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New RMC3 - Cheaply built or am I overreacting?

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by visionary, Jan 11, 2008.

  1. visionary

    visionary Member

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    Hey guys.. i've lurked here for a couple of years and have always appreciated all of the great info - have a situation that I'd like some input on.

    I've been a huge fan of Teese wah's for a while now - I came across a picture wah in 2001 at a local shop, fell in love with it and bought it on the spot. It's still my favorite wah of all time. I've always wanted an RMC3 as well for something a bit more versatile, and I decided to buy one today. The new blue case looks awesome, and aside from being a little noisy compared to the picture wah, it sounds great. I was very concerned, however, when I opened up the bottom and saw this:



    [Pictures removed at the request of Geoffrey R. Teese]


    My concerns, specifically:
    1. Everything has been populated onto an obviously redesigned board which runs the entire width of the wah. The Input, Output and Power jacks are now soldered to the board, rather than bolted to the wah body and wired to the board.
    2. The Switch and Pot are connected to the board using Molex connectors, rather than being soldered directly to the board as in earlier revisions.
    3. The 3PDT switch has been changed to a DPDT, so rather than having a hardware bypass, there must be some type of bypass circuit on the board itself.

    A pic of the inside of an earlier RMC3, for reference:

    [Picture removed at the request of Geoffrey R. Teese]

    Now in its defense, as I said earlier, the wah looks and sounds great and the travel on the newer body has a nice, firm feel to it that I prefer to the earlier Dunlop bodies. But that being said, I'm surprised to see the wah put together the way it is. I'd expect to see that kind of construction on one of the newer crybaby's or something similar, but certainly not on a boutique wah that I paid just over $275 for.

    In particular, it seems like it would be a huge pain to service, especially if something went wrong with one of the jacks. It's still a very versatile wah, but I can't help but think that the build quality of the newer RMC3's is incongruent with their reputation for quality.

    Am I overreacting here, or does anyone else think this is a huge step in the wrong direction? I'm leaning towards returning the wah and writing off the RMC3 unless I can find an old stock pedal of an earlier revision.
     
  2. Blues Lyne

    Blues Lyne Member

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    As far as the switch goes, I have an older RMC3 and it doesn't have a 3PDT switch either. There is no LED so a 3PDT isn't needed.
     
  3. Sid

    Sid Member

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    I have a policy...if it sounds good...dont worry about whats inside...thats the builder's job:munch
     
  4. JLee

    JLee Supporting Member

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    Teese did quite a bit of testing and put the new design under quite a bit of abuse in order to test reliability. I believe the boards are still populated by hand. The new design was out of necessity in order to comply with international regulations. Teese has the best customer service known to man and I don't think that will change any time soon, so I wouldn't be too concerned about the quality or reliability of the new design.
     
  5. Colt

    Colt Member

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    The new ones also have the foxrox unit (or similar?) built in...so not oscilation with germ fuzzes!
     
  6. esoteric pete

    esoteric pete Supporting Member

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    although i was surprised to see he inside of that wah too, (mostly because i didnt know abou the change) i have to agree 100% with the above post. geoff is a great guy and his customer service is second to none IMO.
     
  7. Sid

    Sid Member

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    I think Geoffrey Teese is one of the nicest guys around who will give you advice on his product at any time...whether you bought it from him or second hand.....which I think is awesome
     
  8. Teahead

    Teahead Member

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    I agree with these guys, Geoffrey is a top bloke who would put something right, should it ever go wrong. However, I can see why the thread starter might be concerned, it does look to be quite a change. Personally, with my RMC3LE on ebay as I type, I'd be more inclined to buy an older model to replace it because I've owned them already and know them well.

    The prices for older RMC pedals have not rocketed since the new design was released, I would take this to mean that the general wah buying fellows aren't too concerned by the changes. If you are, simply track down an older model, hence saving a few dollars and satisfying your need for the original build quality all in one swoop.
     
  9. kakev

    kakev Member

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    Well, looks like very solid build. Like other have said there's no need for 3pdt switch in order to get tbp. Definately looks more like mass produced pedal compared to the older models, but that's just matter of opinion which one you prefer, quality-wise I bet it's just as good as the older models.
     
  10. JRC4558Dude

    JRC4558Dude Member

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    Well, it is unfortunate that the jacks are attached directly to the PCB. Obviously, if one of them fails, replacing it will be a little trickier. I recently purchased a Catalinbread Semaphore trem and was a little disappointed to see that the footswitch has soldered straight to the board. This in not the type of contruction you like to find in an expensive boutique pedal.

    Fulltone's new method of attaching pots to the PCB looks like an acceptable construction technique to me, but I don't think putting the jacks right on the board (like your new Teese pedal does) is the best way to go.

    However, i certainly agree with the other posters here that "if it sounds good, it is good." Teese has a very good reputation for quality, so if you do have problems down the road, at least you can expect good customer service.
     
  11. StompBoxBlues

    StompBoxBlues Member

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    I definitely could be wrong on this, but it looks like you could possibly wire in regular 1/4" jacks if the board mounted gave you problems.

    I can't tell for sure, but those types on there now are a lot larger, a regular jack (with the tongs sticking out into air) look like they might have more than enough clearance and then it is to wire them in to the contact points on the PCB?
     
  12. Rossl

    Rossl Member

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    I simply cannot agree about first rate customer service. I bought an RMC3 a few years back. The switch failed within 4-5 weeks. I contacted Teese (still had the original box and reciept from a Teese Approved Dealer), he said it was a bad run of switches and there wasn't anything he could do about it. Didn't offer to replace the switch or send a replacement. So I had to buy another switch and install it myself which I should not have to do on a wah that cost me $275.

    Maybe this is an exception, but this is how I was treated. Obviously left me with a very bad impression. I would never buy another thing from him
     
  13. nlopez

    nlopez Silver Supporting Member Supporting Member

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    Very interesting introductory post here Visionary. :rolleyes:
     
  14. Sunstone Recordings

    Sunstone Recordings Member

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    I agree with the OP, I had an old Picture Wah that I sold in a pinch. I later purchased a new ROHS version, and A) didn't like the feel of the pedal, it felt cheap to me. and B) I didn't think it sounded as good as my first one, so I sold it off and actually managed to buy back my original one!
     
  15. JCM 800

    JCM 800 Member

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    You are very much over reacting. Teese is the best in the business for wahs, and would not be putting out a sub par product. He does a large amount of worldwide sales, so he needs to be compliant with all of the new RoHS regulations. That was the basis for the changes.

    If you ever had an issue, Teese will take care of you.
     
  16. sandman

    sandman Member

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    Really? Nic?

    Speaking of switches...what kind of switch is that in the new Teese wah and
    can you replace it yourself if it fails?

    If a switch is soldered to the board...does that mean it can't be replaced or....??
    _______

    Pardon my tech incompetence just doin' a little research...got a Crybaby Classic with a dead DPDT soldered to a small PCB which can only be replaced by original Dunlop parts by a dealer that wants a small fortune for it (not braggin' this is Europe after all).

    Boss TW-1/FT-2 DOD/Mojohand 440 for the win!
     
  17. bandofthieves™

    bandofthieves™ Member

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    Well.The tone is there.Always has been. That board is bigger because half of it is the FFT circuit everyone wanted..The switch is new because it is better than the other one.And now in 08 the pot has been updated because it is better.The wah cases have a tension er and a much longer throw like everyone wanted.The PC board is bullet proof and the solder points are very larger.The connectors for the pot and board are new to RMC but have been proven in other designs for over 20 years as have the board mounted jacks. The Tone is still there.My tech had a fit over the construction quality of the new wahs.Thought they were excellent and would be a breeze to repair if need be..Geoffrey has always been about the tone.You won't read about the NEW MAGIC Components with mojo grease etc. My New Picture wah,wizard, and RMC3's have the same sound as my 05 models.The FFT is great but I really don't have a lot of use for it.But once I got the level dialed in all was well..I think the improvements he has made are great.I am a player and not a tech.Only time I open up a wah is to put a battery in it and I like it that way.I don't take my TV and DVD burners apart or my amps or guitars or telephone or cell phone..I buy good stuff and don't worry about anything but getting to the gig and with a Teese product it is always a warm fuzzy feeling right before ya plug it in for the first time.Like sex with that new Girlfriend;) It always amazes me when someone comes out with an old RMC design with non compliant parts borrowed parts,ebay parts,etc and folks have a fit over them and pay big bucks..If you ever get a chance to Meet Geoffrey Teese in person,do it.I met him at a guitar show several years back.I had him look at an old Vox wah I own that was sick. He opened the wah and before he even plugged it in knew what was wrong with it.Then he said ya know how the wah does this? you can change this and that will go away..I had my tech do the repair and Geoffrey was correct. I then sent Teese 7 of my other Vox wahs and 3 crybaby wahs that he tweaked and turned to Gold.Shame he doesn't have the time for that anymore..The Man eats,drinks and sleeps RMC wahs.He has given advice to 99% of the other wah builders out there(ask them I did).Some how Geoffrey always manages to stay ahead of the game while making trips to the past. Great guy. unstoppable products,Great Customer service.God knows what 08 will bring our way.

    Disclaimer...I am not an RMC Employee.Just a Fan and wah Collector/User for 41 years.
     
  18. 52ftbuddha

    52ftbuddha Member

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    This discussion brings up a good point. Did you get what you thought you were buying. There has been a number of changes from botique pedal makers in the recent past that has changed the price to value relationship. What you detail is one of these instances. I do not feel that the tone of a pedal is the sole factor for the determination of its value. It is clear that some of these construction methods lower the cost of assembly and in such should be passed on to the consumer in a reduced cost. To pedal makers all, I will not buy a changed design at the same price that involves less expensive assembly methods.

    rob
     
  19. DeuceII

    DeuceII Supporting Member

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    I just wanted to chime in on the customer service front. I've got an RMC2 that I bought used about 7 years ago, and the switch just recently died. I emailed Geoffrey about how to replace it and he recommended sending it to him for repair so he could put one of his new switches and new pots in. It cost me $50 incuding return shipping. Now I could have bought the parts and had someone do it, would have been about the same, or done it myself, which probably would have made it worse (my soldering skills suck). But instead the maker himself responded to my email and is servicing the product he maid originally, what could be better than that? I can't recommend Geoffrey enough, for quality products and service. I'm planning on picking up a Picture, Wizard, or Joe Walsh in the next year just to get a different flavor from the RMC2 and I tell anyone that asks about wah pedals to get one of his.
     
  20. michael patrick

    michael patrick Supporting Member

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    Here's my Teese customer service story...

    I asked a question about a balky switch on a Teese wah on an online forum (might even have been here, but I don't remember). A couple of hours later, without my having contacted him first, I had an email from Teese himself offering to fix it (it was one from the bad batch mentioned previously). He also offered to fix up an old Vox wah I have, and I took him up on it. And then, after the repairs were done, he called me on the phone to tell me what all he had done, and to make sure I was cool with it before he shipped the pedals back to me.

    Both pedals worked flawlessly when I got them back. And I absolutely would have no problem buying another Teese wah down the road.
     

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