Fender Twin Reverb or Cowtipper

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by tovaldi, Feb 17, 2006.


  1. tovaldi

    tovaldi Member

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    I´m having a hard time in deciding between these two.
    I have a chance to buy a sweet and original 1965 Twin Reverb in great condition, only issue is that one of the speakers is non original, the other is an Oxford. My other option is buying a new Cowtipper 45 Head or Combo. I´ve read a lot of good reviews and I think it could be what I´m looking for. My needs are a nice clean tone with beautiful reverb for both recording and maybe gigging once in a while.
    The drawbacks on the twin is that it probably needs a re-cap and who knows what else. I know this amp will retain its value or even increase it over the years but I´m looking for tone.
    The drawback on the Cowtipper is that I can´t play it first.
    Should I get a head and cab or just the combo?
    I would really appreciate any opinions.
    I would also like to ask for the reverb on Tony Brunos amps. Is it as good as on the Fender Twins? I read that the Underground had a three knob reverb, does the Cowtipper have that option? Whats the difference between he three knob reverb on the Underground and the reverb on the Cowtipper. Is the reverb on the head the same as on the combo?
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. AJ Love

    AJ Love Senior Member

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    the Reverb (and tone imho) is better on the Bruno amps than on vintage Fender amps
     
  3. Roe

    Roe Member

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    a matter of taste as the amps sound quite different. the fender can be much brighter and harsher than the bruno. it can also have a looser bass and tend to stress the upper mids when overdriven.
    To me the brunos sound much smoother and less twangy than the fenders.
     
  4. zoooombiex

    zoooombiex Member

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    the brunos have a great ability to be bright and clear without being harsh. the reverb is also extremely lush. i haven't played the most desirable fenders, but i've had a few older twins, and i thouht the CT 45 was the best *fender* tone i've heard.
     
  5. Lution

    Lution Member

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    You should also consider the Fargen Blackbird 40 watt combo. It's half the price of the Bruno, PTP wired, great reverb, and a very rich Fender tone.
     
  6. billybob77036

    billybob77036 Member

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    Twin. Can't out Blackface a Blackface.
     
  7. Tag

    Tag Gold Supporting Member

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    I love vintage Fenders, but the Twin reverb is not one of them. Thin and very sterile sounding to me. I MUCH prefer the Super, Pro, and Vibro reverbs. Still, find the best sounding of those (You will not because I own them:p ) and the Bruno still sounds MUCH better. Tighter bottom, ZERO harshness in the upper end, more 3D sound, and yes, even better reverb. MUCH better. He will not do the three knobber on the Cowtippers, I asked. However, it is ever bit as good, and maybe better than the 3 knobber on the UG 30. If the three knobber sounded better on the Cowtipper, Bruno would do it. I have one of only 2 stand alone reverbs that Bruno has made. Vintage transformers, and all NOS parts. (Three knobber), and I have used it in front of the Cowtipper. (Thats how the UG 30 is wired, like a stand alnoe in front of the amp) I like to Cowtippers built in reverb more. The one thing to take into consideration is that the Cowtippers are NOT clones. There are lots of other builders doing that. Bruno took the BF amps, and improved what he thought needed improving. To my ears, it is dead on, and the best fender cleans you can get. Friggin AMAZING. Unless you are into metal, I can think of nothing you would need other than a Cow45 and a Fulldrive II. I have a Cow 45 2/12 combo, and a seperate 2/12 bruno Cab. It sounds amazing both ways. The 2/12 combo is heavy, so get a seperate head cab if the weight worrys you. If you are incredibly strong like myself ;) , get the combo. Seriously, the Cow 45 IMO is the best sounding amp ever made. I A/B my Brunos all the time with my vintage fenders. The Brunos just sound MUCH better. Besides the Brunos, I prefer the original Fenders to every boutique I have played and or heard. Another Fender that IMO sounds better than the boutiques, and ever bit as good as the vintage Fenders is the Dual Professional. It still can not stand up to the Cowtipper.

    :AOK :AOK :AOK
     
  8. Aint Life Hell?

    Aint Life Hell? Member

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    is the best sounding amp i've ever played in person...unfortunately I didn't buy it, and regret it very much.
    If you get the chance, jump on it like Jake Gyllenhaal on Heath Ledger.
    you'll be wishing you knew how to quit it

    ....
     
  9. Hank Linderman

    Hank Linderman Supporting Member

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    Buy the Cowtipper, or...

    I suggest finding a 70's twin - one of the horrible 135 watt master volume ones - and send it to Roy Blankenship to be modded into a super Deluxe. You end up with a great sounding amp for less than 1k (don't pay more than $400 for the twin). He converts it to 2-6v6's, deluxe tranny, blackface circuitry, 2 vintage 30's. I have one and it is killer.

    It's still very heavy!

    Roy's # is 818-530-8853

    Best....H
     
  10. FlyingVBlues

    FlyingVBlues Gold Supporting Member

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    I disagree with Tag about Twins being thin and very sterile sounding. However, I think that everything else he says is spot on. I have a 67 Twin and a Cowtipper 45. My CT45 is a head, and I have 2 Bruno cabs, a 4x10 and a 2x12. I also have a Jensen 1x12 that I use with the CT, so I have a lot of flexibility in terms of amp configurations. In my experience the CT45 has a much tighter bottom than my Twin, a great deal of harmonic complexity and warmth and a terrific reverb. The 3D tonal quality is exceptional. The only thing I don't like about the CT45 is that feels a bit stiffer to me than any of my vintage Fender amps. This is probably due to the GZ34 rectifier. At some point I want to try a 5R4G rectifer, which has more sag. The CT45 records beautifully, and has worked really well for me when I've used it on gigs. Great amp.

    Tolvadi - you're in Spain? One thing to consider is that it will be much easier to get the Twin serviced. The schematics for Blackface Fender amps are readily available, and there are amp techs in Europe who can easily service them. I don't believe that Bruno has any sort of a sales or support network in Spain. They do have dealers in Germany, Norway and the Netherlands.

    FVB
     
  11. Roe

    Roe Member

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    tag,

    have you tried an allen blackface amp?
    to me the brunos don't sound fendery enough - it's a different type of sound - sounds too smooth and modern to me.
     
  12. drbob1

    drbob1 Silver Supporting Member

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    Well, if you're looking for sparkly clean and a great reverb and money is no object, the CT45 is very hard to beat. Brunos aren't slavish copies of Fender designs and his 3 knob reverb is second to none IMHO (granted I've never played an original Matchless reverb or Soldano Surfbox) but much smoother than even the best Fenders I've heard. So, if it's gotta sound like a Twin, the 65 is the best idea, if it's just great tone, Bruno's got it beat. THat said, for the money I'd go with the Twin-if you decided to downsize someday you're going to take a monster bath on a CT45, and you'll make money on the Twin...
     
  13. Tag

    Tag Gold Supporting Member

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    Hey Steve!

    Always great to hear from you! Still the owner of the amp that made the best clips of all time??

    It IS really strange I do not like the Twin reverbs. I like the Deluxe reverbs even less. I mean I love almost all Fender amps, but those two just leave me ice cold. very strange. The twins I think is partly due to the solid state rectifier, which is why i have not been real interetsed in trying a Cowtipper 90. Same thing. (SS rectifier)

    What brand rectifier do you have in the 45? I have a Mullard NOS, and man, the elastic feel on my Cows is part of what I dig so much about them. If a 5R4G will give me even more, I HAVE to try one! Lol! can I just drop one in, or does tha amp have to be modded at all? thanks for any help! Oh also, I am SO jealous of the 4 10 Bruno cab. I bet the Cow 45 through a 4/10 would be my favorite combination. What speakers do you have in it? Thanks again! One more thing, have you tried an UG 30 yet? I would love to get your take on it. At lower clean volumes, that still may be the best sounding amp I have played, and the feel is rubber city. We have to get together sometime. I would LOVE to put that TwoRock proto next to my Fuchs and E.Pro and give it a whirl. I would probably need all three. :eek:
     
  14. Tag

    Tag Gold Supporting Member

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    No, heard lots of clips though.

    I always say the Bruno is NOT a clone!! Other builders make clones, but I have yet to hear ANY that sound as good as a vintage or new RI Fender. None. Many sound great on their own, but when you put it RIGHT NEXT to a good Fender, the Fenders sounds better. I am the same with most boutique amps as well. None have lived up to the hype I have read. Ill take a good 1972 Marshall over ANY clone. I LOVED the Blockheads, and thought that they were as good as the best vintage Marshalls. However, then I put a Blockhead JTM 45 clone up against an everyday, production marshall 45 Blesbreaker Combo, and thought the cheap Marshall sounded MUCH, MUCH better!! :eek:

    I disagree about the Cowtipper sounding more modern. (I do not even know what that means actually.) It is really dead on blackface, with a tighter bottom, more even response (is that what you mean by smoother?), and a top end that is not ice pick like the best vintage fenders. Also the reverb is MUCH deeper and more spacious. For those reasons though, if you want DEAD ON BLACKFACE, a fender is the way to go.
    To my ear, the Brunos are the only amps to actually surpass Fenders.
     
  15. mprvise

    mprvise Member

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    I used to think that too, then I tried a Bruno. :AOK
     
  16. TNJ

    TNJ Gold Supporting Member

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    As Tag states...the Twin and the CT are not the same amp.
    For BF tones, I think the Twin (especially a preCBS era model) would have more of that classic scooped clean/shiny tone with enough headroom for any gig...especially with a Tele or Strat.

    The Cowtipper, which I've owned, has a warmer/jazzier clean to it that the Twin (stock) probably couldnt do. The Bruno has just as much detail, and with as tight or tighter bottom end. Reverb would have to be a bit better too on the Cowtipper, IME. The CT is just a flat out great amp....

    As is a vintage mid 60's Twin Reverb.

    My .02,
    S.
    j
     
  17. 57special

    57special Silver Supporting Member

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    If you can afford it, get a Bruno CT. No downside compared to a Twin, really, unless you do the chicka chicka funk rhythym thing a lot, in which case you might appreciate the thinner Twin sound.
    If you're comparing with the smaller fender amps, there are other factors to consider, but we're talking Twins, right? I've owned a 2x10 Bruno Ct 90, and numerous Twins over the years... if the price was right i would never hesitate to take the CT90 over the Twin, even if it was loaded with vintage C12N's.
     
  18. Butterfly

    Butterfly Gold Supporting Member

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    I have a 66 Twin Reverb, and a CT45 combo. I underscore that they are different amps albeit in a common space. For instance, the reverb on the CT is incredibly powerful, in that it barely needs to be engaged to get a reverb. Turned all the way up, it is almost overwhelming.
    I find the CT to be deeper more resonant, with the FTR to be "snappier" and with more punch. That said, i use the CT more frequently to take some pressure off the old twin.
    BTW, both amps are heavy, but I think the FTR is heavier.
    Bfly
     
  19. Butterfly

    Butterfly Gold Supporting Member

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    I have a 66 Twin Reverb, and a CT45 combo. I underscore that they are different amps albeit in a common space. For instance, the reverb on the CT is incredibly powerful, in that it barely needs to be engaged to get a reverb. Turned all the way up, it is almost overwhelming.
    I find the CT to be deeper more resonant, with the FTR to be "snappier" and with more punch. That said, i use the CT more frequently to take some pressure off the old twin.
    BTW, both amps are heavy, but I think the FTR is heavier.
    Bfly
     
  20. Tag

    Tag Gold Supporting Member

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    Hey Jato!
    I actually like the Fenders (especially my HR DeVille) a bit more for jazz than the Cowtippers in a way. The fatness of jazz guitars can be overwhelming sometimes with the fatness of the Cowtipper. I compensate by turning the treble up and mids down on the Cow. For anything other than pure jazz, I prefer the Cowtipper.
     

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