Line 6 aaaaarg war story

[ABKB]

I play Sunday mornings in a worship band. There are only 2 pedals I keep on all the time, one is my comp (Mxr Super comp, aint cool I know but I love the thing, and my Line 6 Dl4 delay for just a little slapback unless I want more ambient stuff) So yesterday I am up there playing some amazing stuff (not lol) and I hit one of the longer delay patches to go into a solo, and as I am looking down, the thing just shuts off. Poof, nothing. Luckily I have it in TB mode so my sound is still there. Not knowing what else to do, I hit the patch again and it starts up again. Later on I look down and the thing is now off again. I hit the patch again and it comes back. I managed to limp along till the service was over, but I am fuming. I have had that thing for 2 years give or take, and never had a problem till yesterday. I knew in the back of my head that reliability was a problem with these things, but I chose it because it really did sound good. But for $250, I expect a lot longer than 2 years. And if eqipment goes at a practice, I will futz with it, but when eqipment goes bad LIVE, thats it, bye, too-da-loo, it's over baby. So I spent another $200 I dont have on a Boss gigadelay. I need something where I can switch between short and long delays and about the only affordable ones are the Line 6 and the Boss. After that, I will take the boss reliability, not to mention the 5 year warranty over the 1 year on the Line 6.

Sorry for the long rant guys, I am having a "doh" moment here where I bought something despite repeated warnings from others about the Line 6. And line 6 if your listening, your Dl4 burned me and you lost a customer. Cant say I abuse my pedals, I keep em all mounted on a MKS pedalpad and yes I use the Line 6 power supply for that pedal. I baby my stuff man. I got $30 pedals that have lasted longer than the Dl4.

So theres my war story for the week. I shoulda, but didnt so it burned me.

 

[CBeeper]

I had the same problem with mine. I would say it was a power supply issue but i see your using the L6 supply. If that's not it try cleaning the switch pads inside. I opened mine up and sprayed contact cleaner into the small pcb mounted pads. That seemed to fix it for a while. I ended up buying a new one eventually.......

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by CBeeper
I had the same problem with mine. It could be a power issue. Are you using the Line6 power supply? If that's not it try cleaning the switch pads inside. I opened mine up and sprayed contact cleaner into the small pcb mounted pads. That seemed to fix it for a while. I ended up buying a new one eventually.......

Yep, I use the Line 6 power supply. I am sure it can be fixed, but as I said, once something goes out on me live, it's over done cooked bye bye. I am sure it will make a great doorstop.

 

[MAZ]

Originally posted by ABKB
Yep, I use the Line 6 power supply. I am sure it can be fixed, but as I said, once something goes out on me live, it's over done cooked bye bye. I am sure it will make a great doorstop.

But the difference between something going out live and in rehearsal is pure chance... it makes no sense that you would get rid of something because it happened to go out live rather than in rehearsal. It's not like the pedal knows what you're doing!!! If it's really going to be a doorstop send it to me (i'll pay shipping) and I'll get it fixed!!

I think you may like the Boss DD20 better anyway though. With the exception of not being able to go from preset 1 to preset 4 without 3 stomps, I like mine better.

 

[ABKB]

Hi Maz
Oh I agree, the pedal doesnt know the difference lol. It's just an artificial line I draw in the sand in regards to equipment. As to sending it to you, let me get my DD20 (should be here in a couple days) and make sure it works, then I may put it up in the emporium, clearly stating it needs fixing to see if anybody wants it. If nobody does, we can talk. I would probably cool down and think about keeping the thing, but the record on these units is awful, so out it goes. I dont like getting burned twice.

 

[MAZ]

Originally posted by ABKB
Hi Maz
Oh I agree, the pedal doesnt know the difference lol. It's just an artificial line I draw in the sand in regards to equipment. As to sending it to you, let me get my DD20 (should be here in a couple days) and make sure it works, then I may put it up in the emporium, clearly stating it needs fixing to see if anybody wants it. If nobody does, we can talk. I would probably cool down and think about keeping the thing, but the record on these units is awful, so out it goes. I dont like getting burned twice.

Yeah, I hear you, I was just giving you a hard time! I have felt betrayed by a wah pedal that ONLY had trouble during gigs, never in rehearsal!!! Instead of fixing it, it's sitting on a shelf. But then again it was just a run of the mill 90's Crybaby, nothing special. But, man, it sure seemed that thing knew the absolute worst time to act up!!

I don't think I ever had trouble with my DL4, but like I said, in many ways I like the DD20 better. And I've heard about the poor DL4 track record too.

I'd say put it up in the Emporium- with the new Keeley mods, odds are someone will want it!!

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by MAZ
Yeah, I hear you, I was just giving you a hard time! I have felt betrayed by a wah pedal that ONLY had trouble during gigs, never in rehearsal!!! Instead of fixing it, it's sitting on a shelf. But then again it was just a run of the mill 90's Crybaby, nothing special. But, man, it sure seemed that thing knew the absolute worst time to act up!!
I don't think I ever had trouble with my DL4, but like I said, in many ways I like the DD20 better. And I've heard about the poor DL4 track record too.
I'd say put it up in the Emporium- with the new Keeley mods, odds are someone will want it!!

I know, it's cool.
I mean I know these little boxes have no intellegence, but I sware they know live vs practice :NUTS I know that makes no sense, but man, when stuff DOES go bad, it always seems to be live.
As to the DD20, I hope I do like it better. I know it's not TB and that bugs me (since I have it on all the time a looper wouldnt do me much good), I can deal with the having to hit the pedal more than once to go from 1 to 3, and I did also buy the little footswitch so I can do tap tempo without having to mess around much. But there was not a chance I was going to pay for another Line 6 so I didnt have much choice. I could have gotten a few different delays to get what I want, but I just plain dont have the cash, so to Boss I go.

 

[MAZ]

Well, as to it being on all the time, I think that's where you'll like it more.

It wasn't until I was on a tour with in-ear monitors that I noticed how many of the Line6 models really mess with the direct tone. There's a few that don't, but a lot of them really thin out the direct tone. I think (best guess) that this is Line6's attempt to model what the original pedals do as well, but it became a real bummer to me. So, in that respect, with it on all the time I think you'll like your tone more. Unless of course you were only using the few models that didn't thin out the tone on the Line6!

And yes, a tap tempo pedal is a must! There's a way to do it with the right pedal by holding it for a few seconds or something, but that's just too much for my feet to remember!!!

 

[John Phillips]

My DL-4 screwed up at a gig too - the loop sampler wouldn't record a new loop, it just kept playing back the one from the last song no matter which button I pressed, until I actually reached down and turned the Model knob to another setting and back again - luckily it was in the intro to a song, so we just stopped and waited until I'd sorted it out before starting the song again... if it had happened in the middle of a song it could have been an embarrassing Ashlee Simpson moment .

Some sort of software glitch I assume, as it didn't do it again, but after that gig I stopped using the loop sampler since I didn't trust it, and it wasn't long before I dumped the DL-4 - I'd begun to dislike the tone of it anyway. I just went back to using two separate Boss delay pedals (DM-2 and DD-5)... smaller, simpler, better sounding. The first gig I played with just the DM-2 was the last time I ever played the DL-4, the tone difference was that big.

Originally posted by MAZ
It wasn't until I was on a tour with in-ear monitors that I noticed how many of the Line6 models really mess with the direct tone. There's a few that don't, but a lot of them really thin out the direct tone. I think (best guess) that this is Line6's attempt to model what the original pedals do as well, but it became a real bummer to me.

It's due to the pedal digitizing the dry signal as well as the repeats I think... I don't remember hearing models any that didn't affect the dry tone. The classic digital delays (Boss DD-3 etc) don't do this, they keep the dry signal analog.


My DD-5 eventually proved unreliable too though... the delay would intermittently go grainy and then stop working, although at least the dry signal wasn't affected so it didn't even interrupt the song. This is the only Boss pedal I've ever had a problem with, and one of only a tiny handful I've ever seen or even heard about.

So now I have no digital pedals on my board - I do have another digital delay in a rack unit, but it's got an analog dry-signal path and a hard bypass switch so I'm happy enough to use it knowing that I can get by if I have to one way or the other.

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by MAZ
Well, as to it being on all the time, I think that's where you'll like it more.

It wasn't until I was on a tour with in-ear monitors that I noticed how many of the Line6 models really mess with the direct tone. There's a few that don't, but a lot of them really thin out the direct tone. I think (best guess) that this is Line6's attempt to model what the original pedals do as well, but it became a real bummer to me. So, in that respect, with it on all the time I think you'll like your tone more. Unless of course you were only using the few models that didn't thin out the tone on the Line6!

And yes, a tap tempo pedal is a must! There's a way to do it with the right pedal by holding it for a few seconds or something, but that's just too much for my feet to remember!!!

Thanks Maz, that's good to hear I do agree that some of the Line 6 models do mess with the signal. Sometimes I liked that, other times I didnt. The tape delay seemed to be the worst offender, but then I played with an echoplex many years ago and it did the same thing. So yeah, maybe Line 6 was a little TOO realistic in that sense. As a result I rarely used the tape delay unless I wanted that type of thing. I did really like the (I cant remember the exact name now) E~H modulation patch, but I have also heard the Boss one is very good as well. For my short slapback I used the analog patch (which also seemed to mess a tad with the signal), but since that patch was based on a Boss, maybe this will be better for me in the longrun! And oh yes, I was not going to mess around with all that tap dancing on stage just to get at tap tempo. It's bad enough we are up there counting time, have both hands working while at the same time getting one foot up for the next effect to hit. Lol, it's amazing we dont fall flat on our faces more often, and thats without having to hold a pedal down for three seconds, then tap the tempo, then let go, then have to figure out how to get BACK to where we want to be for the next part lol. Gimme one button to do it and thats it.

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by John Phillips
My DL-4 screwed up at a gig too - the loop sampler wouldn't record a new loop, it just kept playing back the one from the last song no matter which button I pressed, until I actually reached down and turned the Model knob to another setting and back again - luckily it was in the intro to a song, so we just stopped and waited until I'd sorted it out before starting the song again... if it had happened in the middle of a song it could have been an embarrassing Ashlee Simpson moment .
Some sort of software glitch I assume, as it didn't do it again, but after that gig I stopped using the loop sampler since I didn't trust it, and it wasn't long before I dumped the DL-4 - I'd begun to dislike the tone of it anyway. I just went back to using two separate Boss delay pedals (DM-2 and DD-5)... smaller, simpler, better sounding. The first gig I played with just the DM-2 was the last time I ever played the DL-4, the tone difference was that big.
It's due to the pedal digitizing the dry signal as well as the repeats I think... I don't remember hearing models any that didn't affect the dry tone. The classic digital delays (Boss DD-3 etc) don't do this, they keep the dry signal analog.
My DD-5 eventually proved unreliable too though... the delay would intermittently go grainy and then stop working, although at least the dry signal wasn't affected so it didn't even interrupt the song. This is the only Boss pedal I've ever had a problem with, and one of only a tiny handful I've ever seen or even heard about.
So now I have no digital pedals on my board - I do have another digital delay in a rack unit, but it's got an analog dry-signal path and a hard bypass switch so I'm happy enough to use it knowing that I can get by if I have to one way or the other.

Thanks for the input John. Like I said, I sware these little boxes KNOW lol. As to the Boss, I know Boss aint as perfect as some would say, but at least I get a 5 year warranty with the DD20, vs 1 year with the DL4. I got a Boss MEB something or other for my bass rig, and it would just switch between "manual" and patch mode at will. Had it fixed and it did the same thing again a week later. Now it collects dust. But for the most part, Boss will do better than Line 6. Any purchase to some degree is a chance. But I am a bit better covered with Boss.

 

[rawkguitarist]

Check your power situation. If there is a voltage drop the DL4 is sensitive to this. Are you plugged into a power source that is drained by many amps/equipment? Is it an old building? If not, is there simply a problem with the wiring in the building?

There are more variables than just your pedal and it's power supply. Plus, there are quite a few high profile pros that use this gear with good results.

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by aarondavis
Check your power situation. If there is a voltage drop the DL4 is sensitive to this. Are you plugged into a power source that is drained by many amps/equipment? Is it an old building? If not, is there simply a problem with the wiring in the building?

There are more variables than just your pedal and it's power supply. Plus, there are quite a few high profile pros that use this gear with good results.

Thanks aaron. Checked, all my pedals plug into the same power supply. The MKS pedalboard I use has a the power, unit with one regular outlet on the side, that outlet is what I plug the Line 6 into. So if there were a power problem, my whole sound would go silent. The building is a new (5-6 years old) building that I have been playing in for close to two years now, never had a problem.

 

[BmoreTele]

No matter what preparations you make, stuff happens when you're live.

One way to deal with it is to get two delays. That way, if one craps out, you probably still have one to go to. I usually run three delays, sometimes four, so maybe it's just that I'm a delay nut. Or maybe just a nut.

As to $ ... a Korg 301dl usually goes for $75 on Ebay and gives you 2 presets, from slapback to one second. Add a DE7 for about the same and you have a great analog sim, self oscillating wackiness, and another 2.6 seconds. Total cost - under $150. And if one breaks ... see above.

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by BmoreTele
No matter what preparations you make, stuff happens when you're live.
One way to deal with it is to get two delays. That way, if one craps out, you probably still have one to go to. I usually run three delays, sometimes four, so maybe it's just that I'm a delay nut. Or maybe just a nut.
As to $ ... a Korg 301dl usually goes for $75 on Ebay and gives you 2 presets, from slapback to one second. Add a DE7 for about the same and you have a great analog sim, self oscillating wackiness, and another 2.6 seconds. Total cost - under $150. And if one breaks ... see above.

Thanks for the input Bmore, but the reliability rating for the Korg (on HC) is worse than the Line 6. Based on what I have read from other people outside of HC, the unit sounds great, but bad switches etc... seem to drag the unit down. As far as live goes, I know stuff happens with the best of equipment. I am just trying to cut down on those mishaps as much as possible.

 

[kevin hart]

i had a switch go bad after about 6 months on my dl4. i decided to open it up & i was able to fix it myself, but it looks pretty cheesy inside. i just bought a boss dd3 and sonicly i think it kicks the line 6's ass. i may just start using a couple of those instead of the dl4. i'd also like to try a deluxe memory man since a couple of l.a. studio guys have told me they are using them again.

 

[BmoreTele]

Originally posted by ABKB
Thanks for the input Bmore, but the reliability rating for the Korg (on HC) is worse than the Line 6. Based on what I have read from other people outside of HC, the unit sounds great, but bad switches etc... seem to drag the unit down. As far as live goes, I know stuff happens with the best of equipment. I am just trying to cut down on those mishaps as much as possible.

There is an easy fix for the Korg delay. It's just a case of the original design mounted the input/output jacks to the PCB. The fix is in one of those HC reviews.

 

[Don Rusk]

When/If your DL4 locks up disconnect the power input, this resets it and should be fine..........of course thats no help if your in the middle of a loop or something

 

[ABKB]

Originally posted by DonneR
When/If your DL4 locks up disconnect the power input, this resets it and should be fine..........of course thats no help if your in the middle of a loop or something

Loop, or solo, or since I have it on all the time, ANYTHING for that matter.

 

[rawkguitarist]

ABKB, unless you want to spend $400 bucks on a Diamond Memory Lane or a Trex Replica there is really no other choice that does what the DL4 does. Only other possibility is the Boss Gigidelay. You’re talking about a mass produced gadget, by which, for the most part does exactly what the company says it will. Your fuse could blow, it's possible that a tube could go out, you could break a string. It's the same type of thing... equipment no matter how good it is, will have a problem eventually. Some sooner than others (especially pure production gear like L6).

I finally played through a TTE (only $1000) it sounds amazing!!!
BUT, even how awesome some of these high priced units are, nothing covers what my DL4 and Echopark cover.