Hey Old Timers Tele wizards - ur.. HELP is needed

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by DonM, May 7, 2008.

  1. DonM

    DonM Member

    Messages:
    1,085
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Location:
    Signal Hill, Ca
    How would the neck pickup bleed into the bridge pickup?

    this is on a old tele 1953
    the neck bleeds in partially out of phase - not fully -
    it makes for a very unique tele tone -- IE. Roy Buchanans Nancy -

    my question is this - where would the bleed over happen at ? and how would it just be partial and not fully out of phase?

    you can here it at www.roybuchanan.org music clips
    thats me playing Roys old 53 nancy thru my amp

    I was called to go fix it - The owner Mac, thought it broke a wire loose and went out of phase when they compaired it side by side to Jim Weiders 53..

    I was called to go have a look and fix it if needed.. thats when I diosovered it was like that all along and thats how Roy got that sound.

    but were trying to recreate a repica Guitar - with Bob Stickler - some of you may rememeber his old web site and the recreated nancy -- well we are sharing - and working to replicate nancys as - is
    so if we could tweak a switch or something into bleeding the neck in slightly like 40-60% - we would be in hog heaven -- we think its the old switch somehow - maybe became magnetic or the wipers are moved???

    thanks
    Don Mare
     
  2. Dana Olsen

    Dana Olsen Gold Supporting Member

    Messages:
    7,649
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2002
    Location:
    Santa Barbara, Marin, Chico, CA
    Hey Don -

    Could it be a faulty switch that happens to sound good? Maybe one of the wipers came loose and stuck in a different spot?

    Interesting...

    Good Luck, Dana O.
     
  3. sinner

    sinner Member

    Messages:
    3,687
    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2006
    Location:
    The Expanse
    Very interesting, and I enjoyed the clip. Nancy is a very special guitar--some secret weapon.

    Now I'll go home at listen more carefully to my '53 (replica).
     
  4. DonM

    DonM Member

    Messages:
    1,085
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Location:
    Signal Hill, Ca
    now thats the hard part -- how in the heck????????
     
  5. treeofpain

    treeofpain Silver Supporting Member

    Messages:
    6,409
    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2007
    Location:
    Columbia, SC
    My January 52 does the same thing. It is an odd bird. If you put a meter on the bridge pu, you get no reading, but it works great. It is a bit microphonic, which may contribute to this effect. It also makes the guitar sound MUCH COOLER IMO. I've run across a few other old teles that have this same phenomenon.

    Not much help technically, I'm afraid...
     
  6. DANOCASTER

    DANOCASTER Supporting Member

    Messages:
    3,284
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2003
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    I've seen this too and always attributed it to a switch on its way out - although I certainly may be wrong about that

    the PARTIAL phase is what's so crazy - but probably, ultimately, where that special tone comes from

    Doing it methodically w/ a new pickup and 3 way switch seems like a GIANT task - especially making it LOOK "stock".

    maybe w/ a small variable phase pot and a blend pot ?

    good luck w/ that - it'd be incredible to figure that one out !!
     
  7. oscar100

    oscar100 Member

    Messages:
    1,290
    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2004
    Location:
    london UK
    wierd - but v cool if you can replicate it:drink
     
  8. playon

    playon Supporting Member

    Messages:
    1,864
    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2005
    Location:
    Washington State
    What about the blend knob...?
     
  9. DonM

    DonM Member

    Messages:
    1,085
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Location:
    Signal Hill, Ca
    thats it -- same case with nancy no reading from the bridge pup - but its fine
    would pay you handsomely to allow me a closer look with some meters..etc.. but no unsoldering etc.. or anything to upset value... I think I can figure it out with the meters and tools I have -
    I am willing to travel to get this done --

    Don
     
  10. DANOCASTER

    DANOCASTER Supporting Member

    Messages:
    3,284
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2003
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
  11. DonM

    DonM Member

    Messages:
    1,085
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Location:
    Signal Hill, Ca

    I've done it with that Nancy Heart thing I sell - and I'm happy with the results - but we just want to be able to make Bob's Clone dead true to nancy for the heck of it so - he can post pictures inside and out of it and have it all 100% accurate -- sorta of a History deal??? I dunno -- fun anyways.. Don
    [​IMG]
     
  12. shuie

    shuie Member

    Messages:
    1,301
    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2006
    Location:
    ...down Highway 61
    Don, I trust your ear 100%, but how can you tell that its only partially out of phase and not just some fonky mis-wired tone circuit? Is there any chance that the roll-off of the tone circuit has been bumped up, and that that the signal is not actually out of phase? Unrelated, but can you really tell if a signal is out of phase without putting it on a scope?
     
  13. DonM

    DonM Member

    Messages:
    1,085
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2006
    Location:
    Signal Hill, Ca
    listen to www.roybuchanan.org click on "music" page - that me playing Nancy thru my amp I have here... you will hear its out of phase but not fully.

    Like I said I have it duplicated - Via my nancy Heart I sell -- we just want to simulate the real thing if its possible to recreated the details of the fluke?

    also; Ive been inside of Nancy - saw everything - so what I'm thinking today is it has to be the switch - when its back on the bridge posistion its partially letting in the neck out of phase - Bill Lawrence was helping me understand this once - but understanding him is another problem - right over my head..:worried
     
  14. jetlag

    jetlag Member

    Messages:
    1,122
    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2004
    I had this happen to me with a two pickup stratotone once. The pickups were out of phase and wired like a tele, but with a 3 way switch like a jazzmaster. I finally traced it to the switch - one hair of a stranded cable was shorting across poles and was a high enough resistance to be a "partial" out of phase. It sounded cool and was noticeable on the back pup only position for sure.
     

Share This Page