Fuzzes usually missing from pedal order recommendations lists

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by StompBoxBlues, Sep 22, 2006.

  1. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    You ever notice that fuzzs often are left off of the various "pedal order guides" that floar around the net?

    They may nominally include them in "OD's" but...really they have special needs and quirks. I never thought about this til now, because in the last month or so I have been absolutely finding myself, my musical self, in fuzzes...I'm getting what I was trying to get more out of OD's, much easier and more what I wanted. So naturally, I start noticing they aren't often mentioned in the lists, and though there are other fuzz phreaks here too, (I just became one) I really, really, get the strong feeling that we are a tiny minority in the guitar world...that most guitarists are into OD's or maybe Distortion, but much less into fuzzes.

    What also struck me...I had researched (like 3-4 years ago) many multi-effects pedals, and own a Digitech RP-7, Behringer V-amp2, seen specs for many others including the Tonelab SE....and unless I am mistaken, none of these have any "fuzz" patches. I was really wondering why not, since this could easily be added....though maybe modeling would be tough, the circuit itself has very few components (one or two transistors, some 3-4 caps, a few resistors...) but that dynamic and that sound....

    I just wish I had saved lotsa time and started with Fuzz...learning to roll of the volume. Fuzzes take a lot more time to get used to, it is much easier to set or use an OD, but really...once you get used to a couple of things (especially guitar volume settings, when you turn off the fuzz and go to clean you need to be quick on the draw for the vol) and set it...you got more control at your fingertips than with any OD I know of.

    Just some thoughts. Maybe I am off the mark here, but it just does seem to me that's how it is.
     
  2. sampleinajar

    sampleinajar Member

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    Right there with you. A fuzz into the right amp can do sooo much - it doesn't have to just sound like a 'fuzz'. They can be quirky though, with regards to pedal placement and buffers, etc. I'll always have one.

    Steve
     
  3. nedsteve

    nedsteve Member

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    Very interesting read stompbox. I just yesterday recieved my first fuzz pedal but have been using my Korg AX3000 to do fuzz. I love the sound of fuzz ( especially in leads) and am just starting to experiment with stacking to find just the right placement on my board:NUTS .
     
  4. Phil M

    Phil M Member

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    There are no hard and fast rules, but I tend to prefer them at the front of the chain if it's a germ. fuzz face type.
     
  5. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    It's funny...the word "stacking" seems so charged for me :), like it is this rocket science (and I understand electronics)...

    But, just recently I started in fixing up my nasty old (had it since 1973 or so) Sekova little red fuzz-box, got that going and loved it! Then came the Fuzz Factory, and I struggled with IT and got some great sounds but it was a little tougher to set consistently...

    Then I got a BYOC and built it in an evening, painted it even...kinda nice, tried one type of transistor, didn't like it at all, tried the other one...fantastic! In the meantime I ordered a Sunface from Analogman. Just got that last night. I tried it immidiately and it is fantastic, AND different in a complementary way from my BYOC.

    So I took the BYOC from the pedalboard, ran just a cable from guitar->Sunface->BYOC fuzz->amp and was thinking to hear what the difference was. Sun was a little brighter...and it is the sundial version with bias knob, so I was going to see if I could get it to sound close to the BYOC, and then see how different I could get it...but in the process...while they sounded different (had the BYOC set about the same...knob-wise, and was getting a different sound though from the sunface, it wasn't as "hot" so guitar vol knob would have to go up to match the sunface where I had it set) and at one point I had both on at the same time...stacked.

    WOW...This is what I had wanted from my Jekyll & Hyde (not knocking it, it does great but...this was even more so) as it was still a nice full sound, just a little meatier. None of the loss of dynamics that often can happen with stacking. My main problem stacking seems to be the volume settings.

    Sometimes you stack and each unit is set alone at slightly above unity (volume-wise) yet when both are on the volume goes DOWN...that is probably my biggest problem with stacking of OD's anyway. Not the case so much with the fuzzes.

    The thing about them too is, it isn't as drastic with the vol control. On the Fuzz factory, as I had it set anyway, I was getting cool sounds all the way down (with almost no volume loss) to where the guitar was set at a ridiculous 2 or 3 setting, guitar tone down around 6 or so...sounded great, but turn off the fuzz and you can't hear the muffled guitar.

    But both these (BYOC and Sunface) can be set so you can turn them off and be at a good level for chords, or even solo.

    I am really loving this sound, but have to see if it translates to good sound in a band situation. To me it sounds like it would cut through but I have had cases where I thought that before to find out it really didn't (with my Blues Pro for example...which I still love but it doesn't cut).

    Have to try it out on mondays' practice.
     
  6. walpow

    walpow Guest

    I'd like to know people's thoughts on placement of fuzz vs. wah. (I tried to search, but wah is too few characters to search on.) Just got a Vox Clyde and am trying to slot it in around a Large Beaver (DIY triangle Big Muff clone). I did a quick test and have some impressions, but would like to know what others think.

    Thanks,
    Nathan
     
  7. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    Before I answer...a quick aside, I meant to mention I really needed to have some time with the new sunface I got, as I got home last night and we had been broken into. I didn't lose much (really not much, no musical equipment) but three busted up window frames (windows intact at least) and had to deal with that, my wife feeling scared, getting the windows fixed, etc. So when I got around to being able to try out the pedal...I NEEDED to play some and it was thereputic as can be.

    Anyway, on your question, absolutely for me the wah first (but make sure it is True Bypass AND has the Foxrox or equivalent wah retrofit!!).
    A really good writeup on that at www.foxroxelectronics.com if you click on Wah Retrofit.

    The reason is, if you place fuzz before wah, you'll probably notice right away the sweep of the wah is really lessened. Can't make it wail.

    If you just have a stock wah and place IT first, depending on the fuzz type (Ge or Si) you'll either get a kind of squeeling that changes as you move the pedal (I got this BIG time on my Fuzz Factory) or else too quick a sweep...too trebly, etc.

    I just got ( and will install tonight) the Foxrox retrofit. Heard good things, and it adds a tiny circuit in there to correct this problem, so the squeels go away, and it sounds as it should. The cool thing (as he mentions) about Wah before fuzz is that...if you notice how much volume controls the fuzz on input, well a wah as you sweep through the frequencies boosts some more than others, which means you are getting a kinda cool mix of over-the-top and subtle gain on the fuzz. This makes the sound I like.

    Since you want to keep the guitars ability to use vol to adjust gain on the fuzz with or without the wah on, I think it is important to buy or convert to true bypass. It has to do with the input impedance of the wah, I want it not loading down the pickups when wah is off...straight shot to the fuzz.
     
  8. James Knox

    James Knox Member

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    Fellow Fuzz Freak here!

    My fave Fuzz after trying 10 or 12 of them is the Lovepedal Karl, which I place right after a Fulltone Octavia which follows an Emma DiscomBOBulator (I don't use a Wah).

    I agree, it takes some playing and knob-turnin' finesse to get great Fuzz tone but o so gratifying when you do.

    Peace,

    James
     
  9. rollyfoster

    rollyfoster Supporting Member

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    Here's what Geoffrey Teese has to say about it:

    "
    Hi Jeff,

    The ability for any wah to operate "properly" with a fuzz all depends on the fuzz design. If the fuzz is a Fuzz Face variant, then the fuzz will need to go in front of the wah or the wah will need some type of buffer in between the wah and fuzz. This can be something like the Foxrox FWR or sometimes inline tuners have buffers that do the trick. It is a trial and error kind of thing.

    Peace, Love, and Wah,
    Geoffrey"
     

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