Humbuster cables - is 30 feet too long?

Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by stratzrus, May 25, 2016.

  1. stratzrus

    stratzrus Philadelphia Jazz, Funk, and R&B Supporting Member

    Messages:
    20,083
    Joined:
    May 16, 2006
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    I wanted to order two 15' Humbuster cables but apparently Fractal is out of that length.

    Would there be any problem using 30' cables between my FX8 and guitar amp? I'm going stereo into two different amps and I already have a pair of 15 footers for one of them.

    Fractal recommends using Humbuster cables from the FX8 out [Pre] Left to the front input of the amp, and from the FX8 Out [Post} Left to the amp's FX loop Return. If I use a 15 and a 30 for each amp to keep the running lengths the same, would the 30 work better in one application than another or is it just too long to avoid signal degradation?

    Does anyone know when the 15' length will be back in stock?

    Thanks!
     
  2. drfrankencopter

    drfrankencopter Member

    Messages:
    1,572
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2006
    Why do you need fancy cables for this? I'm not certain what sort of magic these cables accomplish...from what I can tell, all they are is TRS to TS (with the ring brought to shield).

    Without a differential input/output I can't see there being any real advantage. Shorter cables would be better. Or how about soldering up your own?

    Cheers

    Kris
     
    Killed_by_Death likes this.
  3. Eric Rowland

    Eric Rowland Supporting Member

    Messages:
    10,366
    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2012
    Location:
    Chattanooga, TN
    I called them yesterday and the guy said the middle of next month.........................................
     
  4. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Member

    Messages:
    14,400
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2016
    Location:
    14 Megameters from Groong Tehp
    In theory, having the shielding grounded is supposed to shunt noise to ground, but I have tried the Planet Waves directional cable (which does the same thing), and I could tell no difference in the noise level.
    It does work in an industrial environment. Instrument cables for things like level meters or pressure sensors can experience EMI noise, and in that instance, grounding the shielding works.

    Also, with field instruments, none of the signal wires are at ground potential, but with most amplifiers, the shielded side of the instrument cable is at ground potential.
    If the ring & sleeve are at the same potential on a Humbuster, then I don't think it could really bust any hum.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2016
  5. GM Arts

    GM Arts Member

    Messages:
    106
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2012
    Location:
    Adelaide, Australia
    I wouldn't exact any problems using a longer cable because the output impedance from Axe-FX to amp and vice-versa is low.

    Unlike guitar cables that shape your guitar tone due to the interaction between cable capacitance and pickup inductance.
     
    eriwebnerr likes this.
  6. drfrankencopter

    drfrankencopter Member

    Messages:
    1,572
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2006
    Check this out:
    http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=Cables_and_adapters_for_Fractal_Audio_devices

    Exactly! In a true balanced/differential signal the shield is only a screen for noise, and the signal is the difference between the + (tip) and - (ring), leaving the noise to cancel (often down by as much as 70 dB). In a transformer coupled arrangement you can even remove the ground/shield connection, or telescope it from one device to another. In electronically balanced connections you need to keep the ground reference though.

    And then you get to single ended connections, where the signal exists solely between the ground and the + (tip)...you need that ground reference in order to have a signal. If the - of a balanced input is connected to the shield of an unbalanced output all I can see happening is noise generated in the cable being reduced by up to 6 dB (at best). Probably better just to use short cables. I can't see any benefit in using these cables for outputs though...all the magic noise cancelling happens at differential inputs.

    Cheers

    Kris
     
  7. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Member

    Messages:
    14,400
    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2016
    Location:
    14 Megameters from Groong Tehp
    I actually read that page right before I made my reply, just to be sure I wasn't talking out of my arse.
    In the field instrument universe, they try to go fiberoptic with long lines, and those are impervious to EMI.
     
  8. Slapshot1977

    Slapshot1977 Member

    Messages:
    531
    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    Humbuster cables sound like snake oil to me. I'd love to see some real world evidence of them being beneficial.
     
    Killed_by_Death likes this.
  9. cliffc8488

    cliffc8488 Member

    Messages:
    1,058
    Joined:
    May 13, 2006
    Humbuster cables do not eliminate noise. Humbuster cables in conjunction with Humbuster outputs can significantly reduce hum due to ground loops. The outputs of Fractal Audio products have a special circuit that, in conjunction with a Humbuster cable, senses the difference in ground potential between the devices and cancels the difference thereby reducing hum. It's certainly not snake oil and you can find numerous testimonials on our forum that speak for the effectiveness.
     
  10. RafterRattler

    RafterRattler Member

    Messages:
    311
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2010
    ^This. I *reluctantly* bought humbuster cables due to the ground loop hum I was getting between the Axe and the returns of my combo amp. Nothing else connected, just the Axe and amp, plugged into the same power strip. I tried different cables, strips, and outlets to no avail. When I use the Humbuster cables, it's dead silent.I know it's the cable/output combo reducing the noise because it doesn't go silent until I power on the Axe. Definitely not snake oil...

    RR
     
  11. drfrankencopter

    drfrankencopter Member

    Messages:
    1,572
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2006
    ^Well, there you have it... It's not a traditional balanced input/output, it's something different: "a humbuster output"

    Can it work as a traditional balanced output too? I imagine you're protective of your IP (understandably), but I can't help but wonder how it works. Seems almost magical,;presumably you drive the output 'ground' to a new potential (voltage) to ensure that minimalncurrent flows between the ring and the sleeve. While that sounds simple enough I can't really visualize the implementation.

    Thanks for weighing in...

    Cheers

    Kris
     
  12. Slapshot1977

    Slapshot1977 Member

    Messages:
    531
    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    Meh, a couple reviews doesn't change my thoughts on it. Glad it works for those who own one, though.
     
    Killed_by_Death likes this.
  13. atquinn

    atquinn Supporting Member

    Messages:
    9,575
    Joined:
    Jun 13, 2004
    Location:
    Mineola, NY
    It's always good to stand firm on an opinion based on complete ignorance, especially when you've been given evidence to counter it :rolleyes:
    -
    Austin
     
  14. cliffc8488

    cliffc8488 Member

    Messages:
    1,058
    Joined:
    May 13, 2006
    It is something like an active transformer output but can't act as a balanced output. I wish I could tell you more but it's proprietary.
     
  15. Slapshot1977

    Slapshot1977 Member

    Messages:
    531
    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2006
    Two people saying it's awesome isn't anything close to being irrefutable evidence. It's just two experiences.

    If you think otherwise then we should just agree to disagree and move on.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 25, 2016
  16. Powderfinger

    Powderfinger Gold Supporting Member

    Messages:
    10,488
    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2005
    Location:
    NYC area
  17. djd100

    djd100 Member

    Messages:
    2,929
    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2006
    People have been lifting the shield at one end of the cable to eliminate ground loops forever (not noise etc), it's old news and it works great.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2016
    ur2funky and BCy2k like this.
  18. eriwebnerr

    eriwebnerr Member

    Messages:
    2,419
    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2008
    Location:
    New York
    I think the OP's original question was about cable length effecting tone not so much the merits of the HB cable. Regarding that, I would think that there would be no issue with tone degradation. This is not the first cable between the guitar and the processor, but instead coming out of the unit going into the amp. I would bet the output impedance from the FX8 is sufficiently low that 30' vs 15' would make no audible difference.
     
    stratzrus likes this.
  19. BCy2k

    BCy2k Member

    Messages:
    1,639
    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2008
    Location:
    Colorado
    Back to the OP's question, I've never used humbuster cables that long. Personally, I'd make my own at the desired length, or wait until a shorter length is available.

    I've A/B'ed my FX8 rig with and without humbuster cables. All I can say to the skeptics is, there IS an obvious, audible difference on my rig with humbuster cables. To assert an opinion without having tried it is, well, cute.
     
    RafterRattler likes this.
  20. RafterRattler

    RafterRattler Member

    Messages:
    311
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2010
    I'm curious to know why FAS has never made molded female TS to male TRS adapters....then we could use any TS cable. Not sure if there is a technical reason or not...

    RR
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice