My fuzz acting funny in the wrong position on my pedalboard line up!!!

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by sega, Aug 29, 2008.

  1. sega

    sega Member

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    I noticed that if I place my fuzz after all these ( budda wha -subdecay echobox-fulldrive2-distortion and fuzz )it acts funny, no more bass, and weird sounding overall.

    So I placed it right after my budda wah and it's great now!

    It's a strange thing that you can't use it at a certain place or order.

    My budda wah is now acting funny when I activate it and the fuzz is on!
    It makes a weird sound when I don't play the guitar.

    I don't mind a feedback, but it's worst than that.
    So now I don't know where to put it ....

    Any suggestion?

    Thanks
     
  2. VintageToneGuy

    VintageToneGuy Member

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    I'm not a Fuzz Guy; but they say to put Fuzz pedals 1st in line on the board. Perhaps they suggest this to elimiate some of these issues your facing. Also on the Wah; many Wah makers offer Fuzz 'thingys' with their pedals to make the wah more 'fuzz friendly'. So, obviously Fuzzes and wah's don't always get along.

    Here's what they say at Area 51 wah's:

    Buffer - This add-on circuit board allows you to run the wah in front of a fuzz face type pedal. Running them in that order gives you a more "natural" wah tone, rather than the nasally fuzz-wah tone that you get when running them the usual way. Normally, you cannot go from a wah to a fuzz - the low impedance of the fuzz "loads" the wah, causing it to not work properly - if at all. This board solves that.

    vtg
     
  3. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    There are two things about fuzz...

    1) They "amplify" a LOT...so much that they cut off the signal at the top,
    and bottom, what we call "clipping". Because of this, they really are made to see a guitar (which has a relatively tiny signal, that doesn't have much current...) and it's low input. Usually you want the signal into a fuzz to be small, and use the guitar vol to adjust it to sound good.
    When you had all those other pedals ahead of it, you give it too much signal, and it probably either went into super-fuzz...OR the signal going intto it had too much going on in it...(fuzzes like simple signals...complex ones make it freak out).
    When you put a wah only in front of it, depending on the fuzz (some do this more than others) the fuzz loaded down the wah...suffice to say the wah soung gets mangled in the fuzz.
    There is a company called Foxrox (also sold by analogman) that makes a wah-retrofit that puts a buffer in the wah so it will sound right into a fuzz.
    Some fuzzes (like the MXR Classic 108 fuzz, MI audio GI fuzz and Neo fuzz) have it so you can adjust the fuzz input to give higher impedance which helps the wah sound normal again.

    2) wahs have kind of high output impedance (I think) and fuzzes have generally low input impedances....this is bad. If you had a box
    of fuzzes, and wahs, most likely the best combinations would end up being fuzzes with either adjustable input impedance, wahs with buffers, or wahs that had slightly lower than average output impedances, fuzzes that had slightly high input impedances. There may be more to it though...some combinations just work, some not so much.

    You could try the other fuzz in front of the problem fuzz, or some pedal that doesn't mangle the signal (i,e, EQ pedal, compressor) and where you can turn it down so it doesn't overwhelm the fuzz.

    Or you could move the fuzz first in line before the wah. Personally I like fuzz after wah, and I have several fuzzes and wahs. One of the wahs I installed the wah-retrofit and it works excellent...but in other cases I have some fuzzes that just work okay, some fuzzes that can be adjusted to work okay, some wahs that work okay with most fuzzes, and some combinations that just don't work well of wahs and fuzzes.

    What kind of fuzz is it by the way? You mentioned the brand of all the other pedals but the fuzz was really important to know too!
     
  4. paraedolia

    paraedolia Member

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    Is it a Ge or Si fuzz?
    Most fuzzes like to be first in the chain (certainly Ge fuzzes). If you must put a wah in front of it, you need an output buffer or it will squeal and sound awful. There's been a lot of discussion on this here and elsewhere.
    FoxRox have prebuilt buffer retrofit kits that will solve your problem:
    Area 51 too.
    Or you can roll your own

    EDIT: OK, I sound like an echo now. VintageToneGuy & StompBoxBlues already answered your Q. At least we're all saying the same thing though...just don't get started on directional cables :D
    Go get the retrofit kit - you'll be glad you did.

    I just noticed you're in Canada -- Area51's shipping charges to Canada are high, FoxRox sends it regular mail, but you would be better off contacting Greg at solidgoldfx - he's in QC (might even be Montreal, I can't remember). He will do the mods for you. Here's the link: http://solidgoldfx.com/wah.php
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  5. Kev O)))

    Kev O))) Member

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    If its a Ge Fuzz it really needs to be first in the chain. If its an Si Fuzz, like a Muff or something, it could be run after and sound fine but I would still run it before your other dirt (OD, Distortions) and Modulation just to be safe.

    Remember, it's always better to run High-Gain first and gradually go down from there.
     
  6. briankp7

    briankp7 Supporting Member

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    I use Germanium Fuzzes (Analogman Sunface) & always run it first in the chain. If you do go after the wah make sure you put it before your O/Drive pedal. I have found that the more pedals I have to go through to get to my fuzz, that's when it starts getting either really fuzzy or overly distorted tones, or tones that I just don't like. Fuzzes are very finicky pedals, the smallest little thing can either make them sound great or horrible. Especially Germanium fuzzes. The best advice I could give though is to move everything around to see where "YOU" like it best, for me my fuzz is 1st then wah and so forth.
     
  7. sega

    sega Member

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    Thanks guys I will try the fuzz in the first position.
    By the way it's a SILICON fuzz.

    I will look at all these open avenues, again ...thanks!!!:drink
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2008
  8. dverna

    dverna Member

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    and how about a tuner, (specifically The Turbo Tuner from Sonic Research) - advisable to run that 1st in the chain just before the fuzz (Skreddy Mayo)?
     
  9. briankp7

    briankp7 Supporting Member

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    I run my tuner last in the chain. I'm not sure if that's the best place for it but I like it there. I use my tuner, well obviously as a tuner, but also when I switch guitars during a gig I hit it instead of turn my amp on standby.
     
  10. Angle Loss

    Angle Loss Supporting Member

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    Just wanted to clarify for you--whether your transistors are silicon or germanium have nothing to do with how it will react. Both silicon and germanium Fuzz Faces (for instance) are affected the same way. A Big Muff circuit is different and is not affected the same way as a FF. The coincidence is that many people have fuzz faces which happen to be germanium. It is not the material of the tranny but the circuit design (and reaction to input impedance) itself that leads to those characteristics. Sorry to interrupt, just wanted to dispel a common myth. ;)
     

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