I know this is the Boutique board, but God help me I love some Modelers!

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by electronpirate, Jul 3, 2006.

  1. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    In the interests of household peace (i.e. the relocating family member before the house closes), I picked up a V-Amp by Behringer for late night plinking.

    Through the headphones, this thing sounds fantastic. All the clean sounds I hate to play with my FX processor to get. Very good distorted sounds as well. Driven, a very good Gary Moore preset. The recto presets are somewhat weak, but I'm not a huge fan, so no disappointment there.

    I do love the tube sounds I get, but damn, sometimes it is just too easy to get a great sound from a modeler. I'm sure I'd be disappointed when actually put through an amp, but they know how to push your buttons for instant gratification...

    And it does have me thinking to save money by getting a tube/modeling rackmount situation.
     
  2. TattooedCarrot

    TattooedCarrot Supporting Member

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    Hard to beat those little things for headphones practice or recording. But you're right, live and loud things change a bit. The overall vibe is still there, but lacks dynamics. Kinda like a CD vs live band. Both sound good, but you can tell one's more 3D than the other. The rig I just moved away from was a POD Live with a VHT 2/50/2 poweramp. It didn't sound bad, but it just wasn't right. I still play a lot through my J-station with headphones though. I'm keeping my eye out for something like it that has tracks built in, drum/bass patterns or something like a band in a box kinda thing.
     
  3. nland

    nland Member

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    "Household peace" is also what lead me to modeling amps. If I was playing professionally I'd definitely go with tubes, but for home use, the modelers make alot of sense and are practical. The versatility of a modeler is also what sold me. I can dial in different sound with a footswitch and add effects...a little more versatility than having 4-5 stompboxes. Modelers are good alternatives to tube amps, and really I never make the comparison between modelers and tubes...they're different animals for sure.
     
  4. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    I have owned a V-amp2 for several years. Like you, I have used it to spare the neighbors, and my family since I'm a night-person and often recording late, after midnight...

    I bought the V-amp2 and really love it. It definitely is a GREAT solution, and it doesn't just sound good in the headphones.
    In about 85% of my electric guitar recordings at my site:
    http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=8201
    I used the V-amp2 to record.

    (side note: if you guys EVER have it start to get flaky, where any patch
    you have changed from factory preset to a user patch sound like muffled buffalo farts, and the only way out...because tweaking the amp model or anything else doesn't help, is to reset the patch to factory...and even then if you turn it off and on, it's back to buffalo farts, the solution is the backup battery. Behringer were not forthcoming about this problem, even when I directly asked if it could be the problem, they claimed they needed the version number, etc. etc. The unit is very easy to open up...no parts come springing out, no knobs get crooked or anything...you just take out the (I think) 5 screws, you see the battery, carefully remove it, and replace it. The battery is a 3v CR2032 lithium and my first one lasted over 3 years I think...at least two. )

    Anyway...The V-amp I liked better than the POD when I tested, mainly because it had more knob-tweakability. Also I plain liked the sounds better.

    That said, after doing home recording, spending a few years out of bands, I got the itch again, and started buying some tube amps (now have a Bassman, Hot Rod DeVille, Peavey Classic 30, etc, etc.) and there still is SOMETHING extra special and wonderful about 1) driving a real tube and 2) moving air. I started playing in bands again, and there is just something extra going on in a tube amp.

    For me, it isn't snob thing...in fact I feel like I have the best of all worlds. I can be perfectly happy using the Behringer...but I do notice over time especially that...put it this way...I can play into my recorder on the V-amp for hours and have a great time, recording or just noodling or jamming, but I can play for MANY hours on a tube amp...and I get more satisfaction out of the sounds I get. Even at lower volumes, not pushing the power amp section.

    I think it is great to have options like that. The V-amp is excellent I think. Real amps...even better.
     
  5. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    Yeah, at volume, tube amps are the way to go.

    I guess my dilemna is that I'm getting the itch to trim down. I pretty much never use the muscle in my amp. For the price of a rack modeler, and a tube power amp, I would still have plenty left over for that Marshall 2061x I've got my eye on...

    But this thing sounds so suprisingly good. Maybe try it through the PA next practice.
     
  6. TNJ

    TNJ Gold Supporting Member

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    My "household peace" rig is a nice OD pedal (ZenDrive/Burn Unit/etc.) into a POD into a pair of headphones.
    With my Tascam CD-GT-1 (and everything into a small Mackie mixer), I"m good to go and no one's the wiser.
    S>
    j
     
  7. 60HzShuffle

    60HzShuffle Member

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    I got a Roland Cube 60 lately and have been loving this amp. I had a Cube 30 earlier and it was nice but the 60 is even better with a few cool differences. I even had my acoustic plugged into the JC-120 setting and it sounded great with the reverb on! I ws soon making a loop with the acoustic (JamMan into the Cube 60) and playing over it with my PRS SC. Lots of fun!
     
  8. lastwinj

    lastwinj Member

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    the boss br864 is a great tool, and has wicked tones, IMO.

    germ
     
  9. gdwill2u

    gdwill2u Member

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    I had a Fender Cyber delux a few years ago. I really, really wanted to like it. I thought the patches and the variety were a lot of fun, but two things really bothered me. One when I did want to turn it up the amp just kind of died, no power, no bottom end and very muddy.

    Also i couldn't get any touch dynamics at all. No sustain, the amp just didn't feel alive.

    I sold it of course, and I guess it would take a lot to sell me a modeler again.

    This is just my opinion, don't mean to step on anyone's toes here, if you like your modeler enjoy!:BEER:BEER
     
  10. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    I agree about the fender Cyber-Desucks. It sounded good at Guitar Center volumes, then a$$ once lit up.

    At volume, I've only had success with the Valvetronix as far as modelers.

    Really this post is about how these things sound through headphones. You can perk them up with a tube power amp, but in the end, it 'smooths' your playing so you don't really sound any different than someone else playing the same patch. It works for novices, but on stage I still really love the pumping speaker cabs, the sound of real tubes screaming.

    But still will defend the modeler for those of us who can't afford a huge house to crank the amp whenever you want.
     
  11. Tread

    Tread Member

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    May God Help You. ...Buy a JMP
     
  12. trisonic

    trisonic Member

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    As always it depends on the amp.
    Some of them (modellers) rely too much on effects to influence buying decisions in stores. I don't like the Cyber Twin at all, in a band it sounds like a radio somehow; there's a disconnect.

    The Cube60 I find more impressive (specially at it's price point). There's less reliance on effects, less amps modelled and Roland seem to have zeroed in on the amps they have modelled - whilst I don't like the various "Stack" options (well, I have a Ganesha). The JC, BF, Tweed and AC are all usable - loud or soft. You'd expect the JC to be the closest and it is but it loses some complexity because it's coming out of one speaker only. The most surprising is just how good the Tweed amp is; very dynamic (much preferable to the so-called Dyma setting).

    Best, Pete.
     
  13. Buckeyedog

    Buckeyedog Supporting Member

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    I have a Digitech GNX3000 and I really like it.......hard to believe. But I basically just use the amp models...maybe a bit of chorus and some delay but I can't stand all that over the top processed effects crap. It actually sounds pretty decent. I take it to practice for a very quick set up. And have played it at a wedding and will probably use it for private parties and such. Kind of fun, but still doesn't have the mojo of Mr. Tube!! Even my wife said, I like it when you play through an amp better.
     
  14. yellowecho

    yellowecho Member

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  15. Bluedawg

    Bluedawg Member

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    I just picked up a Boss GT-8. The sounds are promising so far. I think it will be a great recording tool. There's a lot to learn, though.

    :YinYang
     
  16. lord preset

    lord preset Member

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    "I know this is the Boutique board, but God help me I love some Modelers!"

    You have been very, very bad.

    Now go out immediately and commission the construction of a 5 watt true class A amp with NOS Mullard and Amperex tubes, transformers handwound with wire made from copper reclaimed from a 1905 Tesla Westinghouse generator, handwired with oxygen-free hemp cloth wire, Exotica telfon caps, and a copper chassis. Mount this in a french-polished cocobolo case with a well broken-in Celestion Blue taken from a 1963 AC-30 that you have decided to part out because the back panel screws are non-original. This amp will cost $6600 and will take 18 months to complete because the builder has a long waiting list and lives in a remote lodge in the Rockies where power is only available 3 hours per day.

    Use the wait time to reflect on where you went wrong, and be sure to post pics and clips whenever it arrives.
     
  17. electronpirate

    electronpirate Member

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    You are a strange sage sir. I will follow your advice like a newborn colt to the paddock.

    Ironically (or paradoxically), I live in the Rockies, so I can save the $50.00 on shipping.
     
  18. Fastfwd

    Fastfwd Member

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    I have a Digitech GNX4. It sounds great both in headphones and live assuming you use either a PA or a very clean and ucolored guitar amp. It also has a built in 8 tracks recorder, drum patterns, midi drums and mp3 backing tracks player.
     
  19. Fastfwd

    Fastfwd Member

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    A few people mentioned how impressive the Cube-60 was in that thread. Well it is impressive when you look at the price but compared to real modelers it sounds really bad.

    The Jazz-Chorus is just terrible. The clean sound is not that bad but the chorus and reverb are the worst I ever heard. I have a GNX4 and the jazz chorus simulation on it is much closer to the real thing. But it also costs quite a bit more so it all depends on what price/feature combiantion you are looking for.

    I fell in love with the real jazz chorus when I tried it at the guitar store. I almost always play using that patch on the modeler and will definitely get a real one some day.
     
  20. trisonic

    trisonic Member

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    Interesting Fastfwd, I directly compared the Cube60 to a JC120 and it was very close, particularly in feel but lacked the complexity of the JC in detail a little (to be expected considering the C60 is a 1x12). I don't use Chorus but the Chorus is somewhat lacking compared to the JC but it is not bad at all.

    Where I think the C60 scores over some other modellers is precisely that there is not a whole bunch of amps being modelled - Roland appear to have concentrated their effort on a few. OK I don't like the stack sounds too much and I have a Maven Peal Ganesha anyway which covers just about all the NMV Marshall stuff I care for. The BF, Tweed sounds and light weight for "grab and go" cover the price of admission.

    Just my opinion.

    Best, Pete.
     

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