P&W Rigs/Pedalboards

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by Abandoned, Feb 12, 2015.

  1. Spec

    Spec Member

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    Can holograms be far behind?
    A church won't even need those pesky musicians.
     
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  2. TomBombadil

    TomBombadil Member

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    I think it definitely will! My amp has been having some issues cutting it (it's from the 90s and I need to get it restored), so I haven't been able to really practice too much, especially considering I live in an apartment with a baby. I feel like it'll breath a lot of life into my playing.
     
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  3. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    It can be a little overwhelming at first, with all the tweak-able parameters, but there are some great resources for Helix patches on here... @yeatzee and @-Empire both offer some inexpensive options to help get you started. The best advice I can give you, is try not to do to much EQ'ing within the amp models without a way to monitor AT FULL VOLUME. You can very easily end up with a tone that sounds great at home and really thin live.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2019
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  4. TomBombadil

    TomBombadil Member

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    Am I going to run into trouble playing through studio headphones at home and through a PA at church? Will the tone be vastly different?
     
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  5. MattLeFevers

    MattLeFevers Member

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    It's this reason, mainly. We started as a full band and then recently, assorted health crises / travel plans / schedule conflicts have led to two months of services with an average of two people on. We've done acoustic, acoustic and cajon, acoustic and kick drum, drummer with me playing a baritone guitar, and this last Sunday we did acoustic, bass, kick drum, and I ran a second output of my acoustic into my electric board with all the delays and verbs on 100% wet just to add an ambiance channel that I could fade in and out via volume pedal.

    I'm severely running out of ways to make two people standing up there sound different or interesting.

    Our church prioritizes a dynamic, loud, engaging style of music, which I fervently agree with; acoustic services are a great palate cleanser but I have zero desire for it to be the default all the time. I just... man, I don't know about the tracks thing. I've gone on at great length in this thread before, about feeling like anything more than pads and ear candy in the tracks is basically karaoke, and renders the couple of musicians you do have up there kind of irrelevant. We'll see what happens.
     
  6. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    Not necessarily a big difference with headphones, but listening through powered monitors there can be a pretty big difference. Read up on the Fletcher-Munson curve... basically as volume goes up, our ears hear differently, accentuating upper mids. Since you'll be running a model of a mic'd amp, and not mic'ing a real amp, the Fletcher-Munson curve will have an influence on your live tones.

    As long as you're aware of it, you should be fine. If you can do final tweaks at your venue through the FOH system, that would be ideal. I just know that I made the mistake (with Helix and Kemper) of pulling the low end back at home, only to find it made the tones thin live. What sounds thick and bass heavy at home, will sound great live.
     
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  7. ewatkins

    ewatkins Supporting Member

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    AWESOME! I've played electric at a church in a neighboring town a couple times that is Very young and small. The mains are just two small probably 10" speakers - no subs. 2 JBL loudspeaker type monitors on the stage and (THATS IT!). They use an old electric drum kit, nice Yamaha keyboard, sometimes have a bass player, and acoustic for the leader. I took my pedalboard with the HX Stomp as my amp and I LOVED it. It just takes out the guess work with your amp tone and allows the audio person the ability to mix the electric exactly where they want it without dealing with amp volume. I've had a lot of success with the stomp and would have no concerns using it on ANY size stage.

    And, you can totally get by with just the stomp ESPECIALLY if you use an external 2-button switch like this one:
     
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  8. cjm254

    cjm254 Member

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    I dont like being the only electric guitar on stage when 6 EGs are playing. I don't like tracks...

    ...or ice cream.


    I do have that joy... down in my heart.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2019
  9. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    It all depends on the priority the tracks are given, and what instrumentation the tracks are used for. I'm certain, after you've used them a few times, you'll figure out what needs to stay and what needs to go, and it will be additive without making anyone irrelevant.
     
  10. dmutter

    dmutter Member

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    I feel your pain. The struggle is real. Most Sundays this year at our church have been about 1/2 a band. It's tough.
    My wife and I usually bring in friends from other churches when we lead, so we can get a full band.
     
  11. papersun

    papersun Member

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    used to use tracks, my rule was no melodic parts. pad, swells, shaker (holy cow don't sleep on the shaker), even a lot of keys/organ parts i could get away with but i mostly just wanted them to fill in space behind our (usually pretty sparse) instruments.
     
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  12. TomBombadil

    TomBombadil Member

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    I don't see the issue with tracks if it's for pads/atmosphere, but having it fill in an instrument that isn't actually there sounds super lame.
     
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  13. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    You don't have to keep those 6 guitar tracks. If that's how they're being used it's, detracting from the musicians on stage, and is not making the best use of the tool. They should be used to cover parts that are not able to be replicated live. I've left a rhythm guitar track in before when I'm the only EG and needed the support that track provided, but if you can cover enough of the ground sonically, there should be no issues muting those tracks.

    Now, if you don't have the technology to mute specific tracks, that's a whole different story.
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2019
  14. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    I'm not sure I've posted this video here (it's our 2019 Camp Share Service), but it's a good example of what I think is the proper use of tracks... props to our sound techs, and the fact that only essential elements are left in the tracks.

    We got a little loose after the baptisms started, probably from emotions... there's a bit of a train wreck in the bridge of As You Find Me.

    I don't think you'll be able to discern what's a track and what isn't.


    I sometimes wonder why I'm on this side of this argument, as I'm usually the curmugeon... o_O
     
  15. yeatzee

    yeatzee Member

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    Re: tracks

    The last few times I've played at church I've played without tracks (and even click for most of it actually) and I must say it's been nice. I understand tracks for bigger church's with large productions going on for the service, but for smaller churches I'm not much of a fan. If your aim is to sound just like the recording then tracks are sort of a must though. Ymmv

    Congrats! Being able to play silently is a game changer, I dont have a baby but I do live in an apartment and the hours I have time to play usually are past 10pm so playing with headphones is a necessity. Digital is amazing for that, if I had to use my amps I'd play probably 75% less than I do now thanks to digital solutions.

    Thanks Bill. Plenty of folks here that use the Helix in its various forms, if you've got any questions @TomBombadil just ask :)
     
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  16. MoonshineMan

    MoonshineMan Member

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    <8
    I tried to do a little hearty face, but it’s not something I’m really schooled up on. haha.

    ^^^^This. This is what I’ve been trying to build among our local churches; a community of musicians who can be asked to come help out somewhere when needed. You always have the right of refusal, but at least give them your number and ask them to text you when they need someone.
    We should be helping each other.
     
  17. Kluch

    Kluch Member

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    Day 2 of Disney... And we're all pretty pooped...

    Thankfully my wife planned rest days after each park day. Otherwise we would have never made it ;)
     
  18. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    That's awesome! Probably my favorite (and most expensive) vacation ever with our kids.
     
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  19. cjm254

    cjm254 Member

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    I agree with your comment. Unfortunately, not my decision.
     
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  20. boyce89976

    boyce89976 Silver Supporting Member

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    I've been there too, and that is frustrating. Sorry, dude!
     
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