Out-of-Phase sound for Tele

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by eddie101, Jan 22, 2008.


  1. eddie101

    eddie101 Silver Supporting Member

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    My Tele pups are wired in "old style" which means I get, neck, neck and bridge sound from a 3 position toggle switch. I was visited by a friend just recently and he had his Tele wired in such way so that you'd get OOP sound from the middle position. I have never heard Tele sounding like that - a la Strat almost - and it was very refreshing. Well, I am interested in knowing/hearing what you Pros prefer. Thanks in advance.
     
  2. doublee

    doublee Member

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    I would think the more switch options you have, the more you have to play with, thats good, no?
     
  3. eddie101

    eddie101 Silver Supporting Member

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    True to a degree. I would not want, say, a BC Rich type of guitar where you have 100 different pup combinations/permutations. My questions is, in a 3 way switch setting, which sound do you prefer as you can only have one or the other.
     
  4. Bonedance

    Bonedance Member

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    After experementing with many various wiring options over the years, I went back to the standard three ( neck, middle, bridge ) way. Just works best for my needs.

    One of the variations I tried was a 5 way super switch following deaf-eddies diagram. In addition the the 3 standard tele tones, you get series ( ala the 4 way switch ) and series out of phase. The series out of phase tone did have it's merits.......with a bit of overdrive, it got that nasty, rude tone where pinch harmonics just fly off the fretboard. But, I found it more of a novelty than anything else. Perhaps because I have a neck bucker, the added beef of the series setting did little to float my boat. I think it works better with a traditional tele neck pup.

    As always, to each his own. We each like to hear different things. What works for me may not work for you and vise versa. Still, it is fun experementing and one never knows what wiring combo will work it's magic.
     
  5. eddie101

    eddie101 Silver Supporting Member

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    Well said and truly appreciate your unbiased opinon in this matter. :BEER
     
  6. uvacom

    uvacom Member

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    Do you really want an out-of-phase sound? Or do you just want the neck & bridge pickups in parallel? Because whether one pickups is constructed RW/RP or not, there is a big difference.
     
  7. eddie101

    eddie101 Silver Supporting Member

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    What would be YOUR pleasure? I don't think I've ever heard N&B in parallel.
     
  8. uvacom

    uvacom Member

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    Well, probably you have and you don't realize it. A lot of people call parallel sounds "out of phase" even though properly, they aren't. For example, those 2 & 4 positions on a strat aren't out of phase, they're parallel. If you know this and you really do mean out-of-phase, pardon my pedantry. :)
     
  9. eddie101

    eddie101 Silver Supporting Member

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    In 2 & 4 positions, they are indeed 90 degrees "out of phase". Parallel? I don't know about that. Now, I am really perplexed about your reasoning. :confused:
     
  10. uvacom

    uvacom Member

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    No, there are completely in phase - either all three pickups are wound in the same direction with the same magnet polarity facing up (as on vintage instruments), or the middle pickup is wound in the opposite direction with respect to the other two (putting the signal 180 degrees out of phase) and with the magnets facing the opposite direction (again flipping the phase, putting the signal back in phase). This is what's usually referred to as RW/RP, and is essentially the same way humbuckers work although the two coils in a humbucker are in series. The important thing to note is that sin(2Pi) is the same as sin(0), in other words 180+180=360 degrees is the same as zero degrees, and both pickups are in phase in such a configuration.

    The parallel aspect refers to how the pickups are wired. If both pickups have the inside wire go to ground and the outside wire go to the output, they are in parallel. This is how almost all multiple pickup combinations are wired on any guitar, although sometimes you see a tele with a 4-way switch which can put both pickups in parallel OR series (this is a relatively modern thing, vintage teles never had such a thing of course). Series is when one pickup has it's inside attached to ground, the outside going to the inside of the next coil, and the outside of the second coil going to the output.

    I'm trying to think about how one might even put a signal 90 degrees out of phase with standard guitar electronics, I'm at a bit of a loss.
     

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