I think I know why I struggle with the Kemper...

mikeymoves

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
727
It's a Computer. In the last 10 years, I've gone through 8 computers due to them being outdated. That's my struggle with the Kemper. Yes, it's robust now, but it's going to lose value and relevance faster than a Tube Amp...but is that perception actually reality? Perhaps not my friends...perhaps not. Took her off the Emporium.
 

pepi

Member
Messages
859
8 computers in 10 being outdated ??? Every one year and 2 months ???

I've got a real nice HIGH-END PC I'll trade you for the Kemper :)
 

mattball826

Senior Member
Messages
20,810
anything digital is like that. cameras, tv's, computers, modelers, ss and modeling guitar amps, and even digital telescopes.

musical instrument gear shelf life is a little longer, but all digital evolves so the fire sales happen and the costs come way down. i buy these old units all the time. best deal so far was johnson millennium with 212 ext cab and j12 controller for $300. of course it took 12 years to drop that low.

roland vs2480 mt recorder we use for mixing and recording live bands i found used for $425 (with 2 fx boards). 8 years ago it went for $2500.

tube amps not quite as bad on depreciation.

i buy some dslr cameras this way too. good stuff for cheap after a year or so.
 

JackJordan

Member
Messages
1,357
I honestly feel the same way about all modelers... they are computers and they will at one point either fail or be antiquated.

I feel that pedals and amps hold their value longer, and I also feel that they are much easier to fix.

But despite this I still own several modelers and a Variax guitar (something I also feel has the problems that a computer does). I like them and I think they work... but I know they will be outdated at some point. As long as they continue to operate I'll use them, but I may upgrade long before that. That is the downside to all modelers in my opinion... and I have taken some flack for it around here :hide2 (Tell someone that the Axe FX II or Kemper will be outdated in 10 years and you are liable to get hate mail... lol).

Modelers and amps are not the same, and both have their own unique problems, as well as advantages... this happens to be the problem with modelers.

:beer
 

mattball826

Senior Member
Messages
20,810
I honestly feel the same way about all modelers... they are computers and they will at one point either fail or be antiquated.

I feel that pedals and amps hold their value longer, and I also feel that they are much easier to fix.

But despite this I still own several modelers and a Variax guitar (something I also feel has the problems that a computer does). I like them and I think they work... but I know they will be outdated at some point. As long as they continue to operate I'll use them, but I may upgrade long before that. That is the downside to all modelers in my opinion... and I have taken some flack for it around here :hide2 (Tell someone that the Axe FX II or Kemper will be outdated in 10 years and you are liable to get hate mail... lol).

Modelers and amps are not the same, and both have their own unique problems, as well as advantages... this happens to be the problem with modelers.

:beer

kpa will go through the same cycles as most other brands even in the high end side. each new product will bring the pricing down on previous ones.

tube amps, cabs, and even used speakers hold their value much longer.
 

Noise Under The Floor

A happy-go-lucky chap, always dressed in black.
Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
11,629
I honestly feel the same way about all modelers... they are computers and they will at one point either fail or be antiquated.

I feel that pedals and amps hold their value longer, and I also feel that they are much easier to fix.

But despite this I still own several modelers and a Variax guitar (something I also feel has the problems that a computer does). I like them and I think they work... but I know they will be outdated at some point. As long as they continue to operate I'll use them, but I may upgrade long before that. That is the downside to all modelers in my opinion... and I have taken some flack for it around here :hide2 (Tell someone that the Axe FX II or Kemper will be outdated in 10 years and you are liable to get hate mail... lol).

Modelers and amps are not the same, and both have their own unique problems, as well as advantages... this happens to be the problem with modelers.

:beer
Fully agree. I brought this up once on another forum a while ago. I commented about how while modelers have their place, and are great tools, they are really just computers, prone to fail, don't hold value etc VS how something like a tube amp, say a Fender Twin or Marshall JCM 800 and a pedal like say a Tube Screamer or Boss CE-2 never really go obsolete per se, have "classic" staying power, and are likely to still be working decades from when you bought them. You should have seen the amount of S that hit the fan. I even got bombarded with nasty PM's, one from someone claiming to work for a certain modeling manufacturer. :anon People who love their modelers can be very...um....passionate? Lol
 

GhostMan

Senior Member
Messages
155
OP: A year or two ago, the Axe/Kemper were the bomb, but like any tech, it's becoming old news fast. Jam Up - Torpedo - Owenhammer, the list goes on, where we are just about at the point that unless you really honestly need 10,000 tones, midi switching for your cover band, rather then your tone, there are just cheaper, easier, better investments out there. I've sold a JVM and an HD500 in the last two months. I think tubes might be 'done' in the next five years except for specific applications. Floorboards are fine, but who's gigging? A box on the desk I have to scroll through a million menus? No thanks. I would rather play guitar then tweak and save that $5k for something else.
 

ksandvik

Member
Messages
6,328
...I'm using a MacBookPro 2006 with MainStage for most keyboard gigs. Never underestimate the lifetime of most computer equipment assuming you take care of it, replace batteries from time to time and so on. Same with Kemper. If well taken care of, it could be use for a very long time.
 

pepi

Member
Messages
859
I'm with ya guys ... Tube Amps for me. I do enjoy my G3 Zoom with headphones but would never use anything like this gigging.
 

suckamc

Member
Messages
4,611
Fact is, with a correctly-done profile, not a single one of you could pick it out of a lineup from a recording of the actual amp/cab/mic that was profiled. That will still be the case in 20 years. We're at the point in the game where it's time to stop worrying about your resale value and buy music-making tools because, at long last, they kick all the ass you could have hoped. Then make some music.

We've arrived. Congratulations to all of us. We waited it out... we sat through the POD days and the Johnson days and so on, then things got a bit better as we went along. Many of you complained about "fizz" for years and years and, oddly enough, were taught by modelers to give a closer listen to your amp. Sure enough, fizz had been with us all along, from the days when you all played Blackface deluxes. We grew together, us and modelers. We taught them some things; they taught us some stuff. We laughed together; we cried together. And now, we're all adults, us and them. The sound of the next Kemper won't be any more realistic bc it already sounds EXACTLY like the amp on the mic (if you profile correctly), and the Axefx II is a supercomputer from the freaking future that can make dang near any sound you can dream up and can emulate half of the pedals you own (pedals that, ironically, lost 40% of their value as soon as you drove them off the lot).

It's time. You have WAY more reason to complain about your Macbook which literally won't work adequately in 10 years than you do about the amazing choice of modelers that the market offers you.

It's time to ante up and play some music.
 

Lain

Senior Member
Messages
861
How can you even compare that? A computer get's outdated because there is new hardware out. New software that demands new hardware.

And seriously? 8 PCs in 10 years? Seems like you didn't buy wisely.

The Kemper will always sound like it does now. It won't say you can't run that new preset because it does not have enough power on the graphics card.
 

JackJordan

Member
Messages
1,357
How can you even compare that? A computer get's outdated because there is new hardware out. New software that demands new hardware.
As long as the Kemper (or any modeler) works I would not call it obsolete. But I would say outdated... :hide2

Outdated (Bing Dictionary):
no longer in fashion: superseded by something better, more fashionable, or more technologically advanced

I have no doubt that ten years from now that there will be a better version of the Kemper, Axe FX, or another modeler that makes the current _________(insert the name of your favorite modeler here) less desirable than it is today.

That is the nature of technology, we may call it a classic, but the reality is at some point its just old...

Now a good amp or pedal, that's another story... people will pay big bucks for an "original". I don't see anyone willing to spend more on a first generation AXE FX then on the newest generation. Why? I think the answer is obvious.

The Kemper will always sound like it does now. It won't say you can't run that new preset because it does not have enough power on the graphics card.
If Kemper starts to make some serious advancements you might get the dreaded "DSP limit reached" message. Technology has a way of changing in unexpected directions.

I just got an email a few weeks ago saying that many features of the Nintendo Wii will no longer be supported on the website... it really won't surprise me if Kemper stops supporting many features of their website at some point as well. Either due to coming up with newer products that they would rather support, trying to get you to upgrade to said products, or just going out of business years down the road (yes it can happen).

Who knows what will happen down the road, but things will change. Look back ten years ago and honestly tell me they don't.

:D
 

Electric I

Member
Messages
3,468
Pretty much this.

Fact is, with a correctly-done profile, not a single one of you could pick it out of a lineup from a recording of the actual amp/cab/mic that was profiled. That will still be the case in 20 years. We're at the point in the game where it's time to stop worrying about your resale value and buy music-making tools because, at long last, they kick all the ass you could have hoped. Then make some music.

We've arrived. Congratulations to all of us. We waited it out... we sat through the POD days and the Johnson days and so on, then things got a bit better as we went along. Many of you complained about "fizz" for years and years and, oddly enough, were taught by modelers to give a closer listen to your amp. Sure enough, fizz had been with us all along, from the days when you all played Blackface deluxes. We grew together, us and modelers. We taught them some things; they taught us some stuff. We laughed together; we cried together. And now, we're all adults, us and them. The sound of the next Kemper won't be any more realistic bc it already sounds EXACTLY like the amp on the mic (if you profile correctly), and the Axefx II is a supercomputer from the freaking future that can make dang near any sound you can dream up and can emulate half of the pedals you own (pedals that, ironically, lost 40% of their value as soon as you drove them off the lot).

It's time. You have WAY more reason to complain about your Macbook which literally won't work adequately in 10 years than you do about the amazing choice of modelers that the market offers you.

It's time to ante up and play some music.
Really, how can modeling get that much better, esp. with the Big 2 ?

Sure, you can add features & more models, but the realism - hasn't it just about hit the ceiling ? If so, where does it go from here - just less expensive ?
 

JackJordan

Member
Messages
1,357
...I'm using a MacBookPro 2006 with MainStage for most keyboard gigs. Never underestimate the lifetime of most computer equipment assuming you take care of it, replace batteries from time to time and so on. Same with Kemper. If well taken care of, it could be use for a very long time.
I agree. I just purchased a JTV Variax that I hope will last me ten years (longer would be better :D). I think ten years for a piece of technology is a good deal, and in my case would equate to about $100 a year.

That being said I own several other guitars that I think will last much longer than ten years. I bought a used American Standard Telecaster for $500 that has already lasted me 11 years, and I think that with a little maintenance it will last me my whole life.

I also have been using my laptop for 6 years and just today it stopped working... nice little brick I got myself.

Technology can last... but I don't think it will last like other gear would/could. And I think we have to be realistic and buy our modelers with that frame of mind.
 

VCuomo

Member
Messages
16,742
Will the KPA be outdated one day? Sure, but if you're happy with what it does and how it sounds now, remember that it will still do the same things and sound the same 10 years from now.
 

Souper

Member
Messages
645
The reason tube amps don't date is because it's too late for them; its already happened.
Guitars into computers is just beginning. Once manufacturers dare to move forwards, digital will be awesome.
 

db9091

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
3,327
If you had an Apple I from 1976 you could auction that baby for $671,400

So hold on to that ol' lunchbox, might be worth something in 2048!
 

stratzrus

Philadelphia Jazz, Funk, and R&B
Gold Supporting Member
Messages
21,961
That's my struggle with the Kemper. Yes, it's robust now, but it's going to lose value and relevance faster than a Tube Amp...
I don't think that's true.

Take almost any tube amp that costs more than $2K new and it's more likely to depreciate more over a 2-3 year period. If you're really concerned about depreciation buy a KPA used. That way you're really unlikely to lose much if anything. Work it right and you may even be able to make money on it.
 

Gasp100

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
22,837
Fact is, with a correctly-done profile, not a single one of you could pick it out of a lineup from a recording of the actual amp/cab/mic that was profiled. That will still be the case in 20 years. We're at the point in the game where it's time to stop worrying about your resale value and buy music-making tools because, at long last, they kick all the ass you could have hoped. Then make some music. We've arrived. Congratulations to all of us. We waited it out... we sat through the POD days and the Johnson days and so on, then things got a bit better as we went along. Many of you complained about "fizz" for years and years and, oddly enough, were taught by modelers to give a closer listen to your amp. Sure enough, fizz had been with us all along, from the days when you all played Blackface deluxes. We grew together, us and modelers. We taught them some things; they taught us some stuff. We laughed together; we cried together. And now, we're all adults, us and them. The sound of the next Kemper won't be any more realistic bc it already sounds EXACTLY like the amp on the mic (if you profile correctly), and the Axefx II is a supercomputer from the freaking future that can make dang near any sound you can dream up and can emulate half of the pedals you own (pedals that, ironically, lost 40% of their value as soon as you drove them off the lot). It's time. You have WAY more reason to complain about your Macbook which literally won't work adequately in 10 years than you do about the amazing choice of modelers that the market offers you. It's time to ante up and play some music.
Finally... /thread, seriously
 




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