Help setting up my In-Ear mix

Discussion in 'Recording/Live Sound' started by boltrecords, Jan 24, 2012.

  1. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    Hello all.
    I was hoping someone who has a great sense and ear for mixing might offer some advice on my in ear mix arrangement. I could use some tips as far as setup, panning, eq, reverb and any other helpful tips that will get me closest to an optimal live mix.

    Here's what I'm running.
    Sennheiser ew300 stereo in ear system
    JH audio jh16's ear buds
    I am running my mix into the mains of an Allen and Heath mixwizard wz3 16 channel board.
    So my mix is in stereo with independent eq for every instrument.
    I have reverb available for every channel from the on board effects.

    Channels are the following
    1. Lead vocal 1 (me)
    2. Lead vocal 2
    3. Backing vocals
    4. Backing vocals
    5. My guitar left
    6. My guitar right. Running In stereo from my axe fx
    7. Other guitar
    8. Bass guitar
    9. Snare drum mic
    10. Kick drum mic
    11. Middle tom mic
    12. Keyboard.

    I have a few channels open and I think I may need an ambient mic due to a bit of isolation.
    Also, should I be running compression on the overall mix?
    Any help would be greatly appreciated.
    Thanks
    Anthony
     
  2. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    a mixwiz all to yourself? nice!

    (i get one aux out of a 'wiz for a mono mix. still a million times better than getting blasted by stage volume and not hearing myself.)

    start with everything EQ'd flat, your vocals and guitar up a bit, everything else back.

    are you playing on big stages? if not, you may not need any drums in there, especially if you throw out an ambient mic.

    i haven't had the pleasure of a lot of stereo IEM-ing, but gently panning stuff that isn't you to one side or the other is good to get it "out of your way" while still hearing it.

    and as always, the goal is to turn the stuff you don't want down (including the stage wash you're blocking with the IEMs in the first place), rather than turning the other stuff up til you're blasting your ears again. see how quiet you can get the whole mix and still hear everything like you want.
     
  3. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    I've got the volumes at very reasonable levels but I'm struggling a bit getting everything to separate well in the mix.

    With my old ear molds I did not need drums in the mix, but these new JH audios are WAY more isolated. I can't hear anything on stage if it's not micd.

    The stages are decent sizes but still bar/club stages.

    I've never been good with mixes even while recording so I tend to pan or eq too much and not properly position instruments in the mix
     
  4. rickenbackerkid

    rickenbackerkid Member

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    I would drop the tom mic for an Ambient mic, which would get the cymbals and room sound in your ears.
    Don't pan your guitar hard left and right!
    Anything panned hard will feel and sound slightly distant compared to the centered stuff.

    Try one side in the centre, one halfway left.
    I'd balance that left guitar with the ambient mic halfway right.
    The second guitar all the right.
    Bass, Snare, Kick, your vocal up the middle, second vocal hard right.

    Reverb to taste on your vocal only - keep the other stuff dry. Too much reverb and everything will become a clustered mess. Remember you're going for SPACE, so keep everything sparse and spread out.

    Compression will make things worse, and your EW300 will limit if it needs to. Keep some headroom in between the MixWiz and the transmitter, or it will be limiting all the time and that will make everything sound like ass.
     
  5. loudboy

    loudboy Member

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    What are you using for the IEM mix? The MixWiz doesn't have a stereo Aux Buss, AFAIK.
     
  6. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    i thought he meant that he had a mixwix all to himself, like with splits off of the main snake or something. i do wonder what the rest of the band gets, though; bunch of wedges on one mix and a "f**k you"? mixwizards for everybody?
     
  7. rickenbackerkid

    rickenbackerkid Member

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    You can always just use two auxes the L & R sides of stereo.
     
  8. jdps150

    jdps150 Member

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    We use Avioms @ church. Found that panning everything left (it's digital but prolly works out to 10:00 or so) & my guitar right aroudn 10:00 helps me
     
  9. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    The rest of the band uses the auxes and I use the "mains" as my mix. So the faders control my mix, therefore I can run In Stereo. I'm the only one with a stereo unit anyways.
    The mixwizard board is only for in ears anyways so the mains weren't being used. All the signals split before hitting our iem board.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  10. twotoneguitars

    twotoneguitars Member

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    "So the faders control my mix"

    Well that's one of the problems there. If the sound guy is mixing correctly then the faders are being moved constantly to get the levels right. This changes what you hear in your ears. I am a big proponent of pre-fader IEM. Once we went to that system, most of the ear mix problems went away. Also I pan things in my ears so it's natural sounding. I do it like I'm looking at the drummer, snare goes to the right, tom1 is mostly middle, tom2 is left, kick is middle, and if there's 2 overheads they get panned respectively, if it's one, then it's in the middle. For guitars, I do it as my position on stage, if I'm on stage right, my guitar is panned right and the other guitar panned left, and visa versa. If I'm running stereo then I pan my rig respectively and the other guitarist to the side of the stage he is on. Same thing with acoustic guitars and keys. All respective to their place on stage and how I am looking at them. Some things are extreme panned and others are slightly panned. The goal is to use panning to make sound as natural as possible. If something is panned to the opposite side of how you are looking at that instrument, then it can be really disorienting and it affects the way you hear everything else.

    I rarely use any eq. Mostly just flat. The majic is in the panning. Also be very careful about volume level on you ears. I see alot of people blasting their ears WAY too loud. That also affects what you can and cannot hear. Your brain can only distinguish so much at high volume levels.

    Hope this helps.
     
  11. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    My mix is not effected by the sound guy. Our board is strictly for in ears. The house never touches it. The signal is split off to our board and then the house board.
    So the faders work just like the auxes
     
  12. twotoneguitars

    twotoneguitars Member

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    Oh, ok. The panning stuff I mentioned may help. Give it a try.
     
  13. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    I'm Gonna try it out tonight

    What type of mic is good for an ambient?

    I have a sennheiser md421, sm58, sm57 and a shure bg4.1
     
  14. Shiny McShine

    Shiny McShine Member

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    Make the ambient mic a large condenser and make it stereo also. Rely on this one mostly and fill in with the others. At least, that's how I'd go at it because I like to hear the room and feel the layout of the stage.
     
  15. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    So by stereo youre saying i should run two ambient mics?
     
  16. Shiny McShine

    Shiny McShine Member

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    Yeah. Either ORTF or XY will work. A stereo mic would be easiest because setting up two requires a little finesse to get the imaging right.
     
  17. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    jeez, is this a traveling rig? that's a lot of crap to set up!

    i could see one ambient mic in your "area", so you get the vibe of the stage.
     
  18. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    Yeah I was just thinking one ambient mic. I'm not sure what is meant by a stereo mic. I can hook the mic Into the board and pan it In stereo but that kind of defeats the purpose of the Ambient function right?

    Wouldn't I just want to keep it centered? If anything I was thinking to use two mics, one on each side of the stage and then pan the two.
    Other than that it's not that much of a rig. It all fits in one 12 space rack with everyone's In ears and the splitter snake.

    It really improved our overall sound And I've never been happier with my sound live. Not to mention my ears dont ring after a show anymore. I just need to work on my mix settings and I should be set.
     
  19. walterw

    walterw Gold Supporting Member

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    so by being the one to tweak the board, you get the master outs as your mix? nice.
     
  20. boltrecords

    boltrecords Member

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    Everyone can tweak their own mix as they please but I'm the only one who spent the extra dough and got a stereo iem system. So I needed the mains for stereo.

    I'm also the one who pushed for in ears and researched all the gear and worked on finding everything and setting it all up.

    It's great now that we don't use any wedges anymore. Stage volume is much more controlled
     

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