Lowballing: Do you think it ever works?

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by bigfoamfinger, May 19, 2019.

If you made 500 lowball offers (40-50% below market value), would any of them be accepted?

  1. Yes

    65.4%
  2. No

    34.6%
  1. Toosday

    Toosday Member

    Messages:
    166
    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2017
    How is mutual agreement manipulation. The entitlement in this post is nauseating.

    What is sad is people not understanding something is worth what someone is willing to pay. A low ball offer is an option and hence has value. Someone who accepts a low-ball is not a victim just someone who needs liquidity. Liquidity is not free. Happens on Wall Street 1000s of times a day.
     
    derekd likes this.
  2. Toosday

    Toosday Member

    Messages:
    166
    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2017
    Seems like a reasonable question. He gives you an offer and you get smart with him. The negotiating skills of musicians are laughable.
     
    HERSCHEL likes this.
  3. DGA

    DGA Member

    Messages:
    851
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2016
    That's why I don't sweat "low-ball" offers. I'm happy to get an offer and then work from there.
     
    derekd and Toosday like this.
  4. Whittlez

    Whittlez Member

    Messages:
    2,135
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2015
    Location:
    Seattlr
    It depends on how accurately one defines market value (and for illiquid guitar models --- it's hard to define), how desperate the seller is, ...

    I've never had somebody who was ASKING for market value accept an offer of 50% of market value, but I've bought PLENTY of guitars *at* 50% of market value. I've had success with offering 30% below market value but not 50.

    Two guitars I believe I bought at 50% of market value were a mint N4 with COA and OHSC for $800 and a mint White Falcon for $1100...

     
  5. Mr.Darwin

    Mr.Darwin Member

    Messages:
    159
    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2015
    It's a predatory tactic , it's fishing for the weak or desperate that need the money and breaking off what you can from them.
    even if that's not the plan, that's what happens.
     
    yakyak likes this.
  6. Mr Fingers

    Mr Fingers Member

    Messages:
    1,670
    Joined:
    May 14, 2017
    I look forward to encountering a truly outrageous lowballer someday, simply because in hundreds of transactions for everything from expensive items to ordinary stuff, I have not as yet encountered this supposedly universal being. Honestly, I'm just not buying the army of lowballers myth. People knuckle under and sell stuff for very little all the time. Ask a pawnbroker. If you can't deal with a free market in a free country, stop selling stuff and stop complaining. Overpricing is a far more pervasive problem than any so-called lowballing.
     
    Alter, HERSCHEL, DGA and 1 other person like this.
  7. yakyak

    yakyak Supporting Member

    Messages:
    1,341
    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    I'll guess you've been really lucky! I generally encounter them every time I allow offers. That said, I just listed a guitar earlier this evening for $800. After a few hours I got an offer for $700 which I accepted. No jacking around, just a straight reasonable offer right out of the gate. That happens occasionally. It's what I call a serious buyer.
     
    derekd likes this.
  8. stratzrus

    stratzrus Philadelphia Jazz, Funk, and R&B Supporting Member

    Messages:
    19,762
    Joined:
    May 16, 2006
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    I would never do that, but under certain circumstances I might lowball:

    1. If the item hadn't sold for a significant period of time, like over three weeks.

    2. If I knew the seller was motivated (moving, divorce, etc.)

    3. If I really didn't care if I bought it or not.

    4. I never really lowball like that (half of the resale value) but I might offer $1,100 shipped on an item that usually sells for $1,500.
     
    derekd likes this.
  9. Gar O'Brien

    Gar O'Brien Member

    Messages:
    168
    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2016
    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    I'm from Ireland and we have a site called adverts.ie which is where the majority of the musical instrument trade gets done. As a nation, we're known for chancing our arm, but the carry on on adverts is unreal. One of my favourite examples:

    I was giving away a cry baby wah in the free section. It was working perfectly, but I had another so I figured I'd put some good karma out into the world. I marked it as collection only (hey, I'm not putting THAT much good energy out :) ). A guy came on and told me he'd take it if I could post it to him. I looked up the cost of posting and it was about $22. I said I'd rather not go to the hassle and expense of posting, but if he really wanted it he could send me a self addressed envelope with the postage paid. The reply came that he couldn't believe I had the nerve to ask for that, but that he was a reasonable guy; if I paid him about $50 for gas he would be willing to drive to the capital (where I live) and collect it.

    The moral of the story, for me, is that sometimes people just want to feel like they've won, and will be willing to go to outrageous lengths to get that win.
     
  10. candid_x

    candid_x Supporting Member

    Messages:
    7,826
    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2007
    Location:
    AZ
    Any halfway savvy person understands that dealers buy wholesale and sell at retail. Typical resale markup is keystone, when they can get it. If someone will sell it to a pawnshop for (say) $600, they will sell it to an individual for $700, even when they started out asking $1,000. It all depends how motivated the seller is.
     
    yakyak and derekd like this.
  11. BlackbirdVintageMusic

    BlackbirdVintageMusic Member

    Messages:
    416
    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2017
    Of course offering 40 cents on the dollar will work 1 out of 500 times. But why not offer 60% and have it work 200 times? Or 75% and have people waiting at your shop the moment it opens take your money?
     
  12. AprioriMark

    AprioriMark Supporting Member

    Messages:
    762
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2011
    Location:
    Tacoma
    I honestly laugh when I see threads with people getting offended about "lowball" offers. Those same people have endless justifications for why their used gear is worth so much. For me, it's a matter of how respectful an offer is or isn't.

    I will often offer much less than someone is asking, but only if I notice that it hasn't sold for a period of time. I offer what the item is worth to me, and I always preface it by saying that I hope they get what they're asking, but if they don't and they want to move it, their item is worth X to me, I won't waste their time and will come to them with cash in hand.

    I've actually made a few friends like this commiserating about the state of buying/selling. Ive also come into some amazing trades that ended up being great for both of us. It pays to be clear, respectful, and up front.

    -Mark
     
  13. gruenburger

    gruenburger Supporting Member

    Messages:
    266
    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2009
    Location:
    Miami
    the people who picked No are delusional
     
    AprioriMark likes this.
  14. daacrusher2001

    daacrusher2001 Silver Supporting Member

    Messages:
    4,710
    Joined:
    May 25, 2008
    Location:
    Northern NJ
     
    derekd, Toosday and AprioriMark like this.
  15. MisterBoh

    MisterBoh Member

    Messages:
    181
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2018
    Lowballing is just the first step in a dance.
     
    daacrusher2001, DGA and derekd like this.
  16. data_null

    data_null Member

    Messages:
    308
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2018
    Awww, looks like I triggered a delicate, little lowballer.

    Seems like you don't understand what the word entitlement means. Discussing facts about the type of people lowballers try to target isn't entitlement. Thinking someone should sell you something for next to nothing because you're trying to take advantage of them IS entitlement.

    Using deceptive tactics (e.g. lying, presenting fake info, etc...) to try to trick the seller into giving you the item for far less than its actual used market value is absolutely manipulation. It's the same type of tactics employed by phone scammers trying to trick people into thinking they owe the IRS (or whomever) money.

    If you can't afford to pay anywhere close to actual used market value for an item then perhaps you should be reconsidering your finances instead of shopping.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2019
    yakyak likes this.
  17. Toosday

    Toosday Member

    Messages:
    166
    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2017
    You are obviously not a professional business person.

    It is possible to be polite and drive a hard bargain. Like I said professionals do it everyday. I low ball bankers and traders all day for a living. Some take it and I stick by my word, some don't and I thank them for their time.

    Sometimes people low ball me. I simply say no thank you if I decline. An offer has value no matter how low. I guess you do not understand that.
     
  18. Average Joe

    Average Joe Member

    Messages:
    10,618
    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2010
    Location:
    On a chair, behind a desk
    I can't remember the last time i flat out lowballed. Of course I always start low, lower than I expect the seller to accept, but lowballing seem counterproductive.

    But of course it would work in a number of cases.
     
    yakyak likes this.
  19. data_null

    data_null Member

    Messages:
    308
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2018
    Lol. So to be a "professional business person" you have to lie and deceive everyone? Funny, we seem to be doing quite well without resorting to those methods.

    This has absolutely nothing to do with what I was discussing. Unless you are telling me you try to lie and use other deceptive tactics to get these deals done, or are trying to take advantage of people in desperate financial situations. You must be pretty bad at your job if you can't even follow this simple discussion.
     
  20. Toosday

    Toosday Member

    Messages:
    166
    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2017
    Not sure how you equate an offer that is lower than what you feel entitled to as deception.

    Like I said it is obvious you do not negotiate for a living.

    Best of luck.

    FYI if you are an amateur have have money in the stock market you or your fund managers are taking low ball offers all of the time. That is how financial markets work. Sheep vs wolves. You can be a perfectly successful wolf without having to dress up in grandma's clothes.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice