Gibson / Play Authentic

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by presence, Jun 13, 2019.

  1. presence

    presence Member

    Messages:
    734
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002


    Unusual that they make a youtube video about it, but I respect they want to protect their intellectual property. Gibson's definition of their intellectual property hasn't always resonated with the federal courts (e.g. PRS Singlecut), but there are tons of dead-on copies out there from the US and all over the world.

    Really wondering how long it will take this thread to erupt in a flame war and get deleted.
     
    tonedover likes this.
  2. Benz2112

    Benz2112 Supporting Member

    Messages:
    2,760
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2017
    Location:
    Utica, NY
    Weird flex, but ok. Take that, Gil Yaron!
     
    Teclo4, JasonElGato, bdm and 3 others like this.
  3. Magnets And Melodies

    Magnets And Melodies Member

    Messages:
    4,073
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    Location:
    Alberta
    It's weird for me to say this... Being a Gibson fanatic myself... But...

    That was a bunch of hooplah.

    I'm not saying don't protect your trademarks, but guys... Have a bit of humility. The Henry era is barely over, and you've done one big marketing change since then... You're not completely out of the gate yet. Focus on making the best guitars you ever have... You still have a long way to go with the USA lineup.

    I feel sort of conflicted when people talk about Gibson these days. On one hand, I'm absolutely in love and addicted/obsessed with what I think is the best guitar in the world today - Custom Shop Historic Les Paul's (and I love my 335's too). My love for these guitars runs deep.....

    But the company rubs me the wrong way - yes, the new guys rub me the wrong way. It kinda hurts to listen to Mark on these videos, because for as much as he is speaking about being authentic and original, it sounds like he's reading off a teleprompter, given a script by his bosses. Checkout his videos at Norm's and it seems like he's being himself, enjoying it all.... with these videos it's all eyes on the cue cards.

    I can't stand this, "only we're good enough" macho type of image and mentality they're selling. I feel like to work there, you must wear a leather jacket, drink bourbon and be able to tap into your inner bully on demand. (Side note, as a recovering alcoholic, I notice maybe moreso than others that a lot of their promo pictures on Instagram are of their guitars on a bar, with a shitload of whiskey bottles in the background... to each their own and all, but I just wonder... why? Must be that macho thing they're trying to do....)

    Gibson dudes, listen... Yes, your custom shop comes out with amazing stuff, but on the USA production side you're still flooding us with 2 piece short tenon boat anchors that we have to sift through to find a good sounding one that won't break our backs... then, after we swap out the pickups and hardware with better quality after market stuff - we finally have a nice Les Paul! Only at that point, we coulda bought a used Custom Shop LP for the same price.

    Fix your house before pointing the finger. Want to be original? Go back to your origins then.... not just in marketing, but for real. Make guitars the way you used to.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
  4. presence

    presence Member

    Messages:
    734
    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2002
    Well said.

    I was disappointed when I saw many of the new, much-vaunted Original Collection guitars were weighing in at 9.5+ lbs. Seems like there's a limited market for that these days? I love my Les Pauls, but I have an ES-LP that is less than 7 lbs and a really light Custom Shop one. The Custom Shop had a warped control plate from the factory that I had them switch, but other than that the workmanship is great.

    It seems like they could be doing a better job of reserving the really heavy wood for the chambered guitars. I also think they could do a better job of marketing and communicating about the chambered guitars, and making some chambered guitars with more traditional appointments. Billy Gibbons plays chambered Les Pauls with chambered necks. They sound great! If I had to chose between a chambered, 1950's style Les Paul and a 9.5 lb Les Paul Classic that were about the same price, it would be an easy choice.
     
  5. Jabby92

    Jabby92 Member

    Messages:
    733
    Joined:
    May 14, 2019
    Yeah, I actually like my 2016 more than the 2019s I played/looked at. All the ones I tried felt basically the same but were just heavier and had pretty plain maple tops. I have seen a few nicer ones around on the forum here, but they're more rare it seems. Even online a lot of the ones seem to weigh nearly 10 solid pounds. My 2016 is 8.9 lbs which I am happy with and I like the maple top it has as its nearly AAA flame. Also the rosewood looks dry on many of the 2019 ones I've seen, the gold top in that video had a very dry looking board.

    As always its a case of YMMV, I had to go through piles of Les Pauls to find a 2016 that I liked when I bought it.. so is the case with 2019.
     
  6. Magnets And Melodies

    Magnets And Melodies Member

    Messages:
    4,073
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    Location:
    Alberta
    The thing that got me regarding the original collection was that, they didn't really go back to anything original... They just made traditionals again and called them 50's originals. Weight is still heavy. Bodies are still 2 pieces. Tenons are still short. I'm not saying they're bad guitars I'm just saying they're nothing new for Gibson.

    For me they slapped a new name on it and beefed up marketing. The irony in that to me is that for all those guys spending top dollar on Bartlett Retrospect's and Gil Yaron's, Gibson "isn't" good enough.

    These guys should take a chill pill and listen to their customers. Be humble and look inward. I'm not saying don't protect your IP, but real polished companies do that behind closed doors with a handshake and a smile - not out in public with big egos and threats.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
    Theorist, Chris Scott, JLee and 5 others like this.
  7. jm9239

    jm9239 Supporting Member

    Messages:
    2,107
    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2012
    This will be an interesting thread.

    I was intrigued by the 2019 USA lineup, but the majority of the Original Collection LPs I've seen have been in the 9-10.5 lb range. To me, it would appear as though Gibson is using the line as a way to dump their heavier wood. A boat anchor with questionable quality is not acceptable IMHO, especially at $2500, which is why I personally will not be going "authentic" with Gibson.

    In related news, I just bought a PRS and it's glorious.
     
  8. wetordry

    wetordry Member

    Messages:
    3,842
    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Location:
    virginia mountains
    Odd third quarter.
    Oh well......you've been warned. And hollywood: you too. Call us, we'll do lunch.
     
  9. Jabby92

    Jabby92 Member

    Messages:
    733
    Joined:
    May 14, 2019
    Nothing has really 'changed' with Gibson this year, IMO. The QC thing was always overblown by most of the internet and it seems to be more consistent now and improved but the guitars themselves have not changed a lot to be like 'holy ****, I gotta buy one now'. I have a 2016 and looked at the 2019s and most were basically the same but heavier.

    One thing I noticed is up until this year, the Traditionals had 'traditional weight relief' where they'd do some minor chambering to the body. Now the new 2019s don't have that, but instead they have lighter weight aluminum hardware instead of the old zamak/nickel hardware. So in other words, Gibson saved a little bit of weight with the hardware but is no longer taking the time to slim the body down some.

    Interestingly I weighed my hardware and by going from zamak/nickel (bridge, tailpiece, etc).. its about 0.3 lbs in weight to change over to the aluminum. This let me get my 2016 under 9 pounds which I did to upgrade it.

    So in the end, I actually prefer my 2016.. the 2019s are good simple Les Pauls.. but I like a reasonable weight and not a pile of lumber.
     
  10. pattste

    pattste Member

    Messages:
    1,394
    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2007
    Location:
    Montreal, QC
    They can't for the simple reason that they have to make too many of them. You can get one piece mahogany backs, you just can't get enough of them to make thousands upon thousands of guitars year after year. Gibson guitars, even those of the "custom shop" are factory-made production guitars. Gibson doesn't have a real custom shop like PRS with its Private Stock. Even the Made to Measure guitars have an extremely limited palette of options.
     
  11. Laservampire

    Laservampire Member

    Messages:
    874
    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2009
    Nothing says "quality guitars" like bunch of corporate d!ck-swinging...
     
  12. Magnets And Melodies

    Magnets And Melodies Member

    Messages:
    4,073
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    Location:
    Alberta
    So make it an option then. One piece bodies at full price, 2 piece bodies slightly less. Make as many as you can. Give us that option without forcing us to go "custom".

    Sorry, I need to reiterate... I absolutely am in love with Gibson guitars.. but videos like these with the macho attitude just rub me the wrong way.
     
    JLee and presence like this.
  13. PartoftheDark

    PartoftheDark Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2015
    Location:
    The Greater DC Zone
    The booze industry really hijacked live music for a long time. I recall one of the things Fugazi tried to make happen was all ages shows which, if you're into making your money from selling drinks instead of tickets, that's going to clash. Even as a non-alcoholic that's always bothered me. So seeing promo shots and things like that, it's kind of like them latching onto a specific relatively troublesome aspect of music and saying, "Guess whose side we're on!" in no uncertain terms.
     
  14. Jabby92

    Jabby92 Member

    Messages:
    733
    Joined:
    May 14, 2019
    To be honest the body piece thing doesn't bother me much. I think I mentioned in a previous thread how even the old late 50s Les Pauls, like the real ones, actually had 2 piece backs in many cases. A 1 piece is always nice, but I don't get too hung up on it as long as the 2 piece is matched well. A mismatched 2 piece does look tacky, especially if 1 slab of wood is much lighter/darker than the other.. but otherwise I can get past that.

    But you're right, they could easily make it an option. You actually could find the odd 1 piece USA Les Paul for many years but I'm yet to find a 2019 that is.
     
  15. Family Man

    Family Man Silver Supporting Member

    Messages:
    1,184
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Location:
    South/Central IL
    This video screams insecurity to me. Not a good look for Gibson or for Mark.

    "To the manufacturers, you've been warned." My goodness, what a joke.
     
  16. Brad8008135

    Brad8008135 Member

    Messages:
    1,815
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2015
    Location:
    Down on Peachtree Street
    Mickey Mouse ears on the 335; I never made the Walt Disney connection. Thanks, Mark.

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Steve Hotra

    Steve Hotra Silver Supporting Member

    Messages:
    7,782
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2007
    Location:
    Camas WA.
    LOL
    Disney fiercely protects all of the "images, etc"
     
  18. BrokenRomeo

    BrokenRomeo Supporting Member

    Messages:
    1,840
    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2007
    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    If Gibson really wanted to do something about the counterfeiters, which I assume is the point of this video, not PRS and other brand "singlecut" guitars loosely based on a Les Pauls...simply give the Epiphone's an authentic headstock shape. Fender, PRS, etc., don't seem to have a problem making their lower cost guitars look authentic.
     
  19. Steve Hotra

    Steve Hotra Silver Supporting Member

    Messages:
    7,782
    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2007
    Location:
    Camas WA.
    I own a 1970" J45 deluxe and a 1983 335 dot... and I love those two guitars.
    But.. really Gibson?
    Who cares about how you feel?
    Ive played the modern 335's at GC, and its a crapshoot. They are so inconsistent in build, feel and quality.
    No wonder competitors like PRS are beating them.
    IMHO.. Fender is the more creative company.. just in the introduction of new designs, for one.
     
  20. budglo58

    budglo58 Member

    Messages:
    1,763
    Joined:
    May 12, 2009
    I sold a 13 Traditional because it weighed over 10 lbs. I’ve been playing my 335 much of the time. I love the weight of it at less than 8 lbs. My Classic is at 9.5 . I checked out a 60s Standard , but at 9.5 and up ,I wouldn’t be gaining anything but a nicer top imo. Agreed, mostly marketing bs.
     
    wetordry and presence like this.

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice