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Do heavier guitars *REALLY* sustain longer?

TP Parter

Member
Messages
1,044
Get your sustain the same way everyone else does - turn up the gain on your amp & distortion pedal! Hit a low E power chord. Just hold it & let it ring for 45 seconds. Then shake your head with a smile and your eyes closed, saying "Man, listen to that sustain."
I prefer turning up the volume on my amp and slamming that with a boost, but to each their own.
 

hunter

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
6,560
Without any disrespect intended, this makes no practical sense.
From the musical perspective, hearing it is all that matters.
From the ' oh well what can entertain me on a whimsical level'..understanding it could be important, and absolutely useless otherwise apart from the aforementioned use to MAKE AND PLAY MUSIC.
An irony in what you've said is that you simply can not understand it without hearing it first, as the theories people are throwing around are so wild, misleading and varied- understanding it by figuring it out without hearing would almost like be winning the lottery.
What is happening is that the longer this interesting but actually quite silly argument goes on, the more crazy the theories are getting. and the whole time those who know, hear what's going on, crystal clear, as the longer time goes past the point they starting hearing it, the more they hear. it really is extraordinary every time you hear something new pop up, a few repeats to confirm, and you (I) have another block of data/sound to remember.
Another irony is all a person has to do is play, and play some more, then change guitars then play, and play some more for a couple of years? ...and then they will hear it too, unless there is some kind of other impediment which I'm not qualified to discuss.
What I think is going on is that there is a lot of looking at guitars going on, and not much playing.
Hearing is a most easily fooled sense.
 
Messages
93
Was Ed fooling himself when he retired his destroyer after he cut it down? Am I a fool when I hear his tone in lets say 78' and then after he cut it down and notice some severe tone loss? Just listen to Eds tone change as he changes guitars from Ash to basswood etc. I'm sorry guys, but guitars have tone like you have fingerprints. Unique. Listen to Peter Green play that 59', and then listen to Gary play it. if you don't get what I'm trying to show by listening to this stuff, then you don't get it. No unique signature means you can go and buy the dirtiest nastiest Chinese axe and hit a home run every time. Good for you, but it doesn't work like that for some of us.
 
Messages
93
category a ) - deniers
category b ) - hostile deniers
category c) - students who hear very little, persevere till they get it
category d) - students who give up and then join category 'a' or 'b'.
category e ) - beneficiaries ..those who use the power.
category f ) - people from category 'e' that should be playing guitar, but for some stupid reason try and show others the golden path.
 

hunter

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
6,560
category a ) - deniers
category b ) - hostile deniers
category c) - students who hear very little, persevere till they get it
category d) - students who give up and then join category 'a' or 'b'.
category e ) - beneficiaries ..those who use the power.
category f ) - people from category 'e' that should be playing guitar, but for some stupid reason try and show others the golden path.
The power. Funny guy.
 
Messages
93
category g ) - those who know there is merit to the argument of things like materials used to construct guitars define that guitars tone, cannot hear it, and then state ' it matters, but not meaningfully enough.

There is weight to this argument, as great players can make any piece of crap guitar sound magnificent.
 

hunter

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
6,560
category g ) - those who know there is merit to the argument of things like materials used to construct guitars define that guitars tone, cannot hear it, and then state ' it matters, but not meaningfully enough.

There is weight to this argument, as great players can make any piece of crap guitar sound magnificent.
How do you use the power?
 
Messages
93
category h ) - those who maintain these things exist, mean very little in the big scheme of things, and can hear differences, but who haven't been listening for long enough. Keep listening, the best is yet to come.
 

korus

Member
Messages
1,179
Category I ) - People who have super duper human hearing.
You are incorrect. It seems you are new to this. You need already established terminology in the field figured out ASAP. Without it, you will be perceived as a hobbyist or something.

The proper term is BAT EARS.

To help you remember it use the following sentence - human vampire has vampire bat's teeth.

And you will also notice that just like any other proper term, this one is self explanatory. Glad to help.
 

Mr Fingers

Member
Messages
2,545
Since I find it incredibly easy to get infinite susatain out of virtually any guitar thanks to a few pedals and appropriaqte amp setup, who cares? Do people still rely on this kind of mechanical sustain as the main way to get a note to sing for whatever length of time you may want? And even if you do, there are ways to get a light guitar to deliver mechanical sustain.
 

sleep

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
2,948
category a ) - deniers
category b ) - hostile deniers
category c) - students who hear very little, persevere till they get it
category d) - students who give up and then join category 'a' or 'b'.
category e ) - beneficiaries ..those who use the power.
category f ) - people from category 'e' that should be playing guitar, but for some stupid reason try and show others the golden path.
Category G: (you). People who believe their OPINION is a fact and, even if there is evidence to the contrary, will attack the person rather than the topic being discussed.

My first real band- guitarist played a peavey Mantis through an American metal pedal into a Peavey Bandit w/a 4x10” extension cab. He sounded amazing. I couldn’t even play that guitar because the action was so incredibly low it fretted out on every note. I sounded awful through his rig.
 

sleep

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
2,948
Was Ed fooling himself when he retired his destroyer after he cut it down? Am I a fool when I hear his tone in lets say 78' and then after he cut it down and notice some severe tone loss? Just listen to Eds tone change as he changes guitars from Ash to basswood etc. I'm sorry guys, but guitars have tone like you have fingerprints. Unique. Listen to Peter Green play that 59', and then listen to Gary play it. if you don't get what I'm trying to show by listening to this stuff, then you don't get it. No unique signature means you can go and buy the dirtiest nastiest Chinese axe and hit a home run every time. Good for you, but it doesn't work like that for some of us.
Didn’t EVH install a fake five way in a pickup cavity to screw with people? Do you believe everything he said? Haven’t they recently re-released that guitar? Do all of those releases sound bad?
 

Jynx

Member
Messages
418
Just out of interest - how do you measure sustain? I'm guessing you don't use your ears(?). That you might use an instrument of some sort. Like how do you determine the point of 0 sustain after you pluck the string?
 

Tone_Terrific

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
32,101
Just out of interest - how do you measure sustain? I'm guessing you don't use your ears(?). That you might use an instrument of some sort. Like how do you determine the point of 0 sustain after you pluck the string?
At one level it is purely subjective and simply adequate, or not, for your application.

OTOH, you can measure the entire ADSR envelope and see the progression of the signal level.
The electronics affecting the signal are NOT what one assesses when checking instrument sustain.
Deadspots and hotspots are troublesome when seeking an instrument with even note to note response, too.
Shorter sustain is preferred for some styles of music.
 

Jon C

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
17,194
Category G: (you). People who believe their OPINION is a fact and, even if there is evidence to the contrary, will attack the person rather than the topic being discussed.

[…]
indeed .... some real pinhead dancing with a side order of snark going there ....
 
Messages
93
Didn’t EVH install a fake five way in a pickup cavity to screw with people? Do you believe everything he said? Haven’t they recently re-released that guitar? Do all of those releases sound bad?
Who said anything about what Ed said?

it don't matter what any re-issues sound like, the fact that so many guitar owners don't realize each guitar has its own particular sound just baffles me. guitar owners-->guitar players--> musicians.
 




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