@90hz,Q3); Mid (-9dB@500Hz,Q3); High (+5dB@3kHz,Q2)
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L35)

    Reload - See note above...
    Dist - Screamer (G25,T50,L99)
    Amp - '89 RG100 (G50,B5,M5,T5,L75)
    Cab - DigiAlt 4x12
    pEQ - Low (+5dB@112hz,Q3); Mid (-12dB@500Hz,Q3); High (+3dB@2.5kHz,Q3)
    FX - MultiChorus (S0,D0,Sine,L15)
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L35)

    Garage Inc. - Not in the video but I did make one. I like the production on this album much the same as Load and Reload. I just couldn't find any decent backing tracks.
    Dist - Screamer (G25,T75,L99)
    Amp - DigiMetal (G50,B5,M5,T7,L50)
    Cab - DigiAlt 4x12
    pEQ - Low (+3dB@100hz,Q3); Mid (-3dB@630Hz,Q2); High (+3dB@3.15kHz,Q3)
    FX - MultiChorus (S0,D0,Sine,L15)
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L25)

    St.Anger - The guitars actually have a decent heavy sound. Everything around them sounds awful though.
    Dist - Screamer (G35,T75,L99)
    Amp - '89 RG100 (G50,B5,M5,T5,L75)
    Cab - DigiSolo 4x12
    pEQ - Low (+3dB@180hz,Q3); Mid (-4dB@710Hz,Q2); High (-3dB@3.55kHz,Q2)
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L35)

    Death Magnetic - Also not in the video. I'm not a fan of their sound on this album either...
    Dist - Screamer (G50,T99,L99)
    Amp - '01 Dual Rect (G50,B5,M1,T5,L50)
    Cab - DigiVintage 4x12
    pEQ - Low (+7dB@200hz,Q3); Mid (-4dB@500Hz,Q3); High (+12dB@7.1kHz,Q3)
    Reverb - LexStudio (0ms,D25,V25,L25)
     
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  7. timmat

    timmat Supporting Member

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    Thanks jbealsmusic for taking the time to document all of that.

     
  8. morphine

    morphine Member

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    The House Jack Built.

    I dare you. It's my favorite high-gain guitar sound ever. It's so chunky that "chunky" had to be redefined in the dictionary.
     
  9. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Anytime. I enjoy this stuff!

    I would have done The House That Jack Built. That was my favorite song off the Load album and Load/Reload were my favorite albums (production-wise). I couldn't find a decent backing track for it, so I did King Nothing instead.

    In general, I don't think the RP1000 can get the same chunky tube dynamics as the Load/Reload albums. It's a characteristic that seems to be missing in all the amp models. One could probably get pretty close by recording direct using the RP's preamp models (cab sims off), then adding a VST "tube sim" and some decent IRs in the DAW. I did the best that I could with the unit but it does have its limitations and because I wanted to demo what the unit could do alone, I didn't want to use VSTs or do much in post.

    Glad you liked what I've done so far, hopefully more to come in the future!
     
  10. BenoA

    BenoA Member

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    All these recorded direct??? Straight into the soundcard/USB port???

    Sounds real good to me and would gig with this! How does the RP1000 sounds into a PA???
     
  11. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Yep. Signal Path:
    PRS-SE Tremonti (D-Activator Pickups) - RP1000 - PC (via USB)

    Post-Production
    - 4 guitars recorded for all songs (2 per side, panning varies)
    - Low and high pass filters applied at 100Hz and 8kHz to all guitar tracks (DAW)
    - Some compression/limiting in mastering stage (DAW)

    I play in a modern top 40s cover band and I use it direct to FOH and have an EV ELX112p for personal monitoring. In a smaller club I can use the EV to carry the room if needed. With the low price tag, the RP1000 has given me the best value for my dollar that I've ever gotten out of any gear. It's not perfect by any means, but it does what I need and I've never had anything but compliments about my tone.
     
  12. BenoA

    BenoA Member

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    Thanks Jonathan. I'm quite impressed by how it sounds in your video.

    Are these difficult to demo? I tried once a POD HD500 and was a bit confused when trying to modify a preset.

    I'm very curious to go and try one of these RP1000 to hear if I'd like it.
     
  13. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Thanks man!

    I upgraded from a GNX4 to the RP1000 a few months ago. I tried a number of newer units and eventually chose the RP because of functionality that is not there on other units. If I were going for sound alone, I would have purchased a POD or some other modern generation unit. IMO the amp modelling on the RP1000 is good, but like most digital technology, amp modelling is improving rapidly every generation and the RP doesn't really compare to the newer units on the market.

    The programming matrix on the RP units can be tough to grasp at first but I prefer it over sorting through menus on the POD. I build all my presets on the computer and I like the matrix because editing on the fly (which is inevitable) is fast and simple. It all comes down to personal preference (and training) though. Some people like sorting through menus and can do it fairly quickly.
     
  14. Toddebner

    Toddebner Member

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    Jonathan/jbealsmusic,

    Awesome job!!

    I would love to see a step by step diy on how you used izotope eq match process to generate an eq curve. Then how you used the peq on the rp1000 to match it.

    I assume you set up the amp/cab to match the song, set distortion level, turned off all effects, then eq'd to ear. (or did you set eq flat). Then recorded something in daw, went through match process with izotope against the original cd recording of the song (multiple youtube tutorials on this part exist).

    1. How do you get/use the eq curve generated from this?
    2. Was it iterative process?
    3. Did you use looper or reamp process to accomplish?
    4. The rp had a low,mid, and high peq. Our youtube said you applied low and high shelf filters. Did that leave you with only using the mid peq? Or were the shelves applied in mastering?
    Etc,

    This could be a very useful howto..

    Thx, having trouble matching tones with my rp1000 In live/direct to pa situation. and want to try this out.
     
  15. jbealsmusic

    jbealsmusic Member

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    Thanks! If I still had the ability to make and upload videos, I'd still be doing it. Ever since I moved in June, YouTube won't accept any of my uploads or they become scrambled like crazy. I am using all the same equipment and settings as before to create the videos. I even tried re-uploading some of the videos I already uploaded and even they come out all scrambled. It makes no sense...

    This post above outlines the details of every preset in the video (and a couple of other presets that didn't make the cut).
    http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showpost.php?p=13201338&postcount=6

    To answer your questions more specifically...
    First, I tested each amp with no effects (except distortion) and flat EQs (amp & pEQ) until I found something that I considered similar in character to the original song. It didn't necessarily match the amp/cab/stomp they used when they originally recorded though.

    Second, I scrolled through different cab options to see if there was a cab with a similar sounding frequency response. When I found that, I fiddled with the amp EQ settings to try to match it even closer. Both of those were done by ear...

    Third, I went through the EQ matching process using izotope with the stems of the original guitar tracks. Smoothing to 0.5, Match to 100%. With smoothing off, the EQ curve is pretty erratic so I set it to 0.5 in order to have a better chance at being able to match the curve because there would be less peaks and valleys to try and match. I wasn't trying to get PERFECT matches because I knew it wouldn't be possible with the limitations of the RP. Anyways, at this point you would see 3 EQ curves in izotope. The RP, the stems, and the match curve (nice smooth red line).

    At this point, I just jotted down where the major peaks/valleys of the match curve were and recreated them using the pEQ on the RP. Then I re-tested against the original stems with another match EQ to see how close it was. I will say this, the pEQ on the RP is not as accurate as I thought it would be. First of all, the Q-widths are all much wider than I thought they would be. Second, when you boost a frequency by 12dB, you might only get a 6-9dB boost instead. It was much more like an analog pEQ in that respect.

    Regardless, I did one or two more tries playing with the pEQ until I got fairly close to a flat match and voila! Almost there... I did my best to sparingly use some chorus and reverb in order to simulate things like room sound and comb filtering (not successfully in my opinion).

    At this point, I had fully self-contained tones on the RP1000 that more or less simulated the original album sounds. Finally, partially out of habit and a little out of preference, I added the low/high pass filters to each guitar track in the DAW.

    Was it an irative process? Yes, slightly... Although it got easier/quicker as the day went on. The first tone probably took close to 45min but by the end I was doing each tone in less than 10min.

    I hope that helped... Let me know if you have any other questions.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2012
  16. Toddebner

    Toddebner Member

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    Thanks, I'll give it a try
     
  17. Adam Wilson

    Adam Wilson Member

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    Really great Job man, i was wondering if there was anyway of getting these tones as patches for the Digitech rp500?
     
  18. Technica

    Technica Member

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    LOL this thread was from six years ago. :)
     
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  19. tekorei

    tekorei Member

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    I created some of the patches in my RP 360 using this information, I had good results, although requires some patience .

    I added a bit of Glisten Chorus, based on @Will Chen 's Insane Gain patch.
     
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  20. Adam Wilson

    Adam Wilson Member

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    Ya i know this was an old post, i got some patches from the digitech fan created library before they took it down. Some are decent and some could be better. One in particular is the Metallica And Justice for all tone. I have been looking everywhere to find any tones that come close and haven't been able to.
     
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