I'm usually not a big fan of him as a guitar player

808

Member
Messages
345
I really like John honestly but he is not much of a singer. Great songwriter and guitar player but 1 skill/talent short of the triple threat.
 

Gevalt

Member
Messages
1,866
That is not what people are saying.

Oy, gevalt!

I also saw this once, and I just don’t think Justin Bieber has this
:beer My analogy about beiber is about success, not music

JM is objectively great, but a few odd comments earlier said non-fans are just jealous.
He’d be bigger if we knew less about his personal life. His pants have even more hits than his heart, and that’s great but his legacy is muddled. This idea that his life is so fab, sometimes outshines his music, even to some of his fans. Such as the guys who claim others are jealous, and ironically, are the most jealous, even if in a positive way.

In the alt universe where JM isn’t such a garden variety celeb, he’s more respected because his fame wouldn’t be so famous
 
Last edited:

theanthonyv

Member
Messages
1,659
Are not one's abilities as a performer and one's tastes as a listener entirely separate entities?
Yes, exactly. Maybe someone should inform all of the Yelp posters that they’re not allowed to comment on restaurants unless they can first prove their own superior culinary skills!

It’s a sophomoric argument to say someone can’t critique something unless they can do it better.

I don’t understand why people get so worked up when others disagree with their opinions of an artist’s merit. It seems like a sign of immaturity or insecurity.
 

El Rey

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
907
Hey - I am not trying to take a personal potshot so much as I am trying to typify a really strange hypercritical attitude befitting the owner of the Android’s dungeon comic book shop when it comes to John Mayer. It’s particularly weird, since all of the evidence basically indicates he has much more in common with Elton John or Sting than he does with Katy Perry. I am not a huge fan, I don’t even own a record. I just cannot understand why people attempt to form such a wildly inaccurate depiction of the guy as if it’s fact, when the circumstances indicate pretty clearly it ain’t.

Joe B. is a more technically proficient guitarist. Everything else you attribute to him is completely subjective, and since he’s nowhere near as successful as Mayer, even though he plays the same music, courts at least a portion of the same audience, etc. that it might be worth considering that your thoughts are just opinions, and that the prevailing sentiment does not concur, and that Might mean something.

The Beatles are a more popular band than Herman’s Hermits. They are also considered considered widely to be better than Herman’s Hermits. I can’t give you measurements or objective reasoning as to why, but when people say they really like the Beatles, and they like them more than Herman’s Hermit’s, my first reaction is not to fabricate all the reasons that they should not be so successful, or try to explain it all away. I also don’t attempt to define decades long, enduring popularity as an aberration or a cultural zeitgeist or the product of clever marketing.

People aren’t dancing to Gravity at their weddings because of marketing or the singer’s **** me eyes. They like the song because it landed with them in some way, and that is the product of talent.

I want to apologize for being harsh, I am just frustrated with the insistence that entirely subjective and poorly-supported opinion is fact.
Lighten up. Just opinions. No one is changing anyone's mind anyway.


....... poorly-supported opinion is fact.
Someones sacred cow (even if it also happens to be an opinion) gets kicked or stepped on, and someones feelings get hurt and they react.

The simple minded fodder that drives multi-page threads.

This in and of itself is also entertaining.

Thank you.
 

BillyO

Member
Messages
174
Not into him at all but he’s obviously talented

As I’ve gotten older I’ve realized that basically anyone who is a famous musician is extreme top level talent in some sense.

There are so many great people trying to get to that level and more coming all the time, so to get there and be able to stay there really says everything

You may not be into him (I’m not) but that is just a matter of taste. He’s not really singing to me and I don’t blame him for that!
 

Louthunder

Member
Messages
429
Not into him at all but he’s obviously talented

As I’ve gotten older I’ve realized that basically anyone who is a famous musician is extreme top level talent in some sense.

There are so many great people trying to get to that level and more coming all the time, so to get there and be able to stay there really says everything

You may not be into him (I’m not) but that is just a matter of taste. He’s not really singing to me and I don’t blame him for that!
This guy knows how to put his thoughts out there without actually saying things like,JM can't play for crap! etc.etc. etc.
 

Tim Bowen

Member
Messages
3,483
Yes, exactly. Maybe someone should inform all of the Yelp posters that they’re not allowed to comment on restaurants unless they can first prove their own superior culinary skills!
I can't lay an egg but I know beyond a shadow of a doubt that I prefer scrambled light to poached.
 

Rockledge

Member
Messages
5,557
I must of misunderstood you then. Ummm...have you not heard of Dead and Co? He’s basically a sideman for Grateful Dead. I’ll check out some early Deep Purple. Have a good weekend.
I heard some of what he did with them on the radio a while back, and I was surprised that he fit in as well as he did. But I am not a big GD fan. Being an old hippie, their music is a bit nostalgic for me, and once a week the local PBS has a Grateful Dead night, if I am busy working on instruments or in my shop I put it on. It is kind of nice mellow stuff to have on in the background. Other than that, I have a bunch of GD CDs here that I never listen to.
In fact part of the reason I like his guitar skills is because he was able to adapt them to a rock era band that was off the beaten path to begin with, no small feat for someone his age.
 

jpastras

Supporting Member
Messages
964
Lighten up. Just opinions. No one is changing anyone's mind anyway.




Someones sacred cow (even if it also happens to be an opinion) gets kicked or stepped on, and someones feelings get hurt and they react.

The simple minded fodder that drives multi-page threads.

This in and of itself is also entertaining.

Thank you.

No, thank you for your sanctimonious condescension. It’s a discussion thread. I have emphasized that I am discussing. You are clearly a genius who has figured out the secret of how Internet message boards work. We are all so much better for your insight on what a discussion is. Thank god we have your contribution.

Save your tremendous wisdom and vaunted position above the fray for somebody who cares.
 

jpastras

Supporting Member
Messages
964
JM has probably the most tame reputation out of any artist talked about on TGP. You must not be a fan of many classic artists. Which is it? JM is another Bieber or he is objectively great?

This isn’t about people not liking his music...that is fine. It’s about people saying things like “JM owes his succes to promoters” and “he would of made a better sideman” or “he woulda been bigger if”
Mayer may not be objectively great. Objective stuff is hard in music. If two jazz guys can both play in time, and execute complex 64th note runs in a fast version of, say, Cherokee, we can objectively say they are highly competent, but who knows about the substance? I don’t.

My point is really basic- going by the evidence, the guy is not a flash in the pan, not incompetent, and is much more on the enduring musical legend track. As you noted, if he is a polarizing artist, it ain’t about his career or capabilities as an artist; the career and capabilities are established, and a lawyer would not try to refute them before a judge, because that’s not a tenable argument.

That’s it. It’s a weird argument against obvious circumstance that will not die on this board. If people were saying the same kind of stuff about Elton John, Ritchie Blackmore, or Jimmy Page, I’d be right here making the same counterpoint. It’s absurd. Absurdity doesn’t make me mad, but I might challenge it.

Quality in music is subjective AND circumstantial, but we cannot dispense with any notion of quality in art as nothing more than immaterial relativism. The opinion matters, but the circumstances also matter. This forum doesn’t seem to care about the latter.

It’s all just a discussion.
 

Gevalt

Member
Messages
1,866
JM has probably the most tame reputation out of any artist talked about on TGP. You must not be a fan of many classic artists. Which is it? JM is another Bieber or he is objectively great?

This isn’t about people not liking his music...that is fine. It’s about people saying things like “JM owes his succes to promoters” and “he would of made a better sideman” or “he woulda been bigger if”
Re-read my post, although I wasn't talking to you, Mr/Mrs. Mayer. Although I did say he was GREAT, Mr/Mrs. Mayer, so watch where you're pointing that pistola.
I explained the beiber thing, slowpoke. Success≠talent, so people need to stop using $ as JM's excuse for being annoying to 50% of humans.
Also, name a "babe" from the late-90's onward that John didn't sleep with.....This isn't wrong, it's my dream too, but JM doesn't come across as an artist for art's sake. Not at all.
His lifestyle makes his music look like a trifle. Fact of life.

His voice is so annoying that I don't have time to tolerate it before the tabloids ruin the party, and I have zero faith in him as somebody who's lyrics I can learn from. I don't relate with JM.
I like a lot of hated bands, so get off your cross if you can't stand people disliking your music. If everyone loved your faves, you would be less special.
 
Last edited:

Gevalt

Member
Messages
1,866
With respect to all quoted, I think the money worship could be toned down in a discussion about art. His art is fine, his money is irrelevant. He is objectively great(You hear that johnathan31? twice I agreed).
This doesn't upset me, but the hypocrisy is here:

That is not what people are saying.
Yes it is.
I'm sure he'll be crying in his pillow every night because of this.
...look at the
very beautiful women he has squired around over the yrs.
Beats the hell out of my life! :(

I think a lot of " criticism " over the yrs. is inspired from
one color only. Because of the $ he has made & the
emotions he elicits. :cool:
I think his net worth would agree he does pretty good as a singer, songwriter, and guitarist.
...album is gold.... But he makes weird faces so he’s meh. You can only make weird faces when playing guitar apparently.
gets to do what many of us wished we could do and yet he is blasted by armchair QBs playing in their bedrooms.
Based on his album sales I’m going to go out on a limb and say he disagrees.
If millions of people like your singing voice and will spend money to hear it, you have a good voice-
Literally, millions of people disagree with you. If you think he’s a bad writer, full 10,000 seat venues twenty years after he wrote those hits disagree with you. And more songs being written every year.

You don’t like it, all cool. But sitting around like some 35 year old neckbeard in your Mom’s basement trying to tell everybody online what John Mayer really deserves to be is the dumbest **** you could ever aspire to do.

I don’t even own a record of his, but some of the things people engage in on this board literally defy reason.
We sure have a bunch of f&*#ed up judgemental, whiney A-holes on this forum! I would love to hear 99.9 % of you guys sing and play ! This forum is almost getting unbearable to read anymore !!
I assume you noticed most of the guys in this thread mentioned they don’t like his singing?
We’re all lying, do like his vocals, but are just truly jealous of his success deep down? Really?

Ok.
 

vanderkalin

Member
Messages
2,161
[QUOTE="Gevalt, post: 29202839, member: 10071 This idea that his life is so fab, sometimes outshines his music, even to some of his fans. Such as the guys who claim others are jealous, and ironically, are the most jealous, even if in a positive way.[/QUOTE]
Wow, that’s some pretzel logic there dude.
 

Louthunder

Member
Messages
429
With respect to all quoted, I think the money worship could be toned down in a discussion about art. His art is fine, his money is irrelevant. He is objectively great(You hear that johnathan31? twice I agreed).
This doesn't upset me, but the hypocrisy is here:


Yes it is.
You apparently are supreme judge of what is good and what is not !! My point is really about the negativity on this forum! You are living proof of THAT!!
 




Trending Topics

Top