Need advice re vintage speaker: re-cone or stash away

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by dukeplaysbass, Apr 7, 2015.

  1. dukeplaysbass

    dukeplaysbass Member

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    Hello everybody!

    Need a little advice.

    I recently acquired an all-original 64 Fender Deluxe, complete with original speaker.

    I'm always scared of blowing vintage speakers (did that with a pristine 63 Deluxe) so, not long after I got the amp I decided to pull the original and put in something else.

    All I had on hand was some old Crate 12" so I threw that in there just to wind up the volume and see what the amp could do.

    The change was AMAZING.

    I'm now convinced that the original speaker isn't blown, just really tired.

    So, what's the better play for preserving value? Stick the original speaker in a box? Or re-cone it? Or both?

    In the past experience (the 63 Deluxe) my tech and I decided to recone the speaker and shelve it, as those are amps are a bit much for the original wattage rating for the speakers.

    The same might be argued here, just looking for some opinions about this situation.

    Thanks!

    -Duke
     
  2. J M Fahey

    J M Fahey Member

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    "Getting tired" amounts to losing magnetism, Alnico is famous for that problem.
    reconing won't solve that, of course.
    I'd have it remagnetized.

    That aside, "vintage value" really is based on "old stuff sounds way better than new stuff" , which sometimes is true.

    Since here even a cheesy Crate speaker sounds better than the supposedly Mojo one, there's not much real value in the old one, as is, so, why bother?

    This old vintage Mojo has grown completely out of control, into plain Fetishism or Voodoo.

    Just thinking aloud: Fender chunked out of the factory door hundreds of thousands of mid priced, "working" amps in the 60's, and thousands are still available; anybody assigning them fabulous values and thinking price will double in a short time is not being realistic.

    To be realistic: how much did you pay for yours?
    Selling it is enough to buy a new car?
    .......
    I guess not.
     
  3. swiveltung

    swiveltung Member

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    I'd box the speaker. It adds value to your amp when you sell. I assume it's an Oxford Ceramic?
    Many vintage Fender Amps seem to almost double in price every 5-7 years. I've made the assumption they've "peaked" too many times now.
    Yeah, old speakers get "tired". I had an od Pro Reverb last year, the original Oxfords sounded decent for a couple gigs then got pretty ratty. I took them out and the cones were cracking slightly (radially) I had them reconed to original spec. When back in I was amazed! BIG bottom end and great sound... from Oxfords!
     
  4. FFTT

    FFTT Member

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    If it is still working STASH IT!

    Original is original even if its tired, worn out and fragile.
     
  5. gtrgeek335

    gtrgeek335 Member

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    It would help to know what the original is. My 64 Deluxe came with a Jensen Mojo which I replaced with a '66 Jensen C12Q and I have been told it won't hold up to the wattage of the Deluxe. Sounds good though!

    Gordon
     
  6. Silent Sound

    Silent Sound Member

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    It depends on what kind of speaker it is. Fender used a bunch of different kinds of speakers; some good, some not so good. If it's a Jensen I'd probably have it reconed or whatever it needs to get it back up and working properly. But I love those old Jensen's, so they'd be worth it to me. If it was an Oxford, Utah, CTS, or something like that, I'd box it up. I wouldn't think a speaker like that would add much to the value of an old amp, but you never know. It could in the future to some collector. It probably wouldn't be worth reconing, but might be worth holding on to, just in case.
     
  7. Otto Tune

    Otto Tune Member

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    I'd consider re-coning if you have a place that does it well.
    Near me is the "Speaker Exchange" and they can do factory parts or aftermarket. I had them do some JBL L-112's I had and they look and sound fantastic. (home stereo)
    It wasn't cheap, but they were essentially new.
     
  8. Jimmy MAck

    Jimmy MAck Member

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    Of course, you have to acknowledge that: maybe today - players are gonna expect more out of an amp.

    In the "old" days, players played more quietly, and didn't want or need to PUSH an amp to "breakup" to get a certain hairy sound. Today, that's just not true, unless you are playing dinner music or jazz and want quiet and clean. If so, those players are into something else (see the "Jazz" forum).

    I ramble.

    Put the old speaker in a box. Don't spend money on it unless you are going to use it, and use it in its intended function. Anything else.... buy a modern speaker. When selling it, you have the original (and then it becomes someone else's choice) plus you have a new and useable horn to honk!

    Most people know the score. I would love buying an amp like yours with the original and a useable transducer. I have amps that are in the same category as yours, but I want to play them and enjoy them at my gigs, the old speakers just don't cut it. And the choices in new speakers is amazing but perplexing
     
  9. Tone_Terrific

    Tone_Terrific Member

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    Even when new these were generally the budget line, just good enough to get by.
    Stash it if you think someone values it.
    Install a good speaker and hear the amp.
     
  10. jonnytexas

    jonnytexas Supporting Member

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    One of my old Supers had tired speakers and the difference after installing new ones was truly shocking. I was worried I had bought a dud until I changed the speakers. Throw a WGS in there and call it a day.
     
  11. dukeplaysbass

    dukeplaysbass Member

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    Thanks for the advice, folks.

    I've got lots of experience with vintage basses, so I know the debate ("Is it vintage, or just old and outdated and not worth the expensive prices some stupid people pay?") pretty well. I'm a little surprised to see it on display so quickly in the guitar community but I suppose I should have expected it.

    I am fully on the side that thinks the old stuff is cool, and I have the money to buy it. If you don't, that's fine. You're certainly entitled to your opinion but you're not the people who I need to hear from.

    So, for those who DO appreciate the old gear, if it matters, the speaker is an Oxford (465-349) and is the 12L6N model. The rest of the amp tracks to the first couple of months 64 and the solder joints looked pretty old so I'd venture to guess it is original being so late in 63. This speaker has the horseshoe magnet, not the round ceramic.

    And when I say the original speaker sounded "tired" that's not a fully-informed diagnostic. I meant that, in contrast to the newer Crate that seemed to have a fuller, more dynamic sound and response, the old speaker seemed (surprisingly) lackluster - which I attributed it to being old, worn out, and tired. Like me.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2015
  12. zenas

    zenas Member

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    I run old speakers because the lower efficentcy works better for what I do. No pedals, no master volume, no atenuator. If an original blows it gets reconed.

    That said I almost bought a brown Concert yesterday (and a Porsche) on that amp if I liked the sound of the originals I'd think about boxing them and buying some other old Oxfords to run and maybe recone. Old Oxfords are cheap. (but so am I so I'd probably just run um)
     

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