Lehle P-Split - Any Signal Loss?

Bluesful

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
44,179
Hi All.

I'm looking for a passive splitter (don't want to be bothered with active and having to deal with power) to run 2 amps with and I'm looking at the Lehle P-Split.

Can anyone advise if there's any significant signal loss (I get that there will be some) with the P-Split, or do you need to run a buffer?

Ideally I'm looking to use one device to split (that doesn't need power), thus looking for something that doesn't suck too much signal to the point a buffer is needed.

I'm just running straight into the amps and not through a pedalboard or anything like that.

Any thoughts on the P-Split would be appreciated.

*NOTE - I have the Radial passive device on my board and that needs a buffer to run with it to counter the signal loss. I'm looking for something simple that I can just leave behind 2 amps and plug straight in.
 

augur

Member
Messages
1,394
No loss.
My pedalboard is buffered for your information.
High quality product !
 

Bluesful

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
44,179
My pedalboard is buffered for your information.

That's my concern. Without a buffer and 3 x 10ft cables (so 30ft of cable in total - 1 from the guitar, 1 to amp A and 1 to amp B) I assume there's going to be signal loss.
 

Frank67

Member
Messages
1,874
0.0000 impact on tone. Really, with Lehle this does simply not happen. The audio components are all top notch quality.
 

LehleSupport

Member
Messages
339
Hey there,

thanks for your recommendations.
Indeed there are different reasons for signal loss and ways to avoid it.
Usually it's the cable length if the the signal is unbuffered. You can avoid this by using a high quality buffer such as the LEHLE SUNDAY DRIVER
Lehle Sunday Driver
This buffer doesn't change the sound, doesn't add treble, whatsoever. If you notice too much treble, is usually by the fact that you turned the treble/presence knob at the amp more and more in the years when playing without buffer, in order to compensate the treble loss by the cable. Here's an article I wrote for our blog about what a buffer is doing and why:
https://blog.lehle.com/2017/06/14/do-i-need-a-buffer/

If there's treble loss or a massive volume drop when splitting by the LEHLE P-SPLIT II it's caused by different impedances of the amp's inputs. Usually an amp input has an impedance of 1 Ohm. The P-SPLIT II has a high-impedance transformer, meaning your passive guitar signal won't be changed due the transformer, so the amps "see" a high impedance signal. If one amp's input is dramatically lower in the impedance, the impedance will be pulled down and the result is a massive volume drop and treble loss. Usually this won't happen because the amps normally have that high input impedance.
But the P-SPLIT II doesn't preserve the sound. E.g. if you are running 5m (16ft) before the split and and 2x 5m cables to the amps, you are having a complete length of 15m (49ft) which is very long. I'd buffer it, but the individual taste will decide eventually. We recommend a maximum overall length of 10m (33ft), if the signal is not buffered.

When are they coming out with a perpetual motion machine?

Next NAMM.

In the making!

Cheers
Joki
 

Bluesful

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
44,179
If there's treble loss or a massive volume drop when splitting by the LEHLE P-SPLIT II it's caused by different impedances of the amp's inputs. Usually an amp input has an impedance of 1 Ohm. The P-SPLIT II has a high-impedance transformer, meaning your passive guitar signal won't be changed due the transformer, so the amps "see" a high impedance signal. If one amp's input is dramatically lower in the impedance, the impedance will be pulled down and the result is a massive volume drop and treble loss. Usually this won't happen because the amps normally have that high input impedance.
But the P-SPLIT II doesn't preserve the sound. E.g. if you are running 5m (16ft) before the split and and 2x 5m cables to the amps, you are having a complete length of 15m (49ft) which is very long. I'd buffer it, but the individual taste will decide eventually. We recommend a maximum overall length of 10m (33ft), if the signal is not buffered.

Thanks for your thoughts Joki.

Interesting thoughts around the impedance of the amp input. I use a number of different amps, thus I wonder how each will have a different impedance in relation to each other and the P Split.

I run 3 x 10ft cables, thus that's above your recommendation. I'm thinking I could run 10ft into the P Split and then grab a couple of smaller cables (eg. less than 10ft) to run into amp A and amp B.

I know Joe Bonamassa uses a P Split and he has it sitting behind the amps, so I think he must only be running short cables from the P Split to his amps.
 




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