Just got the bill for the show we played last Friday...

Discussion in 'The Sound Hound Lounge' started by stratplayer17, Mar 12, 2018.

  1. stratplayer17

    stratplayer17 Member

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    And no, it wasn’t the bar bill.

    This isn’t a cover band situation - it’s a local brewery’s “venue” hosting original music; hole in the wall type place, no walk up traffic. Booker promises “heavy promotion through social media,” etc.

    Pay is that the band gets ticket revenues, less a “bar minimum.”

    They post two FB posts a month apart. We post via social on Instagram and Facebook, from band and personal accounts, probably 20 or so posts over a period of a month. Also run paid campaigns on both networks. We also book an opening act to make the ticket more worthwhile.

    We do the show with no monitors, no lights, no stage, no soundcheck, and no soundman (the door guy “helps out”).

    Weather’s been bad but we get modest draw. We don’t expect to leave with much/any money, but such is original music and that’s okay.

    Get email today from the venue. Apparently after splitting the cost of the soundman (we did? How much?), we didn’t generate enough bar sales. Guy “appreciates the time” but “will be looking for the difference.” Read: he wants us to cut him a check.

    Any of you run into this? And have a venue come back to you and ask you to basically subsidize them directly?
     
  2. mojocaster.com

    mojocaster.com Member

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    There are five fingers on my right hand. Only one - the middle one - applies to this conversation.
     
  3. teleman55

    teleman55 Member

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    Yeah this.
    Reminds me to thank God we got a booking agent. And there still are occasional issues.
     
  4. dougb415

    dougb415 Member

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    I’d be wishing him luck on “looking for that difference”.
     
  5. Killed_by_Death

    Killed_by_Death Member

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    That venue will be added to the "never playing there again" list & unpaid.
     
  6. Papanate

    Papanate Gold Supporting Member

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    The guy can pretend all he wants - no one is owed a thing.
    Next time (not this place - but another place) put everything in
    writing - and if the venue doesn't want to sign to what they agreed
    consider that you dodged a bullet.

    I don't understand how people operate in this kind of misunderstanding opportunity.



     
  7. mojocaster.com

    mojocaster.com Member

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    Just this week end, I agreed to a duo gig at this venue as a sign of good faith and to help out the booking agent who is a friend of mine. They had a last minute cancelation and he asked me step in. I explained to him that I no longer played that venue because they don't treat musicians, including myself, in a professional fashion. But for him I said yes, even though we had to play for whatever the other duo was gonna play for, which is $60 less than what we normally charge.

    Long story short, we brought half the people who were there that night. And the owner decided to only pay us half the agreed upon amount.

    Of course I refused and demanded full payment. It went for a while, back and forth. He never came out. He sent his female bar tender back and forth. Which was unfair to her, because she was stuck between the two of us and there's nothing she could do. I told her as much and told her to tell him to stop being a coward and come out. I don't know if she told him that part, but in the end we got paid in full.

    Guess where I am no longer playing, even if the booking agent is a friend?
     
  8. Papanate

    Papanate Gold Supporting Member

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    Again - this crap drives me bonkers - not because the dude was a cheating coward -
    because you knew what was up and still went in without papers signed.

    If your 'friend' needed the favor - have him sign the papers so that when d**khead
    tries to short you - your friend has to pay you the difference.
     
  9. tiktok

    tiktok Supporting Member

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    I've had venues say "We didn't see the numbers we wanted", but never have they asked to be reimbursed for whatever. And there's no way I would have paid them either. If they want that sort of insurance, they need to work with a contract. And good luck finding someone to sign it.
     
  10. paranoid70

    paranoid70 Member

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    Hey, now is your chance to stiff a venue! Should be a nice change of pace.
     
  11. jonnytexas

    jonnytexas Supporting Member

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    I would never book such a gig, but I would pay if that is what I agreed to.
     
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  12. mojocaster.com

    mojocaster.com Member

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    I had it in writing. I just had no one to show it to ;)

    either way, I wasn't leaving until I was paid, and in the end that's what the difference was. Those guys try that sort of crap all the time. Though in my experience at that particular venue, the problem was never getting paid. The problem was them last minutes canceling gigs - and I mean last minute, as in I was already en route to the venue and they felt there were not enough people there. They did it twice. I was done with them.
     
  13. teleman55

    teleman55 Member

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    Had one place (this was years ago, I'm old now so play more sedate places, hah) that said they couldn't pay because our fans were rowdy and broke too much stuff. The place was so packed people in front were like squeezed against the stage. And they tried to stiff us. We got paid but it was tense for a bit.
     
  14. markjsmith

    markjsmith Member

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    Did you have a signed contract stating they were to be paid a certain amount by the band for pre-sale tickets? If not then you don't owe them a thing!
     
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  15. Simon

    Simon Supporting Member

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    In all my years I've never heard that one OP, and it's BS! Never go back!

    Strangest one I ever had was in a fancy country/golf club. End of the night the manager asks how much, we tell him and He says that's way to much!
    We go to the van and get the contract from our booking agent, He doesn't care! we get the booking agent on the phone and He still won't cut the check.
    Rather then go to jail, we just leave, and put it in the agents hands, we soon got our $, He has a personal attorney being in that racket.

    Other then that one time, I can't think of another issue getting the $.

    Also OP, did you get paid at all?
     
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  16. Moxsam

    Moxsam Member

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    What does "less bar minimum" mean? Sounds like a way for him to pay you whatever he wanted regardless of ticket sales.

    If he didn't pay you guys what the hell does he want money for? Did he somehow lose money by you guys playing there?
     
  17. Bogner

    Bogner Member

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    Always work in writing. Not doing so is nothing but trouble in some fashion.
     
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  18. soulman969

    soulman969 Member

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    I would never have booked a gig like that to begin with but send him a note saying GFY and attach $.02 stating your opinion of his policies.
     
  19. soulman969

    soulman969 Member

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    When a promoter sponsors a concert he's agreeing to pay all costs and assume all risks vs collecting ticket revenues and whatever else he gets a piece of and he pays each band as per their agreed upon contract. Usually a set fee.

    When booking bands the club owner is the promoter and takes the same risks vs take at the door if there's a cover and the bar take for the night. Any band can only do so much to put butts in seats the rest is up to the club so I don't want to hear "we didn't do so well tonight" as an excuse for trying to chisel my pay down.

    I am not a partner in the bar so I don't share in losses on bad nights or gains on the good ones. I'm simply a paid contracted entertainer and provided I entertained as expected I need to be paid my agreed upon amount. I've only had this happen once and my response was "you do have the option of not booking us again but you do not have the option of not paying us in full tonight". Five of us insisted on it and we got paid.
     
  20. cosmic_ape

    cosmic_ape Supporting Member

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    It seems your local scene has not figured out "pay to play" yet.

    That's probably a good thing.
     

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