Is red-booking hard?

Discussion in 'Recording/Live Sound' started by loopjunkie, Mar 16, 2006.


  1. loopjunkie

    loopjunkie Member

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    If I got some software (feel free to make suggestions) would it be very hard for me to learn how to use it? I want to do some blends for my bands CD and we have this one song with a 2 min. intro I would like people to be able to "skip" if they want but still be part of the song, and not another track; will A red-booking program get me these things and will I have to take a class to be able to use it? (I currently use Pro tools LE with a Digi 002 Rack; just for an idea of knowledge. And I don't mind reading! It doesn't have to be simple as long as i can find a source to research it!)
     
  2. MichaelK

    MichaelK Member

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    Ahhh... I did this with a piano improvisation that consisted of five sections. I wanted it to play back smoothly as a single track but I wanted the individual sections indexed just as you describe.

    I'm on Mac and I use Roxio Jam, which is pretty much "the" standard user-friendly Red Book disc software for Mac. In general it's very easy to use and very versatile, but the manual is overly simplistic and doesn't explain some of the deeper features very well. Like this procedure. Not that it's hard.

    Anyway, what you're going to do is put the track in your playlist twice, cut the first one off early and have the second one pick up exactly where the first left off without missing a microsecond. And you're going to create a perfect, smooth, seamless, inaudible crossfade so one just listening would ever know.

    Drag the song file into the playlist twice so it shows up as two separate tracks. Jam automatically puts a pause between the two tracks, normally 2 seconds. Get rid of that pause by clicking in the "pause" field to the left of the second track and typing in "0" (the first track on the disk, track 1, must always have a 2-second pause before it plays. That's part of the Red Book standard).

    Single-click on "Length" for the first track and select "Track Trim" from the drop-down menu. Leave the start time alone (it should be all zeros). Change the end time to the exact point at which you want the second section to start, PLUS 10 ms. E.g. if you want the second section to begin at exactly 2:00, you make the end time for the first section "02.00.01." Click "OK."

    Now click on "Length" for the second track and select "Track Trim." Leave the end time alone, and make the start time 10 ms. before the end time of the first track, e.g. "02.00.00." Click "OK."

    Click on the icon that looks like a bow tie to the far right of the first track. That will bring up the Crossfade dialogue. Among the icons at the lower right, click the one second from left that looks like a letter 'X' crossed near the top (not crossed dead center). That's your equal power fade, which IMO works best for this. A window will drop down asking you to enter the duration of the fade. Make it "00.00.01" and click "OK." Test it by clicking the yellow triangle to the left that says "Preview Crossfade." If you did everything according to Hoyle, the fade should play back seamlessly. Click "Apply" in the Crossfade window and you're done.

    When you burn your disk the whole song will play through without a hiccup if you leave it alone, but if you skip ahead during the intro it will take you right to the index point.

    Hope this helped, but you'll probably tell me you're on a PC...:jo
     
  3. MichaelK

    MichaelK Member

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    P.S. - Certain crossover points are problematic, like in the middle of a percussive hit or note attack. I try to put my crossfades in the quiet trough just before an attack. Sometimes that takes a little trial and error, but the Crossfade window can help you see where you have to be. Just always remember to start the second track exactly 10 ms. before the first track ends and make the crossfade 10 ms. to cover it.
     
  4. justicetones

    justicetones Member

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    +1 on MichaelK's explanation. Man it used to be so much easier in Masterlist but Digi abandoned that program. I own Jam and use it for spitting out very indy record small run masters for the duplication plant. Great program.
     
  5. elambo

    elambo Member

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    I was wicked mad at Digi for doing away with Masterlist, and especially SoundDesigner. I've learned to outdo all that SoundDesigner could do just by using ProTools wisely, but Masterlist still hasn't been replaced. Some have mimiced but none have matched it. I feel your pain.
     
  6. justicetones

    justicetones Member

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    Elambo I agree 100%. Sorry loopjunkie it looks like we accidentally hijacked your thread. You just reminded us how much we miss some of the features in Masterlist. See in Masterlist you could have one big piece of audio and just enter in numerically any ID's you wanted up to I think 99 of them. It was the shiznit. That would have made your life easy. Coincidentally the failure rate at the duplication plants was almost non-existant when I burned with Masterlist.
     
  7. elambo

    elambo Member

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    I had a conversation with Bernie Grundman a couple years ago about the changes in software authoring programs, like Masterlist and Jam - how they've left a couple "greats" in the past and replaced them with user-friendly (although not so friendly) versions. It's one area where there seems to be little interest anymore for the industrial-grade authorers. The ID insertion of Masterlist, as you mentioned, was a snap! Damn, I miss that. I was told the Jam could do it, but I have yet to see it done so easily, and flawlessly.

    Oh yeah, sorry about the hijack. It's an interesting topic.
     
  8. loudboy

    loudboy Member

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    Check out Sound Forge 8.0, it's now bundled w/CD Architect. It'll allow you to do anything you need to do, very easily.

    Loudboy
     
  9. justicetones

    justicetones Member

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    I have heard good things from friends about Sound Forge if your on a PC.

    Loopjunkie you never told us are you on a PC or MAC???????

    Most of the software we are talking about is Platform specific with no version for both. Roxio (maker of Toast and Jam) does also make a different product for PC but I have no experience with it. The guys on MAC I know use both Toast and Jam, and the guys on PC use Sound Forge.....

    Good call Loudboy.
     
  10. loopjunkie

    loopjunkie Member

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    I am PC I picked up one of those Sweet-water creation station Racks with the duel processors! (very cool!) I was thinking about the CD architect route but don't know how hard it would be and what the quality would be?
     

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