Kaiser, Frith...etc?

Discussion in 'The Sound Hound Lounge' started by KRosser, Feb 27, 2009.

  1. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    The post below is copied verbatim froma post I made in a recent Henry Kaiser-bashing thread and because of the back-and-forth kinda got lost, I think.

    I really would love to have a thread devoted to this kind of playing and get some input from the people like me that really love it.

    I remember reading at article in Guitar Player in the late 70's when I was teenage guitarist interested in Yes, Zeppelin, King Crimson, Mahavishnu, just dicovering jazz, raised on the Beatles and Motown and my Dad's country records - it was called "Avant Garde Guitar" and in it were pictures of people doing things and describing things I'd never heard of or seen and I was completely fascinated - Derek Bailey, Fred Frith, Henry Kaiser, Keith Rowe, Hans Reichel etc, were featured. In the small town in Massachusetts where I lived there was nowhere to hear this stuff or find the records, so several years later when I stumbled across Henry Kaiser's "It's A Wonderful Life" in a used LP bin I snapped it up

    I was completely floored by it. And off I went...

    I really understand some people hate this stuff. I get it. Could I kindly ask that you refrain from attacking here? I welcome and encourage you to attack any of this stuff in another thread.

    Anyway - I'd love to have a thread where the lovers of this kind of stuff can share some things because I know there's a lot out there I haven't heard

    Avante garde? I don't know what to call it.

    Anyway - if you're game, scroll down...and please, add on!
     
  2. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    My original post from the other thread:

    Just stumbled across this when I was checking out some of the other HK youtubes - I really like this one, an almost Terry Riley-esque solo looping improv accompanying what I assume is his own underwater footage:

    Pt. 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzKgc...eature=related

    Pt. 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_tLX...eature=related

    Beautiful... (Hey! Looks like a Teuffel Niwa...wicked cool...I'd love to know what fuzz he kicks in around 5:00 of the second part)

    Let's not forget, in many ways the spiritual godfather of much of what Henry does is the great Fred Frith - and I'm sure Henry'd be the first to tell you that. There's some incredible Frith stuff out there:

    Solo in Poland: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2WSeZZV6iQ

    Solo in Los Angeles, part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyUL6...eature=related

    Solo in LA part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzsfN...eature=related

    I remember hearing about this LA gig but I had a gig of my own...now I wish I would have played hooky and gone to this...
     
  3. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    I wish there was some good footage of Hans Reichel playing guitar...I would think it would look as fascinating as it sounds....
     
  4. seiko

    seiko Member

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  5. hudpucker

    hudpucker Member

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  6. daphil

    daphil Member

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    Ok, I'll play.

    I really like that kind of music, whether it's guitar or whatever. When I was a teenager and learning guitar, my father was really into a lot of "musique actuelle" CD's, especially Montreal's "Ambiance Magnétique" label artists like Jean Derome and René Lussier and the Victoriaville festival scene. He would also play me Sakamoto and many others, like Fripp and Eno.

    So yeah, SRV, Page and Hendrix got me to play the guitar but it grew old very quick and I'm grantful that I was given the opportunity to broaden my aesthetics horizon.

    Here's a (bad) clip of René Lussier playing in a local bar with Voivoid's drummer Michel "away" Langevin. Voivoid is an old metal/hardcore mainstay and for those who may not know, as been cited as an important influence by the guys in Metallica.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5zr40sMkos

    Here's another clip in a totally different vibe.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_cIIPtI7W4&feature=related

    Lussier has played often with Frith, especially as a member of the Fred Frith Guitar Quartet.
     
  7. seiko

    seiko Member

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  8. Scott Miller

    Scott Miller Member

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    Henry Kaiser used to have a local radio show here. I got turned on to a lot of cool stuff from that.
     
  9. derekd

    derekd Supporting Member

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    Kaiser's stuff is interesting enough. Stuff that is a bit out there always interests me, but doesn't always hold my attention. I like being exposed to it in smaller chunks, as I appreciate the artist pushing typical limits or boundaries. Certainly inspires ideas for widening the tonal pallette in more typical musical settings.
     
  10. kludge

    kludge The droid you're looking for Silver Supporting Member

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    One of the best things I learned from Henry Kaiser is the nearly universal validity of music. He loves EVERYTHING, and that's a healthy attitude. Henry Kaiser is a wildly eclectic musician who not only plays many styles, but also free cross-pollenates them. I do the same thing, and that's thanks at least in part to HK's influence.
     
  11. fetishfrog

    fetishfrog Member

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    I grew up in Cincinnati where this kind of stuff was simply unavailable. At OSU school of music, I was basically half asleep during music history class (except for Bach of course) until we hit Stravinsky, where my ears suddenly perked up and I thought 'now...what have we here?'. I immediately developed a rather broard taste in outside music. (Incidentally, I suppose I was always wired to like this stuiff, my favorite parts of all my favorite Hendrix records were always the feedbacky explosion bits, I enjoyed Miles' music, but Bitches Brew was just the cat's meow to me, etc, etc.). I've loved Derek Bailey just as soon as the needle hit the vinyl, have always enjoyed Kaiser, I own 2 Pat Metheny records (guess which ones)...I guess I've always found a home in experimental music.

    I suppose I've never understood the opinion that experimental music is something people 'learn to love' and therefore isn't any good, because I took to it so naturally.
     
  12. fetishfrog

    fetishfrog Member

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    He has such a huge and humbling musical vocabulary. He's also a really nice guy. I got to share a bill with him a couple of years ago, played a Klein through a Fender Blues Jr. and killed it.
     
  13. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    Me too. "Revolution 9" was always one of my favorite Beatle tracks...this was a decade before anyone told me electronic music was 'difficult' or controversial in any way....

    Fetish - have we met?
     
  14. teleharmonium

    teleharmonium Member

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    I'm a big fan of Reichel, and of Keith Rowe and his longtime group AMM (he wasn't on everything of theirs but it's all great). I've never had a chance to see Reichel, I have everything he ever did on vinyl though, I've seen AMM a couple of times and Rowe solo once.

    Also there's Masayuki Takayanagi, who was a straight ahead jazz player from the 50s up until 1969 (and still did some gigs and recordings that were straight ahead, modern big band, bossa, or flamenco influenced after his transition); he went way out there generally, making fantastic and intense free improv and abstract soundscape material either in groups or solo. He had heavy chops, so he might be the kind of player that could bridge the gap for some folks around here if they heard the right material. His stuff tends to be hard to find although there's more available now than ever before. He had many students (and was a famous hardass) some of whom still work in the style in some way.

    Sonny Sharrock is fairly well known; I am a big fan of his albums "Monkey Pockey Boo" and "Black Woman" and his contributions to other albums from that time period such as "Eternal Rhythm" by Don Cherry. His post retirement stuff isn't as cool, to me, but I like it OK.

    Pete Cosey can be as out there as any of these guys when he wants to be, and I've seen videos where he's playing a second guitar which is lying on the floor and using effects to get some pretty weird sounds.

    Rafael Toral has done some pretty cool stuff with guitars. Remko Scha did a cool album called "Machine Guitars". Ray Russell had an aggressively out there period typified by "Dragon Hill" and "Live at the ICA". Derek Bailey, everyone with an interest in this probably already knows about, needless to say I'm a fan.

    There are lots of younger guys doing avant guitar of course, and it overlaps with the 70s minimalism to no wave spectrum (DNA, Rhys Chatham, Glenn Branca, leading to Sonic Youth, etc).
     
  15. fetishfrog

    fetishfrog Member

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    In all honesty, I don't think so, but I'll bet we've been at the same Nels Cline shows.

    I knew I was in trouble when my dad gave me a copy of Hendrix at Monterey and I puzzled over how Jimi got that wall of sound at the end. I really wanted to be able to do that...until I realized I have to destroy my guitar to do so. Ah the follies of youth. :)
     
  16. teleharmonium

    teleharmonium Member

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    That's my town. When were you here ? There were great record stores in the early 70s to mid 80s (Kidds, Another, Subway) that had lots of out there stuff, but that wouldn't have helped you if you didn't have a way to find out about them or if that wasn't your era. After the early 80s, there wasn't squat for avant garde or free jazz, and what little there was in the remaining used record shops, would have been quickly scooped up by me. Sorry about that.

    I feel you. The way I look at it is, if you are willing to apply your imagination to the form of music and think of it like film, where ideas and images can be used with a lot of freedom and still be comprehended and appreciated by an audience, it's easy to get experimental music. Otherwise, if you think music is a certain thing and you have no use for sounds as art or entertainment otherwise, you can't get anything out of it. As with a lot of things in life, people tend to think their reactions are contained within and caused by things, but they're really within and about themselves.
     
  17. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    I really like Lussier a lot...

    Those Frith Quartet records should be required listening for anyone interested in this stuff - Frith, Lussier, Nick Didkovsky and Mark Stewart

    Didkovsky is a guitarist/composer in NYC. Mark Stewart is another NYC guy who is the guitarist for the Bang On A Can All Stars, a great new-chamber-music ensemble and his day gig is touring with Paul Simon and doing Broadway pit work.
     
  18. KRosser

    KRosser Member

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    There are certainly a number of players who have authentically and often contributed to this particular body of work, but have managed to spread these types of sounds and techniques into more decidely mainstream fare - Adrian Belew, Bill Frisell, Marc Ribot and our own David Torn being some names that immediately come to mind.

    These guys have all played on Grammy winning or nominated records with great commercial success, and at the same time have made recordings completely within the bounds of what we're talking about here that would easily stand up next to the best of them.
     
  19. fetishfrog

    fetishfrog Member

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    :), no sweat, at least they were grabbed by someone who dug 'em. I was born there in '74, moved to Columbus in '92, then to LA in '97. I may be there this summer (June) on tour in a pretty imposing and dense prog rock band. I'll let ya know. Oh, and I have canned Skyline shipped to my place in LA.

    This is an excellent post.
     
  20. gearitis

    gearitis Gold Supporting Member

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    I saw Fred Frith in the late 70's and he blew me away. I had no idea who he was at the time or remotely what he sounded like. I just knew from the poster around campus that this guy would be playing "prepared guitar" and I wanted to see what that was all about. His performance was amazing and it really opened up my mind as far as what was sonically possible.

    About 6-7 years later I took a date to see Fred at McCabe's in Santa Monica. (I know-what the hell was I thinking. LOL!) She couldn't hang with what Fred was doing and she lasted about two minutes. I thought that she had a more open musical mind, but I sure was wrong.
     

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