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"Ghost notes" vs. "Cone Cry" ??

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by hepmike, Jun 15, 2005.

  1. hepmike

    hepmike Member

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    What's the difference?
    What i'm hearing is a high-pitch alternate note, almost 'harmonizing' (but not in a pleasing way!) with the note i am playing. It is predominately occurring when i am playing high-register (single) notes on the B string...

    It's coming from a pair of (older) Mojo Ceramic 10's, and they would definitely be 'broken-in' by this point...

    Thanks for your help!
     
  2. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    I've had ghost notes and cone cry.

    Ghost notes come from the amp and for me have typically been most audible when bending the 3rd string around the 7th fret: an off-harmonic pitch that is lower than the note being played.

    Cone cry comes from the speaker and for me has typically been most audible on the high E string up around the 14th fret: an exact octave lower pitch than the note being played.
     
  3. Macaroni

    Macaroni Member

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    Hepmike... That's cone cry for sure. Ghost notes are phantom notes that resonate simultaneously with the note you are playing, usually lower and not quite as loud. If you're playing with music you may not hear it. With cone cry you'll hear it. There's not much you can do about it. I've been moving to higher powered speakers, ie: 100W vs 30W, and that takes care of it for the most part.
     
  4. hepmike

    hepmike Member

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    that's what i thought.
    years ago i owned a Budda Twinmaster; loved the amp- ended up selling it when i had a shop- but it suffered horribly from 'cone cry'. now i picked one up again-same Mojo ceramic 10's in it- and there it is AGAIN! so it would seem to be some sort of frequency 'disagreement' between the amp and the speakers, i suppose?
    the speakers sound a bit 'tired' anyway, and i've ordered a pair of EMI Ragin' Cajun's for it (75 watts) so hopefully the higher power will help? i guess i will find out....
     
  5. Macaroni

    Macaroni Member

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    I have a Ragin Cajun that I use with my Kingsley D32 and it doesn't cry, so you should be good. Great, well balanced speaker BTW.
     
  6. Bryan T

    Bryan T Guitar Owner Silver Supporting Member

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    Your post leaves me a bit puzzled. A friend has a Dr. Z Route 66 played through a Z Best cab that sounded like it added a lower octave to a note when you played above the 12th fret. In another thread Perry R attributed that behavior to the amp (maybe the transformer?), but it sounds like you would attribute it to the speakers. I wonder which it is? I didn't really care for that behavior with the amp.

    Bryan
     
  7. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    The Rt 66 has some ghosting (more with older ones, less with newer ones, apparently). The octave thingy is most likely cone cry........I've had a number of V30's with CC (Z Best has a V30 in it, right?). Best way to decide for yourself about CC vs GN is to change amps & speakers and see what makes the sound go away. This is how I made my determination.
     
  8. Bryan T

    Bryan T Guitar Owner Silver Supporting Member

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    John,

    Thanks for the input. We were definitely pushing the amp when it was doing this octaving.

    Bryan
     
  9. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    And at higher vols is when you get cone cry, too. ;)
     
  10. Roccaforte Amps

    Roccaforte Amps Member

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    Amplifier Ghost notes can appear anywhere on the fretboard,
    but most commonly arount the 12th to 14th fret.
    This is not cone cry. Cone cry is a "low" frequency oscillation.
     
  11. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    Here's my experience with "cone cry":

    (1) Amp A thru speaker A produced an octave lower pitch on the high E string at the 14th fret. No octave lower pitch sounded one or two frets above or below this position.

    (2) Amp A thru speaker B did not produce this effect.

    (3) Amp B thru speaker A produced the effect in (1) above.

    (4) Amp B thru speaker B did not produce this effect.



    Here's my experience with "ghost notes":

    Amp A with any guitar or speaker produced an off-harmonic pitch lower in frequency and lower in volume to the note being played. The off-harmonic pitch was most audible on the 3rd string around the 7th fret.



    Perhaps my nomenclature is incorrect......I dunno. But I conclude that the first phenomenon I mentioned is speaker related, and the second phenomenon is amp-related.
     
  12. riffmeister

    riffmeister Gold Supporting Member

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    hey, let's throw out one more term:

    "Voice coil rub"

    I had one speaker which produced these loud, horrible off-frequency pitches when playing up on the E string above the 12th fret. I mean HORRIBLE unmusical sounding artifacts!

    This speaker is now serving as a paperweight in my basement.......literally! :D
     

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