Double drummer bands. Funny Butch Trucks reaction to the Dead.

Discussion in 'The Sound Hound Lounge' started by therhodeo, Jan 11, 2019.

  1. therhodeo

    therhodeo Member

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    Right off I'm a big Allman fan but also a pretty heavy listener to Bill only era Dead. As much as I love the Allmans rhythm section rarely if ever have I dug other dual drummer bands. That's doesn't just apply to the Dead. Also some of the other southern rock groups that took that up at the time. It just seemed unnecessary for some of the stock rhythms they were playing.


    Anyway my main question was if anyone had ever heard Butch expound on his thoughts on the Dead's double drumming. You can see his reaction in the first 12 seconds of this clip when they're mentioned.
     
  2. FenderBigot

    FenderBigot Supporting Member

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    Tedeschi Trucks Band... very good dual drummer set up due to two guitars w/ horns and keys. Ymmv :dunno
     
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  3. therhodeo

    therhodeo Member

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    I'm aware of lots of dual drummer bands from James Browns band up to TTB.
     
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  4. Tiny Montgomery

    Tiny Montgomery Supporting Member

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    There’s another interview where they asked him a similar question, and he basically said he likes Billy, but Mickey “can’t play.”

    My favorite Dead is without MH, too. Butch and Jaimoe were seamlessly integrated. Mickey usually just superimposed something on top of Billy, and occasionally it wasn’t a total distraction.
     
  5. therhodeo

    therhodeo Member

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    Basically my feelings. 72' era rolled along with such swing. Mickey stuff to me plods and lumbers. The way he plays in the gaps sucks the swing out of Billy's playing.

    I do enjoy the 77 Cornell recording with Mickey but its the exception.
     
  6. Tiny Montgomery

    Tiny Montgomery Supporting Member

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    Jerry supposedly once said something to the effect of “it’s hard to play in time with a popcorn machine behind you.”
     
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  7. therhodeo

    therhodeo Member

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    Hahahahaha
     
  8. DrumBob

    DrumBob Gold Supporting Member

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    In the Allmans, Butch was the rock and Jaimoe was the colorist and it worked for decades. They were simpatico together. In the Dead, Mickey Hart was usually playing something that was out there, and it detracted from the music at times. Mickey is a percussionist at heart. He just happened to sit behind a drumset.
     
  9. Tiny Montgomery

    Tiny Montgomery Supporting Member

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    Generally speaking, true, but that oversimplifies it, somewhat. Butch was the one who played the tympani (Mountain Jam intro, and other places), for example. He was a percussionist in the Jacksonville symphony (iirc) before the ABB.

    It’s fun to pan to the left to hear what Jaimoe was doing, and the right, for Butch (And Duane and Dickey, respectively). Butch did a fair amount of “coloring,” too. They bounced the ball back and forth a lot, sometimes within the same phrase.
     
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  10. louderock

    louderock Member

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    My singer once said "It'd be fun to get Johnny and Daryl both playing drums at our gig like the Allmans!" I quickly squashed that and let him know it would likely sound like tennis shoes in a clothes dryer.
     
  11. Orm-D

    Orm-D Member

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    It worked pretty well for 38 Special
     
  12. aiq

    aiq Supporting Member

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    Gregg and Butch slagged the Dead any chance they got.

    Duane and Betts praised the Dead any chance they got.

    As Trucks would say, nuff said.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
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  13. Bluesful

    Bluesful Supporting Member

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    Aren't King Crimson playing with 3?
     
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  14. rollyfoster

    rollyfoster Supporting Member

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    Shoes in a dryer.

    Mickey is good with the percussion stuff but he’s such a bombastic and stiff kit drummer it drives me insane. Habitual toe stepper.
     
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  15. rollyfoster

    rollyfoster Supporting Member

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    Butch powered the train and was a more 4/4 rock drummer.

    Jaimoe came from the jazz side of things and excelled at flourishes and not trying to drive the beat in conjunction with Butch. He danced around it and filled in a ton of space.

    They both understood their skill set and played to that.

    I think the only time Jaimoe really took the driver seat was on Stand Back because Butch couldn’t do that gutbucket funky thing as well.
     
  16. Tiny Montgomery

    Tiny Montgomery Supporting Member

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    It doesn’t really make much sense to say one is more of a “4/4 drummer” than the other. Whatever time signature they were playing in, they were both playing in it.

    It would have clashed pretty dramatically if Butch had been playing in 4/4 on “Whipping Post” (11/8, 12/8), the intro of “Black Hearted Woman” (7/8), “Dreams” (6/8), etc.
     
  17. rollyfoster

    rollyfoster Supporting Member

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    I just mean that he drives the beat and lays the foundation pretty much all the time. Time signature semantics aside. Jaimoe added the swing and counterbalance.

    The dead drummers tripped all over themselves constantly because there wasn’t really a clear division of who played what.
     
  18. Tiny Montgomery

    Tiny Montgomery Supporting Member

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    Calling him a “4/4 rock drummer” makes it sound like he’s Phil Rudd, or something, though. No disrespect to the deeply grooving Rudd, mind you, but Butch has a much more schooled and finessed approach, than that.
     
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  19. rollyfoster

    rollyfoster Supporting Member

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    Duly noted. Poor choice of words there.
     
  20. drewl

    drewl Member

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    I don't know, doesn't sound like anything two drummers were doing in either band couldn't be done by one.

    That's why I hate overdubbed drum parts.
    But that's just me.
     
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