Germino differences: 45, 55, and 40

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by electronpirate, Mar 19, 2006.

  1. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    Checked old posts to find out about this, but no avail.

    What are the tonal differences between these models? (Don't get me started on clips...I can't play one around here)

    Here's my guess:

    45: Less gain, better cleans, headroom.
    40: Clean up to 12 noon, then pretty much classic OD.
    55: The gainiest of the three. Still cleans up well. And please tell me the difference between the 55 and 55LV (I know diff transformers, etc, but what TONAL difference is there?)

    And relatively little volume difference between these.

    Anyone who's own'd/played all of these chime in? I think I've finally come down to a Germino, now the question is which one? I like the 40 to be able to put 6v6's in there for lower breakup/volume, but I probably would want the one with the most singing gain.

    I know alot of questions there, but help me out here?

    EP
     
  2. KLB

    KLB Member

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    You can get the Club 40 with the 33K/500p tone stack instead of stock 56k/250p. This will give you more mids for more overdrive. This is what the LV55 and Lead 55 have, except they have the split cathode arrangement, which I don't like as much. Put in a Solid State rectifier if you need more punch. Ultimately, EL34 sound the best in the Club 40, though you can use 6V6 or 5881 with good results.

    (Hint: You might want to look into the Heritage Colonial for more tonal options within the same basic formula as the Germino amps...)
     
  3. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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  4. ricoh

    ricoh Member

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    LV55.......early break up too. Give Greg G a call..........he will be the most helpful

    Rico
     
  5. tcrash

    tcrash Supporting Member

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    Greg is a great guy, and super smart. He will be happy to explain all the differences. He is also a great player so can put it in laymans terms.
     
  6. jkr

    jkr Supporting Member

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    I've owned the Lead 55, Classic 45, and Club 40. I still own the Classic 45 out of the three. You can put 6v6s in the Classic 45 with a 5y3 rectifier tube. I've tried it and it sounds very good. Your guess as to the principal differences between the amps at the beginning of your post is pretty much correct.
     
  7. Softpaw

    Softpaw Member

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    Talk to Greg Germino, of course.

    I've only owned the Club 40, but I've researched and discussed these amps more than a little bit...

    Since you want "the most singing gain" (none are gainy amps, actually!!), narrow things down immediately by eliminating the Classic 45. It runs cleaner, has more negative feedback, and is not optimized for el34's.

    Next, if getting the classic OD tones at the most reasonable volume is a goal-- eliminate the Lead 55, and focus on the Club 40 and Lead 55 LV.

    As has been pointed out already, and which Greg G. will confirm (and which is suggested at the web site), the Club 40 can be arranged to be very close to a Lead 55 LV. ( In standard form the Club 40 puts out about 35 watts compared to the 55 LV's 50 watts.)

    Between the Club 40 and Lead 55 LV, I would say you really can't go too far wrong. It get's very, very subjective at that point, and increasingly dependent on all the other elements in the rest of your tone chain, IMHO.
     
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  8. Softpaw

    Softpaw Member

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    This is from the Aug. 2004 Germino announcement for the CLUB 40:
     
  9. sws1

    sws1 Member

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    I don't know. I have a C45, and if you run the bright vol on 8 or higher, it's pretty singing and smooth. Put in EL34s, and it sings with a lot more bite.

    I suspect the only way you're really gonna know what you want is to hear them.

    And don't forget speakers...they make a very big difference in tone and volume.
     
  10. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    I'm hip.

    And a small apology. There was plenty of Germino info in the archives...too lazy to look hard enough.

    A very confusing question. I see more gain in the LV55, but also if I ask for a mod on the C40.

    Was thinking about asking for a combo w/greenies (to answer the speaker question).
     
  11. Softpaw

    Softpaw Member

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    According to Greg Germino (above) the Club 40 has only a "wee bit less"preamp gain-- but the design allows MORE power tube distortion/ compression at a given volume level.

    Of course, there's nothing preventing you from putting something like a KLON or similar boost in front of the Club for wee bit more gain if needed. :AOK

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Cf.
    Germino Club 40: Tight and punchy or soft and mellow? (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=81139)
     
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  12. KLB

    KLB Member

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    Greg is using the same output transformer in the Club 40, LV55 and Lead 55. The filtering, voltages, rectification type and certain preamp values are different.

    When I had both an LV55 and Club 40, I couldn't tell much difference in volume.

    My Club 40 has less filtering than stock. I have the C45 values of 32/32/16/16/16mf instead of 32/32/32/32/30mf. It feels better this way. But then, I have it setup in a 1x12 combo, so I don't need it to be as punchy.
     
  13. Softpaw

    Softpaw Member

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    So when Greg G. wrote the following, it was true at the time, but no longer true for current versions?:

     
  14. Softpaw

    Softpaw Member

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    The standard C45's have significantly more negative feedback than standard Club 40's, according to Greg Germino (2/2006), giving the C45 more linearity/ later distortion onset and less "swirl" .
     
  15. dewman

    dewman Gold Supporting Member

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    ANyone run the Vox phase inverter values in their Germino amps for easier breakup??
     
  16. John55

    John55 Member

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    I've got the Classic 45 and the 55LoVo, totally different amps in most every way. The 45 is a blues machine, but if you wind it up it will sing very nicely. It has a lovely thick tone, and that classic KT66 crunch. The 55LV is much more gainy and a lot louder. Greg says it has the most gain of all his models. You can use 6V6s in it as well, and by doing so you've basically made his old Masonette out of it. You can also use a plug in s/s rectifier which will tighten it up a bit, but it isn't ever going to be a lead 55. If you want the most gain coupled with the option of using 6V6s, this is the model to get. The lead 55 runs a s/s rectifier and a higher plate voltage, plus different filtering. It has a tighter feel and faster response, plus it's louder than the LoVo55. His latest version doesn't run as high of plate voltage as the early amps, which made 480v on the plates. This was putting too much strss on some of the weaker tubes out there, so he lowered it a bit. In any case, it's a '69 Marshall 50w tone all the way, very raw and rock oriented. The Club 40 is much like an old JMP50, much less gain than either of the 55s and not as loud. I'd call it the EL34 version of the 45, as the front end is similar on both amps. It and the 45 are the two least aggressive amps, and also make the least amount of volume. These two proably are the best pedal platform amps he makes. The 55s need no pedals, just turn 'em up and be ready to rock!
     
  17. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    Just to understand, do you mean that IF you put in 6V6's you have to change the rectifier to a 5y3?

    I have gone back and forth with my Classic 45, I bought it used and have no idea how long the tubes have been in there, or if I ought to try different preamp and/or output tubes. I have this love/like relationship with the amp, but just recently tried my Epi Les Paul (had been using a strat) and a Cot50 with it and suddeny am LOVING the amp.

    I wrote about this in the strings & things forum, just now.

    I am going a little nuts trying to decide which input to use, whether to jumper or not, and just what I want or expect out of the amp. Mainly, with the cot50 on input I am finally getting that Allman bros./Haynes sound. Played along with some Gov't Mule too and it sounded damned close to me.

    Any suggestions appreciated, like what 6V6's will give me (no clean? at band volumes?) etc.
     
  18. Bo Faulkner

    Bo Faulkner Member

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    I own a Club 40 and a 71 50 watt marshall.. The 40 is beautiful sounding from 1 up on the volume.. more lowend than the marshall and fantastic clean tones.. cranked with the right tone settings (mids and presence pegged and treble rolled off) it can get nearly as gainy as my marshall.. at a friendlier volume.. not as tough on the ears but overall very similar sounding. 9 out of 10 people would probably say it sounds "better" in a blind taste test. With tone controls straight up it nails Dickie betts type stuff. Very versatile with the good cleans (I could do a jazz or country gig with it if needed)

    The marshall on the other hand has to be bridged to get good cleans and the lows dont really fill out till you get it cooking (due to bright cap) It gets super saturated (in a good way) and can be punishing on the ears no matter where the tone controls are. I'd say the best way to describe the Germino is an extremely well built marshall with tone controls that work
     
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  19. 4styx

    4styx Member

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    Do a search for North Carolina Amp Fest.There's some great demos of Germino amps by Greg.
     
  20. dewman

    dewman Gold Supporting Member

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    Absolutely well said Bo!



     

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