How do I make this work? PA hook up question.

Moxsam

Member
Messages
2,953
Hello,

Just have a quick newbie set up question for a friend's gear.

He has this Peavey powered mixer model PVi6500

http://peavey.com/products/index.cfm/item/700/118111/PVi®6500

He wants to hook up an external power amp to run his mains. There is a single output on the front panel bottom right that says "Main mix to Ext amp".

Looking at the schematic in the manual it appears to be a TRS connector but I'm not sure.

Can he use a Y cable that splits the signal to L and R to then insert into the external power amp?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
 

buddaman71

Student of Life
Gold Supporting Member
Messages
12,841
if its TRS balanced output then don't use an insert (Y-cable)

Just plug MAIN OUT TO EXT AMP out to line input of ext amp with a regular 1/4" TRS to TRS (or even just a 1/4" TS guitar/patch cable if not over 10')

Jump inputs of ext amp together or bridge.
 

Moxsam

Member
Messages
2,953
OK thanks. I may need a little more clarification to make sure we are doing this right.

Here is the back of the amp.

Here is the blurb from the manual regarding "Inputs" and "Modes"

INPUTS:

1. Balanced Inputs
Either XLR or two-circuit ‘Ring, Tip, Sleeve’ Stereo 1/4-inch PHONE cords may be used.

Each channel’s XLR input is internally paralleled with its phone input (The TIP of the
channel ‘A’ PHONE input is connected to pin 2 of its XLR input, the RING is connected
to pin 3, and the Sleeve is connected to PIN 1). PIN 2 is in phase, PIN 3 is 180 degrees
out-of-phase, and PIN 1 is ground. We recommend using balanced lines for the best
hum-free performance, particularly when chaining multiple amplifiers.


2. Unbalanced Inputs
Ordinary single circuit Standard 1/4-inch PHONE plugs may be used to connect unbalanced signals.

IMPORTANT NOTE: Such plugs effectively connect the ring terminal to sleeve ground,
so they work correctly. However, if you use a Stereo 1/4-inch PHONE plug on an unbalanced
line, you MUST short the Ring terminal to the sleeve terminal, otherwise the
sensitivity will be 6dB lower than is specified! (The same applies to the XLR input: To
connect an unbalanced source via the XLR input, you must connect the signal to Pin 2
and ground BOTH Pin 1 and Pin 3).



MODES

1. Mono Mode
• Channel A & B inputs are paralleled
• Each gain control adjusts the signal level for its respective channel
• Output signals are of equal phase.
• Two loads are driven.
• Loads are connected between the BLACK and RED post on each channel.

2. Stereo Mode
• Two independent amplifiers, Amp A and Amp B.
• Two loads are driven.
• Loads are connected between the BLACK and RED posts on each channel.
Bridge Mode
• Use channel A input and GAIN control. GAIN‑B has no effect.
• Output signals are equal in amplitude but opposite in phase.
• One load is driven.
• The load is connected between the two RED binding posts. The BLACK posts are not used.




Questions:

- Can we use 1/4" TRS from mixer to 1/4" input on amp and use bridge mode and then daisy chain the speakers?
- Can we use 1/4" TRS from mixer to 1/4" input on amp and use mono mode and use both outputs from the amp to the speakers?

Thanks again in advance.
 

buddaman71

Student of Life
Gold Supporting Member
Messages
12,841
Personally, I would plug 1/4" TRS > 1/4" TRS cable from powered mixer into 1/4" TRS input on Ch A on amp, put in BRIDGE mode and then daisy chain speakers.

You only have a mono output from mixer/amp, so just keep it simple.
 

335guy

Member
Messages
5,232
Can we use 1/4" TRS from mixer to 1/4" input on amp and use bridge mode and then daisy chain the speakers?
In theory, yes. BUT, the speaker load cannot exceed 4 ohms. If you use (2) 8 ohm speakers, and daisy chain them, the amp is putting out 1700 watts between the (2) speakers, or, 850 watts per speaker. Be sure your speakers can handle this much power. Also, note that in bridged mode, the speaker connection to the amp uses the A&B red positive ( + & + ) connections, so you cannot use the existing speakon speaker connections. I can't tell what the plugs are to the right of the speakon plugs on the amp's back. Almost looks like banana connectors or binding posts, but those are what you need to hook up the speaker/s when running in bridged mode.

Can we use 1/4" TRS from mixer to 1/4" input on amp and use mono mode and use both outputs from the amp to the speakers?
Yes. This is probably the safer way to go. Especially if the speakers are 4 ohms ea or incapable of handling 850 watts apiece.
 

Moxsam

Member
Messages
2,953
Thanks guys I think I am understanding this a little better.

He is using JBL JRX125 speakers which I believe are 4 ohm each. The JBL site recommends each speaker to have 500-1000 watts. So I think were ok there.

I am a little confused on not being able to used the speakon connectors. I'm also confused on the differences between 4 conductor and 2 conductor speakons. I believe the cables he has say NL2 on them. They have speakon connections on one end and 1/4" on the other. Can he use those?

Here is the blurb from the manual on the Outputs

OUTPUTS

The PX1700 has binding posts and Neutrik four contact Speakon™ connectors for output speaker
connections. Connection to the binding posts can either be made with a banana plug inserted into
the end of the post or a wire inserted into the side of the post.

There are two Speakon™ connectors. The Speakons™ are connected to the amplifier’s outputs
whether the amplifier is in stereo, mono, or bridge modes. Each Speakon™ output connector
(output A and output B) is wired in parallel with it’s respective binding posts for two channel two
cable connections (see figure 1, 2 and 3 on the following page).

Speakon™ output A also doubles as the A&B/Bridge connector. This Speakon™ contains
both channels on one connector. This is convenient when connecting one speaker to the amplifier in
bridge mode where the speaker is connected across the positives of each amplifier output. Configure
the mode switch for bridge and connect the speaker to pins +1 and +2 of the bridge/bi-amp
Speakon (figure 3).

To connect a bi-amp speaker, configure the amplifier for stereo and connect to the bridge/biamp
connector but use all four terminals in the Speakon connector which will connect A and B outputs
separately to the speaker (figure 2). Connection configurations are labeled on the back panel.


Here is a link to the manual

http://yorkville.com/amplifiers_processors/px_series/product/px1700/

On page 5 there is a picture showing hook-ups but I don't really get what they are saying about the speakons.

I am having a helmet fire :peenut at this point....
 

335guy

Member
Messages
5,232
Since the speakers are 4 ohms ea, then you should not run the amp in bridged mode. The amp is stable in bridged mode down to 4 ohms. Hooking (2) 4 ohm speakers in parallel ( daisy chaining ) in bridged mode would be a 2 ohm load, and exceed the amp's capabilities. It's okay to run the individual channels into a 2 ohm load when the amp is set up in mono or stereo mode. But like most power amps, you cannot run it with a 2 ohm load in bridged mode. I think you're fine running the JBL's in mono mode, and here's why. 1st, those are 4 ohm speakers rated at 500 watts capacity. The Yorkville amp puts out 600 watts continuous into a 4 ohm load. Plus, Yorkville states it puts out 1000 watts of "burst average power" into 4 ohms so you would be sending the speakers plenty of power. Simply run the amp in mono mode and use the speakon connections of outputs A & B. All you need to do is ensure the speakon connections use 1+ and 1- on both ends.
 

335guy

Member
Messages
5,232
They have speakon connections on one end and 1/4" on the other. Can he use those?
Yes. Use the speakons on the amp channel outs ( make sure they are connected 1+ and 1- ) and use the 1/4" inputs on the JBL's.
 

walterw

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
38,225
Since the speakers are 4 ohms ea, then you should not run the amp in bridged mode.
quoted for emphasis; do not bridge the power amp or you'll let all the magic smoke out!

set power amp to "mono", so one input gets jumped to both sides of the amp, then run one speaker off each side of the amp.

send that "Main mix to Ext amp" from the mixer head to the power amp and you're off to the races.
 

mixwiz

Member
Messages
2,334
As guitar guy said, wire it like this: output from mixer to input on channel A. Select mono. That parallels the inputs. What that means is that inside the power amp, it takes the signal going into channel A and shares it with channel b. Hook the speakons to the back of the amp and plug the other end into the speakers.

Next, save up for a mixer and some better speakers. JRX 125s are possibly the second worst speakers ever made. In my mind the worst was the TR225 (a forerunner of the JRX). I speak from experience.
 

Moxsam

Member
Messages
2,953
Switch the amp to mono. One input = 2 outputs.
Yes thank you. This is the part I wasn't getting. It makes sense now.

Next, save up for a mixer and some better speakers. JRX 125s are possibly the second worst speakers ever made.
Yes I think the guy is realizing he would've been better off buying a mixer and amp separately from the start.

About to fall down the PA rabbit hole. :crazyguy
 

walterw

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
38,225
About to fall down the PA rabbit hole. :crazyguy
ha!

first, avoid PA "heads". second, avoid 2x15+horn top cabs. (the amp is good, that's a keeper.)

the point is for the stuff you get to "scale", as in you can still keep it and use it in other ways as you build up a system.

like if you get some smaller 1x12" tops now, they can be used as monitors later if you get bigger 1x15" tops. get two good mics now instead of four crap mics.

2x15 tops are dumb because they're too low to get the horns up in the air over the crowd's heads, too heavy to put up on poles, they don't really thump like real subs, and if you get real subs to stack them on then you don't need the bottom 15 to even be there.
 




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