ethics poll

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by Bufferz, Feb 21, 2012.

Where do you stand re: ethics and cloning?

  1. it is always wrong

  2. it is wrong if done to people who depend on sales of creative circuit designs for a living, but not

  3. it is wrong only if it is actively marketed to be associated with the original builder example a "to

  4. i have no problems with it in any situation

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Bufferz

    Bufferz Member

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    We have all read many threads on the ethics of cloning circuits and small builders vs megatron etc. This is a poll not to start discussion, but rather to see where the majority viewpoint, rather than the loudest voice, lies on TGP.
     
  2. inystad

    inystad Member

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    In general if the pedalbuilder states that his Klone that is for sale is a Klone so that the customer knows about it BEFORE a purchase, I'm usually ok with it. When they are marketing a cloned pedal as an original circuit pedal , my whistle get's angry.
     
  3. cj_wattage

    cj_wattage Vendor

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    You left out the most important option:

    "It is okay to clone if I don't care about the company/builder being cloned, but wrong if I have personal affinity for the company/builder in some way."


    I can't believe anyone here would actually answer "always wrong". There are way too many Muff, Fuzz Face, and Astrotone clones being hyped here for that to be a reasonable option.
     
  4. analogmike

    analogmike Gold Supporting Member

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    Should be an option:

    "it's ok if the pedal being cloned is no longer in production by the original manufacturer".

    That applies to astrotones, fuzz faces, etc. Most of our pedals were made by customer demand for pedals that were no longer available, starting with the Clone Chorus (based on Small Clone when EHX was not making pedals).
     
  5. Bufferz

    Bufferz Member

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    92 views 12 votes........... don't be scared to have an opinion - plus people cant see what you vote for
     
  6. BBender

    BBender Member

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    Man o man...pretty much everything is a clone of something else these days. From pedals, to amps, to guitars....and everyone is drinking the Kool Aid.
     
  7. chip46

    chip46 Member

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    I'm in the same consensus as Mike, if it's no longer in production, its fair game. We're talking on a full production business scale though.

    I don't think making a single clone of a pedal for yourself or one to give to a friend is wrong really, but starting a pedal company and then making clones of popular pedals currently in production is pretty daft.
     
  8. jocfan1

    jocfan1 Member

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    Agree with each of these sentiments:

    I also don't necessarily have a problem with cloning current-run pedals, provided the clone introduces something new (ie, an added EQ, a boost circuit, etc.) and isn't simply a rehousing of the exact same circuit.
     
  9. rootbeersoup

    rootbeersoup Member

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    People need to stop cloning pedals and make something original... Like the JHS Astro Mess
     
  10. magnus02

    magnus02 Member

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    It's wrong but....

    Not illegal and impossible to stop so I say if you're a builder be prepared for the worst and plan accordingly...
     
  11. b_rad

    b_rad Member

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    Mike is right. This should be an option.

    IMO, this is the only justifiable option for making a straight up clone.
     
  12. UncleLarry

    UncleLarry Member

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  13. rootbeersoup

    rootbeersoup Member

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    Correct, taking a little jab at them
     
  14. fellsilver

    fellsilver Member

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    I agree that we need a few more options here.

    My own view would be that cloning is wrong if it is done:

    1) to people or to corporations whose ability to sustain their own operations will be significantly harmed by it (with recognition that "significantly" may vary with context),

    2) unless these people/entities have given their express consent (in which case, they are essentially declaring that the cloned pedal will not harm them, or that the harm done is in some way acceptable to them),

    3) and the clones are made for profit or widely distributed/made available to the buying public.

    If these three conditions don't obtain (for whatever reason), I have no problem with cloning.
     
  15. Bufferz

    Bufferz Member

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    yes, more options would have been better. I did try to cover that one with option 2 for people with your viewpoint
     
  16. cribcage

    cribcage Member

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    Sure, except that the first half of the post you quoted (which you omitted) would still apply:

     
  17. AceBSpankin

    AceBSpankin Prince of Ales Gold Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    The whole music industry is built on cloneing, guitars,amps,pedals,lyrics,chord progressions,ect,ect...........Who ever voted always wrong is a BS'er!!:omg Thanks Ken!!!
     
  18. myTakamine

    myTakamine Member

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    Agree with this 100%.

    Dishonest or obfuscatory business practices -- claim originality when it's an unaltered clone, for example, or lie to get your circuit boards from someone else -- aren't ok with me, either.

    Anything more complicated than that, and it makes my head hurt.
     
  19. jay42

    jay42 Member

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    Is the question about cloning for profit or diy curiosity? I do clone pedals and amps -- mostly older designs, however, only things I would never buy. I've never sold one either.

    Here's an extreme example of something I used to buy -- Canare GS-6 with Switchcraft or Neutrik connectors. Somebody out there (undoubtedly) makes cables with those specs and sells them through GC. Is it cloning if I roll my own?
     
  20. cj_wattage

    cj_wattage Vendor

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    Right. And that brings up the issue of how to define a clone. Is something not a clone if the first person who ever built one took a break from building or quit? How long a break is "long enough" to make cloning their stuff okay? Lots of hair-splitting in this type of discussion. There are certain builders who could take a 10-year break and it would still be "bad" to clone, and other guys are fair game because they took a half hour for lunch (ProCO). :dunno

    Yeah, I get it. I wasn't singling you out. I just thought about what clones came to mind immediately, and astrontone was one of them. That's 'cause you've got scary-big mindshare in the market. That's a good thing. :aok
     

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