Discussion in 'The Pub' started by Shredzilla, Dec 7, 2017.
Regarding the OP (i.e., why Pentangeli backed down) - context is everything. None of those guys would want to rat on the "club" in front of their own family, much less their brother. No actual words needed to be spoken, bro sent a loud-and-clear "don't do it" message just by being there.
As to who killed the failed-assassins, there are a few possibilities:
Fredo - He could have killed the assassins out of panic whenever he realised the hit had failed. This could have happened two ways - he might have given Roth information allowing him to access the compound, or allowed a mole in, and once he realised what transpired, murdered the assassins inside the compound out of fear. Or, of course, he could have been well aware all along a hit was going to take place and killed the assassins out of self preservation. However, if Fredo had killed them, it raises questions as to how he knew exactlywhere they would be (and how he could kill them with no other guard on the compound knowing). If Fredo did kill the assassins, it's difficult to imagine he wasn't well aware there was an assassination plot.
Fredo's Men - Fredo is a caporegime, so he has a lot of men under him. He could have had one of those men kill the assassins (then either hushed his man with money or killed him to silence him). However, the biggest issue with this idea is the notion that Fredo could offer someone more than Michael could (or could intimidate someone more than Michael could).
Michael's Guards - It is of course possible that Michael's guards killed the assassins. These guys are mafia men - they're not trained soldiers. If they cornered an assassin and the assassin raised his gun, it's unlikely they would be aiming for the shoulder or foot. It's perfectly plausible that a scenario like this occurred and Michael's men killed everyone.
The movie (or books) don't ever actually say exactly who killed the assassins, but this conversationoccurs after the hit:
If we catch these guys do you think we'll be able to find out who's backing them?
That's not the catch -- unless I'm very wrong, they're dead already. They're killed by somebody close to us -- inside. Very, very scared they botched it.
What about your people ROCCO and NERI? You don't think that they had something to do with this.
You see -- all our people are business men, their loyalty is based on that. Now, one thing that I learned from Pop was to try to think as people around you think. Now on that basis, anything's possible.
So Michael certainly suspects an inside man. Given that we later find out Fredo betrayed Michael, that most likely scenario does seem to be that Fredo himself killed the assassins.
To reiterate however, all of this is just speculation, as it is never confirmed in either the films or books.
You gotta assume Johnny Ola.
You are correct.
No way did Fredo kill the assassins. Fredo bumbled and dropped the gun when Pop was gunned down buying produce. Fredo has no killer instinct--he's soft.
I don't think it was Fredo. I don't think he ever thought it was a hit. Could be that one of them killed the other, then killed himself. Sal may have done it too, traitor that he was. You really disappointed me fish.
They'll set up a meeting. At that meeting you'll be assassinated. Whoever approaches you with the meeting is the traitor.
I had a guppy named Abe Vigoda.
Let's keep pretending Godfather Part III never happened.
I want those Rosato brothers dead! Morte.
Tom,can you het me outta this
For old-time sake?
Can't do it Sally
Quando il fratello di Frank gli ha dato quello sguardo. Hai visto la minaccia nei suoi occhi?
Spoiler: In English
When Frank's brother gave him that look. Did you see the threat in his eyes?
"Can you get me off the hook?"
I was all ready to discount your post until I got to the last part. While it may not be that way, it certainly is plausible. I honestly think Fredo was too weak and feeble minded to do it, but, Hyman Roth certainly had the mind and people to use Fredo and set that up.
As A-Bone said, the scene in question shows the power of editing. If the Senate scene had included side bits about the family back in Sicily now being endangered, that would bent the scene a certain direction. It was more powerful as it is -- the brother's stricken stare at his brother is all about honor. That riveting look on the brother's face says: "You'd testify to the authorities?"
Then later when Tom is talking to Frank in prison, Frank goes on about his brother is ten times tougher, could have had his own family if he came to America.
I saw an interesting documentary about southern Italy and Sicily on PBS a few years ago. Throughout history, the northern powers were always looting the south. So in the southern precincts there came to be a strong suspicion of outsiders. You only trusted your family and fellow villagers, who wrapped themselves in a protective bond. When the people emigrated to America, their lifelong attitudes remained.
As Tom said to Kay after the hearing, "It was between the brothers."
This is pretty much universally true throughout the world. And in Italy, it's far more than just "northern vs. southern" - e.g., Sicilians don't trust non-Sicilians, Napolitanos don't trust non-Napolitanos, etc.
"What part of the boot are you from?"
It’s never been clear to me exactly what Fredo did.