Discussion in 'Digital & Modeling Gear' started by seigmen, Jul 19, 2019.
I know new tech comes out all the time... but dammit, I just got the profiler unpowered toaster and remote this Spring, been carrying them this summer to gigs 3 times a week thinking how surprisingly heavy it is compared to a small combo. Making my last payment on it this month. I really would have liked to know this was coming. There’s several touring artist bands I know in Nashville that just purchased Kemper rigs for the entire band this summer. If this Profiler Stage does do everything the toaster and remote do all in one, you’re going to have some upset people. I understand it from a business side, but at the same time it really seems a bit shady for Kemper to keep this such a secret while not dropping prices on their current models over the past year. Recent Kemper buyers bit the bullet knowing it was more expensive than the rival floor units and bought it anyway knowing the only con was... it’s not a floor unit. A lot of working musicians can’t afford to get two Kempers within a year or two of each other. I researched so much hoping this wouldn’t happen, at least for an entire year. I was just at Summer NAMM yesterday and didn’t see anything from Kemper, but I did see several new cases released for the toaster, rack, and remote.
That being said, my complaining out of the way, we don’t know exactly what this is. What we can see on the boxes does look strikingly similar to the Remote with the switch layout. They would have to have some genius innovative design or touchscreen in order to pack everything the Profiler unit does in the the one part they blurred out. It does look a bit taller than the Remote though.
At this point, if they released a more lightweight Remote, or if this was a cheaper floor unit that complimented the Profiler (less functionality), and they release the editor so I don’t have to scroll through every freaking effect every time I’m trying build a new performance with a boost and reverb, I wouldn’t be disappointed with my purchase not even 6 months ago.
And yes, I still can be happy with the Kemper Profiler the way it is, and still be disappointed a floor unit was released less than 6 months after I paid full price.
In my eyes/ears, the Kemper has by far the best amp sounds of anything out there. But overall, has the worst sounding effects of the big three. The delays and reverbs are very, very good now, but the modulation and filter stuff is lacking. And adding the fact there's no editor to the need for improved effects would lead me to think that a $2k model would be suicidal. I would imagine a limited amount of effects and stomps, like the Stomp, no Morphing, and some of the other stuff that could separate the floor unit from the main one, and lower the overall cost to something more competitive.
Se7en = winner winner chicken dinner
IF this is a new floor unit, and IF it has the new OS and editor, and IF it can do all current KP stuff, and IF they are ready to ship in qty., this will turn the digital market on its head.
Maybe someone's been watching all of the drama play out with a certain other new floor unit and chose to go all 'double-top-secret' and beat them to the punch?
The software it there. The new OS and editor should be super close. It's really just a mechanical re-packaging. The current units have a lot of wasted space if you don't stuff amps in them. Given all of the guts and the I/O requirements it wouldn't take long at all for a small engineering group to put this together (ever worked with a group of German based engineers? - I have twice. Brilliant and driven people with VERY hard heads from my experience)
Digital market could use a good standing on its head actually.
I believe that happened four years ago... Everyone else is still reacting.
Also, if they decide to make this the flagship product, it will essentially be Kemper 2. They could decide to stop production of the Head, and just have the rack and floor and with the editor it should serve most peoples needs and they won't compete with eachother.
21 x 8 x 4 cm
Should fit easily.
I think it can also be a powered version.
For the reasons I mentioned... cleaner, smaller footprint in front of me on stage. I’ve got the small(er) remote with one line out in front of me. It’s just super clean and compact. I never need to fiddle with my Kemper so I don’t need it right there at my feet... it’s off stage or off to an extreme edge of the stage out of the way.
Don’t get me wrong... I’m not knocking the new (whatever this new thing is). If it can run dual profiles I most definitely will consider it. Otherwise I just don’t really have the need or desire for it. I feel like my setup is a much smaller, cleaner setup and that (for me) is more enticing than having the Kemper itself at my feet. If all it gives is the same functionality but in an all in one unit... that isn’t too enticing for me since it is a bigger footprint on stage in front of me than just the remote itself. However, if we are talking functionality you can ONLY get with this unit that you can’t get with the toaster and remote (specifically dual profiles) then I’ll be on it like white on rice. Otherwise (for me) I can’t see a justification for it because it wouldn’t be an “upgrade”... it would be just a different form factor that takes up a bit more space in front of me.
You made me feel better about what I just complained about above. Hahaha. thank you. Good point. The convenience factor to carrying less to gigs makes the floor unit enticing but yes, on the stage itself, that’s a lot of expensive stuff in front of you. I play bars where people are constantly spilling drinks on the stage close to my Remote, and it’s very easy to kick out of the way. Having the Profiler safely out of the way in the back is something nice. The better you get with the Profiler the less need you have to mess with anything in a live setting that the Remote can’t do.
Not only that, there is no July 24, 2019 9 AM PST.
I think we're looking at a rift in the space/time continuum.
Four Kempers were just listed in the Emporium since yesterday.
I was going to buy a Kemper yesterday, no kidding. I ended up finding a Les Paul I liked and bought that instead.
Now I'm glad I didn't. A floor unit would make a lot more sense for me.
That LP looks killer, too!
I totally hear your concerns. I’m about a year into the Kemper and am bummed to see this may lower the value of my toaster. That said, if Kemper doesn’t undercut their current products in price and depending on what this unit does, we aren’t looking at a unit that will devalue our units. That’s my hope. If it’s the same tech, but say capable of running two amps instead of one (more DSP or effect blocks), they haven’t replaced their “old” units, because up until a few days ago, their “old tech” was still the very best that exists (IMO of course). So it’s still the same, just a different format. For those like me who use pedals in front and the toaster like an amp, this isn’t appealing at all, even with the ability of two amps (although as I type that I may be changing my mind, ha).
Soooo happy to be off that train, after 15 years of constant amp flipping, attenuator tryouts, master volume scenarios. Now it's just the Toaster and I've never been happier or played as much without fiddling with knobs. One $10 behringer footswitch to change profiles.
There isn't a new technology based product out there that isn't subject to having a better one come along, at any time. Value as in $ might be decreased? I don't know how anyone would expect otherwise.
You and I are on the same page in regards to the end of your post, but I’m not sure how a new Kemper anything (even if it is a new flagship product) devalues what you currently own if what you currently own meets all your needs. If you have the incessant need to always have the latest and greatest tech... then yes your wallet will probably take a hit when it comes time to upgrade. But if the current Kemper and remote meets your needs and you are happy with it... then it is no less valuable tomorrow when something new comes out than it is today. As long as you own it... value is what YOU place on it. They could start selling tomorrow for $100 a pop and that doesn’t make it one less iota capable. If you aren’t planning on selling it and instead you are planning on using it... who cares what other people list and buy them for? If it was worth 2+ grand yesterday when you bought it (if it met your needs enough for you to value it at that price then), it shouldn’t be $1 less valuable to you tomorrow when something new comes out because it’s functions and capabilities haven’t changed at all.
I guess I’m saying don’t place a value on it based on what other people are paying for it. You already own it... so place a value on it based on how it currently meets your needs. If it meets all your needs and you are happy with it, then it was worth every penny you paid.
I have a feeling they'll announce a shipping date faster than Fractal can.
There's no way it'll be over $2K for a floorboard. They'll price themselves out of the market. An unpowered toaster is $1800 new, and works with any MIDI controller, no? Convenience is only worth so much to people. My guess is $1600 or less, AND it profiles.
Manufacturers need to remember they're competing against not only other companies (in this case Line 6 and Fractal) but also themselves. The used market is vibrant. They can't introduce a $2K+ floorboard, when you can get a toaster+MIDI controller for way less.
I don’t think anyone would expect to buy any digital music gear in this day and age and expect it to retain value and not be replaced. What has happened though with other tech companies, the act of releasing an upgraded replacement out of the blue, at the same price, while their current product was still full price and selling well up to that point, has left a bad taste in many consumers mouth. When you buy a new car, you know it will only be that current model for 1-3 years before it gets updated, refreshed, or redesigned. But as that model ages, they usually start offering incentives and sales because they know people know something better is coming along. So, I think if anyone mentions value with something like a Kemper releasing a new Kemper, I think it’s referring to the value of a full priced, new to the buyer product literally dropping drastically overnight with no foresight. Even Apple has had to deal with backlash from this before and offered something to make up for upsetting their recent buyers. It comes down to feeling a bit lied from the company to a customer.
Is just a theory since I don't have access to the code. When processing audio in real-time, the higher frequency data typically takes more processing power to get right since there is way more of it per unit of time. The high sounds artifacty to me on Kemper (and is why I sold mine), so I figured this is the case.