My final Eminence question before pulling the trigger :)

[enharmonic]

Could someone tell me what the sonic differences would be between a 4x12 loaded with Man-O-War's and thr same cab loaded with Greenbacks? I've read through as many of the threads as I can, but I've not seen a contrast between the two posted.

I'm considering these for my Wizard 4x12. I think I'd like to try changing the speakers before I start messing with the amp. I'm looking for a speaker with more punch and a tighter bottom than the Greenbacks.

Thanks in advance for any info. :

 

[Roccaforte Amps]

Originally posted by enharmonic
Could someone tell me what the sonic differences would be between a 4x12 loaded with Man-O-War's and thr same cab loaded with Greenbacks? I've read through as many of the threads as I can, but I've not seen a contrast between the two posted.

I'm considering these for my Wizard 4x12. I think I'd like to try changing the speakers before I start messing with the amp. I'm looking for a speaker with more punch and a tighter bottom than the Greenbacks.

Thanks in advance for any info. :

That depends whose 4 12" cab it is, you're not going to get the same speaker results with different cabs.
So far I like the Man'O'Wars best in every cab I've tried them in.

 

[JamesPeters]

Originally posted by Roccaforte Amps
That depends whose 4 12" cab it is, you're not going to get the same speaker results with different cabs.

Doug's right on this, that's for sure. If the cab is different even in a way you don't notice (or can't notice) it can still sound very different.

Anyway, assuming you're removing greenbacks and putting in Man O Wars into the same cab, there's a huge difference. If you want a greenback sound, don't get the Man O War. IMO it'd be a mistake. The Man O War is a much more modern/clear sounding speaker. It's not without its warmth but it's not much like a greenback at all. It's more like a G12T-75 with more mids and an overall smoother voicing.

 

[Buckeyedog]

If you want a more aggressive/tighter greenbackish sound, try the Private Jacks.

 

[enharmonic]

Thanks gents! The 4x12 would be my Wizard 4x12...same cab that the GB's are in now. The GB's are a bit too old school sounding for my tastes. I like the Wizard because it gives me a marshall meets hiwatt thing. I wish a speaker could give me a greenback meets fane thing to go along with it

I'm gonna start tweaking the speakers.

 

[rjmmusic]

There may be an Eminence speaker that does what you want, but as an owner of a 4x12 with Man-O-Wars installed I can tell you those aren't the speakers you're looking for. There's nothing Greenback about them at all IMHO.

How about Tonkers? Aren't they supposed to be "Fane-like"? (Not speaking from experience here, I just remember someone making the comparison at some point.)

 

[JamesPeters]

Originally posted by rjmmusic

How about Tonkers? Aren't they supposed to be "Fane-like"?

Don't even bother. Take the Man O War, make it sound even clearer with more top end. That's like the Tonker. They do have a Fane-like breakup character (at least to me) but they're not like some lower power rated speakers at all. If anything they're more hifi than the Man O War.

 

[Greazygeo]

You could try a VHT P50E.

I used the Tonkers for awhile with mine. Its a cool speaker, but not much bass. They are super tight and won't break up / fart out at all. Very clear and detailed mids and lots of treble (not shrill though). If they had more bass they would be killer. But 4 of them in a 4-12 cab weighs like a million pounds!!

For Eminence, I have not tried them myself, but probably the PJ's or Red Ryders might be good.

I normally dont like GB's for hi gain, but with the Wizard stuff, they sound awesome!

George

 

[rjmmusic]

Originally posted by Greazygeo
You could try a VHT P50E.

Good call. I bought some of them last year (from Greazygeo, actually) and from what I remember they were kind of a modern take on a GB.

 

[enharmonic]

George,

Hmmm...will look into them. This is only my 2nd experience with Greenbacks. I liked them with my old Rt. 66, but didn't love them. I ended up with a cabinet that had a greenback and a Naylor SD50 in it...that was a sweet combo for that amp.

After having a Wizard Modern Classic 50, I know that there's a lot more amp on tap than what I am getting out of the GB's. I wish I could swing 4 of the HJ 12's, but that's a bit too much $$ right now. Even my old Orange cab w V30's seemed bigger sounding. This cab sounds like it's strangling my tone.

I'm not knocking this cab, it sounds pretty damned good in a vintage kind of way...but I know what this amp is capable of, and the GB's...for as good as they are at what they do...really hold the Modern Classic back IMHO. I have a very aggressive attack...very slashing rhythm style. The GB's somehow seem to "soften" that up. I feel like there's a slight delay in their response. I need a speaker that punches more and holds up on the bottom due to my percussive right hand.

 

[Greazygeo]

Originally posted by enharmonic
George,

Hmmm...will look into them. This is only my 2nd experience with Greenbacks. I liked them with my old Rt. 66, but didn't love them. I ended up with a cabinet that had a greenback and a Naylor SD50 in it...that was a sweet combo for that amp.

After having a Wizard Modern Classic 50, I know that there's a lot more amp on tap than what I am getting out of the GB's. I wish I could swing 4 of the HJ 12's, but that's a bit too much $$ right now. Even my old Orange cab w V30's seemed bigger sounding. This cab sounds like it's strangling my tone.

I'm not knocking this cab, it sounds pretty damned good in a vintage kind of way...but I know what this amp is capable of, and the GB's...for as good as they are at what they do...really hold the Modern Classic back IMHO. I have a very aggressive attack...very slashing rhythm style. The GB's somehow seem to "soften" that up. I feel like there's a slight delay in their response. I need a speaker that punches more and holds up on the bottom due to my percussive right hand.

I know what you are saying. Compared to my Metal, the MC has a softer attack. My Metal is much quicker like my old Ultra Lead. Have you ever played a Metal?

The Celestion Classic Lead 80 would probably give you what you are looking.

Those VHT P50's sound really good in a rear loaded cab. Steve voiced them for front loaded cabs, but I had them in my Wizard cab (Metal V baffle) for awhile and they sounded great. But I ended up going with the GB's ( mine are really old with the 014 bass cones, so they are tighter and deeper) With my Metal they are awesome, with my MC they are abit on the bright side.

Here's a clip of my Metal thru one....

Metal / GB clip

George

 

[Greazygeo]

Originally posted by rjmmusic
Good call. I bought some of them last year (from Greazygeo, actually) and from what I remember they were kind of a modern take on a GB.

Hey Ron,

Are you the guy that sells the midi switching gizmo's? If so, they look pretty cool!

George

 

[thegame]

Originally posted by enharmonic
George,

I'm not knocking this cab, it sounds pretty damned good in a vintage kind of way...but I know what this amp is capable of, and the GB's...for as good as they are at what they do...really hold the Modern Classic back IMHO. I have a very aggressive attack...very slashing rhythm style. The GB's somehow seem to "soften" that up. I feel like there's a slight delay in their response. I need a speaker that punches more and holds up on the bottom due to my percussive right hand.

Rob, before swapping speakers try this inexpensive trick: Rewire the cab to 4 ohms (all parallel). The ultra lows and highs will be slightly attenuated and the mids will be enhanced. Not a huge tonal difference, but the feel will be quite different. Much tighter, stiffer, and quicker.

You should get a bit more gain from the amp too. This should help you out tremendously, if your amp has a 4 ohm output. Mine didn't. Well it did, but it wasn't hooked up. So hopefully yours does.

 

[rjmmusic]

Originally posted by Greazygeo
Hey Ron,

Are you the guy that sells the midi switching gizmo's? If so, they look pretty cool!

George

Yeah, that's me.

Back on topic, the P50Es are pretty tight sounding speakers. At one point, I also had a VHT 4x12 with them installed. VERY tight bottom end on that sucker.