Fuchs ODS Classic - what's the word?

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20
I always wanted a Fuchs, so I recently saved a used clean machine 150 from a guitar center, and it's seriously fantastic. I haven't even scratched the surface of things to do with this amp even though it only does one thing.

I'm really happy going straight in with my Es-175. However, my favorite tone is with my carvin fat boy into a sparkle drive in the front, and my Yamaha UD-Stomp in the loop. Sometimes, I'll sub the sparkle drive for a maxon sd-9, which is different, but it's so transparent and adds just the right amount of sustain and grit. As I said, fantastic.

Oh, I took out the V30's that were in my open back PRS cab, and put in some Golds. I'm even happier, but still want to experiment with speakers. They change the whole thing SO much.

Oh! Andy, can I use this amp as a bass amp? Like jazz trio level? With a bass cab? I need to holler at you guys for a foot switch too. Typical guitar center "it didn't come with one." Once I decide what funtions I'd want to control from the ground, I'll be in touch.
 

Fuchsaudio

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7,708
You are right Andy. My wording was bad. I was talking about things like onboard fx loops, reverb, and the like. The things you mention I would agree should have little, if any effect on tone.
I can tell you one of the biggest challenges at the beginning (thanks Gil Ayan), was integrating a loop/reverb that didn't suck tone or mess with the tone and feel of the amp. It wasn't easy. I remember Graydon Stuckey e-mailing me about how much trouble he had doing it in some early D-clones he worked on. I figured that might have been what you meant TAG.
 
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Fuchsaudio

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7,708
LOL!!! Dont let Alan see that! MR. My amps have nothing to do with Dumbles.
:p
He's smarter than you think. It keeps him out of the dreaded D-amp thread pissing contests. I was a little surprised, but it is what it is.
 
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Fuchsaudio

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7,708
In fact, didn't YOU post one of those in a music store with a Dumble?
Dave: If you are referring to Tag, yes, I think he posted something shot at Lark Street Guitars where a Fuchs ODS combo was play tested against the real thing. Surprisingly close (and it had to be five or more years ago before his suspension here).

Buzzy at Lark Street apparently has a good friendship with Dumble, and he's "a little uncomfortable" with having amps like ours around the shop. I respect that. Personally, I a/b'ed an ODS combo against a real Dumble he had there (a year or so ago)....darn close. His salesman agreed..."maybe you want to take this one back"...lol.
 

Dave_C

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14,114
Oh and while I am here, if Al Di Meola, plays a Fuchs, that is good enough for me :)

Look forward to checking out the UA version soon.
IMO, Al's tone has never been better than with his Fuchs! And, I've been a fan of his since the early to mid 70s and have seen him many times. He was a huge influence. Once again, none of my comments have anything to do with tone, only timing. I would still have my Fuchs HRM if it had the darn EQ pots on the chassis. I would probably own an ODS-II if it have been available in 2010! Love Fuchs amps!
 

Dave_C

Member
Messages
14,114
Dave: If you are referring to Tag, yes, I think he posted something shot at Lark Street Guitars where a Fuchs ODS combo was play tested against the real thing. Surprisingly close (and it had to be five or more years ago before his suspension here).

Buzzy at Lark Street apparently has a good friendship with Dumble, and he's "a little uncomfortable" with having amps like ours around the shop. I respect that. Personally, I a/b'ed an ODS combo against a real Dumble he had there (a year or so ago)....darn close. His salesman agreed..."maybe you want to take this one back"...lol.
That was it!!! Now, I remember. I agree that they were extremely close. And, you could hear a lot of detail in that recording, so it wasn't a matter of the recording obfuscating the issue.

Oh, it's also worth noting that the Fuchs had built-in spring reverb, as I recall, and that did not detract from the tone at all. Just made it more convenient!
 

Joe Perry

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
2,988
I always wanted a Fuchs, so I recently saved a used clean machine 150 from a guitar center, and it's seriously fantastic. I haven't even scratched the surface of things to do with this amp even though it only does one thing.

I'm really happy going straight in with my Es-175. However, my favorite tone is with my carvin fat boy into a sparkle drive in the front, and my Yamaha UD-Stomp in the loop. Sometimes, I'll sub the sparkle drive for a maxon sd-9, which is different, but it's so transparent and adds just the right amount of sustain and grit. As I said, fantastic.

Oh, I took out the V30's that were in my open back PRS cab, and put in some Golds. I'm even happier, but still want to experiment with speakers. They change the whole thing SO much.

Oh! Andy, can I use this amp as a bass amp? Like jazz trio level? With a bass cab? I need to holler at you guys for a foot switch too. Typical guitar center "it didn't come with one." Once I decide what funtions I'd want to control from the ground, I'll be in touch.
You're the one who bought it!! I was eyeing that up then it was gone! I guess I'm going to have to contact Andy. I heard him saying on a recent podcast that he still has a limited number of CM's that he can make.
 

Tag

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
39,002
That was it!!! Now, I remember. I agree that they were extremely close. And, you could hear a lot of detail in that recording, so it wasn't a matter of the recording obfuscating the issue.

Oh, it's also worth noting that the Fuchs had built-in spring reverb, as I recall, and that did not detract from the tone at all. Just made it more convenient!



Dave. Just for the record. They were NOT extremely close. Do you think really I would have sold my 3 TwoRocks which I LOVED, a Guild 1959 Johnny Smith,a Gibson 1963 Johnny Smith, A Guild Artist award, a Guild X500, Gibson 335, not one, but two Ultra RARE PRS Artist 3 semi hollow trems, which were my main 2 guitars, a Fender CS Strat, A Chapin Stratahoula, and other stuff just to get ONE Dumble if it was "Extremely close"??? It would be a cold day in hell before I would do that. :D

The Dumble. Smooth as glass, lower mids that are so big its frightening, that chirp on top, and the vocal vowel, built in phase shifter that I have never heard in ANY clone, or ANY other amp other than a few Dumbles, and now my Quinns. Seriously...listen to that tone in the clip. #183 in my large downstairs room. :p IMO, it KILLS Fords amp, and I would be the last person on earth to say that. I have seen him more times than you. Lol!

http://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/player.cfm?type=single&songid=11504386&q=hi

VERY,VERY GOOD!!


:banana:banana:banana:banana:banana
 

Puckbucker

Member
Messages
1,291
3 TwoRocks which I LOVED, a Guild 1959 Johnny Smith,a Gibson 1963 Johnny Smith, A Guild Artist award, a Guild X500, Gibson 335, not one, but two Ultra RARE PRS Artist 3 semi hollow trems, which were my main 2 guitars, a Fender CS Strat, A Chapin Stratahoula, and other stuff
That's not a trade - that's a store :) Or a great gear museum!
 

Dave_C

Member
Messages
14,114
Dave. Just for the record. They were NOT extremely close. Do you think really I would have sold my 3 TwoRocks which I LOVED, a Guild 1959 Johnny Smith,a Gibson 1963 Johnny Smith, A Guild Artist award, a Guild X500, Gibson 335, not one, but two Ultra RARE PRS Artist 3 semi hollow trems, which were my main 2 guitars, a Fender CS Strat, A Chapin Stratahoula, and other stuff just to get ONE Dumble if it was "Extremely close"??? It would be a cold day in hell before I would do that. :D

The Dumble. Smooth as glass, lower mids that are so big its frightening, that chirp on top, and the vocal vowel, built in phase shifter that I have never heard in ANY clone, or ANY other amp other than a few Dumbles, and now my Quinns. Seriously...listen to that tone in the clip. #183 in my large downstairs room. :p IMO, it KILLS Fords amp, and I would be the last person on earth to say that. I have seen him more times than you. Lol!

http://www.soundclick.com/html5/v3/player.cfm?type=single&songid=11504386&q=hi

VERY,VERY GOOD!!


:banana:banana:banana:banana:banana
Hmmm....I seem to remember you specifically commenting on how close the Fuchs was in that video. Well, it certainly sounded very close in that recording. The #183 is definitely legendary. Cannot argue with that!!!
 

klaetos

Member
Messages
783
Andy, any plans on adding the 30 back to the lineup? I loved the option of 2 6L6 or 4 6V6 in my old ODS30 and the earlier breakup worked better for my use
 

Fuchsaudio

Member
Messages
7,708
Andy, any plans on adding the 30 back to the lineup? I loved the option of 2 6L6 or 4 6V6 in my old ODS30 and the earlier breakup worked better for my use
Perhaps in the future, it's been discussed. I think eventually the 30 will come out at the price point of the current 50-Classic and the 50 and 100 will be bumped up a a little, putting the 30 basically right where the previous Overdrive Supreme 30 used to be.
 
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Carol-AnnAmps

Member
Messages
4,854
LOL!!! Dont let Alan see that! MR. My amps have nothing to do with Dumbles.
:p
Hahaha.... :)

Absolutely, the OD2 and to some degree the OD3 uses HRM style gain staging with a Plexi PI and power amp. Thats common knowledge, I've talked about it in depth many times. I really liked the idea of driving the tonestack from a common cathode stage as opposed to a cathode follower like a Marshall because it got rid of some of the artifacts I don't like with say a JCM-800. Yes that's something that Dumble came up with that I have to give him major props for. I wanted an amp that would have a little more gain than a JCM-800 but with the character of a Plexi without any fizz or harsh upper mid/lower treble frequencies. Remember this was BEFORE anyone had even degooped or documented a Bluesmaster style circuit and the only thing Shad was building was his post count at AmpGarage asking about Dumble circuits . I do find it amazing it took other guys years to catch on with moving the pots to the front. It does require a bit more thought than just moving the pots as the ranges of those trimmers Dumble used is impractical when used as front panel controls (which they were not really intended to be).
I do also agree with you that from a pure tone standpoint having nothing on the front panel is always going to be better. The JB100 model is basically an OD2 with the entire OD circuit on the board with predefined filters made up of quality components without adjustment through fragile trimmers.
The OD2 was never designed to be put side by side in a Dumble clone fest in some guys living room with everyone playing their best Ford licks, it was designed to be used on stage for guys who played in cover/blues/wedding/classic rock bands. The seperate eq and the tube driven effects loop were added for that situation. To address Andys point, I'm not a lover of integrated reverb in a multi-channel amp, prefer to give an effects loop so people can choose their own reverb pedal/unit. It is bottom mounted with a top vent (in head form) to give much better air circulation and cooling.
I have always tried to avoid that association as much as possible because the average Dumble lover is typically looking for a particular set of tones that may or may not be found in this amp. Early customer interaction with guys like yourself made me want to make sure people knew it was not a tonal clone of a Dumble to avoid returns/misunderstandings. The OD-2 is not the best amp for those tones, I totally agree with you, but a Dumble or clone doesn't really do fast dampened power chords like the OD-2 will do either. On the other hand, it is much more suited for blues and classic rock, not the Ford/Carlton thing.
Bear in mind that its function and tone that the average player is looking for, not a particular design architecture. The fact I did use an HRM style circuit obviously (an unfortunately) placed me in the Dumble category. However, 2500 amps later its not really seen that way any more as the CA's have always had their own thing going on tonally that is very much more in a modified Marshall vein. The newer models like the Triptik 2 have absolutely nothing in common with any Dumble, not even a common cathode driven tonestack.

With regards to what you like, don't think I don't understand, I do. For anyone that has played a number of real Dumbles, there is a certain thing (I hear it more in the clean channel) that is uniquely his signature. Everyone's ears hear things differently and have preferences towards certain things. To be successful in this business, there has to be some identifier that is common across everything you do. I totally hear Dumbles signature in the Ultra-Phonix Marshall I have here right now that he modified and thats nothing at all like an ODS (Dumble Overdrive Special , not Fuchs), yet some of the ODS clean character is absolutely there. There's a certain swirl to the clean tone that is always present in his amps. However the amp doesn't overdrive anywhere close to like what I like when pushed hard. For me I would rather focus on that tone in a Plexi Marshall, but who knows what the original guy he modified this for wanted. What I'm talking about here is not someones ability to select the same parts to clone something, its designing to a target that YOU like. You can't avoid your own signature.

All of this hopefully explains why I have always shied away from the Dumble comparison thing, I was truly and honestly never trying to clone a Dumble.
Possibly could we finally move on from this lot ? Its 12 years on bro, I'm still building amps for a living and what I did seems to have worked out pretty well despite it not being your thing.
 
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Faded

Member
Messages
4,132
No worries...save up your coins.....we're beta testing a mini-112 ODS combo now that's stupid cool...should be out the in the fall. This is the first and only one: 100-W ET-90 Warehouse...I'm the beta-tester :)


Andy,
I'm a big fan of your amps. My ODS 30 is one of the best amps I've ever played. If a mini classic that has two or more power tubes is coming I'm on board.

Forget the TGP darlings, many of them are the fly by night, go out of business after "falling ill" and screwing customers types. There's a lot more real world value to your companies track history. Keep on rockin!
 


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