Praise and Worship Question

Discussion in 'Effects, Pedals, Strings & Things' started by bloodlemons, Jun 5, 2008.

  1. bloodlemons

    bloodlemons Member

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    I see a lot of questions on here about what people play through for their P&W gigs, and the listed gear usually looks pretty much exactly like what someone might use for a non-P&W gig. There are enough of these posts that I want to believe that there's something to it...

    Is there really any kind of difference? Am I missing something?
     
  2. alex_toney

    alex_toney Member

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    I don't really think there is a difference. A lot of P&W players will have similar sounds because a lot of P&W sounds similar. I think it is more about finding common ground and community and seeing if there are any common trends that work well for the P&W setting. It can definitely be a resource to those of us who do play in those settings. I agree, though, they are similar, and its kinda like comparing the "Your Pedalboard" thread and the "Show us your loaded Pedaltrain JR" thread - its just a matter of appealing to specific interests.
     
  3. bloodlemons

    bloodlemons Member

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    That seems about right. Thanks for the reply!
     
  4. wacopacco

    wacopacco Member

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    yea it's more dude to the fact that most of the P&W guys play a lot of the same songs/styles.... that it's cool to see how someone else is approaching it.
     
  5. Shiny McShine

    Shiny McShine Member

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    I think it might be a way of bonding with the other P&W players without making a big deal out of it.
     
  6. mcdes

    mcdes Member of no importance

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    ha, my pedals are jesus pedals not normal pedals! they are not the same!!.......

    anyways... i dont mean to sound like an idiot, but are there special church gear for guitars?

    i think some church people use multi effects and pods instead of amps too. that aint normal, prob not right either but thats each to there own.
     
  7. benjisaynomore

    benjisaynomore Member

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    In church a lot of folks use pod because it has '0' onstage noise and does a decent job of replicating great cranked tube amp tones (see lincolnbrewster.com)

    When playing out, youth events, big conferences, etc. is where a lot of guys will use tube amps. Most churches simply aren't big enough to use say...an AC30...on Sunday mornings...plus it's not about tone as much as it is enabling others to engage in the worship service.

    In regards to the original question...P&W is more of a genre at this point. So saying "P&W show your gear" is equivalent to "Metal players, show your gear."

    A lot of folks say U2 is basically the base tone all P&W guys go for...I don't agree, I think it's just that VOX and Delays seem to fit well in a worship setting.
     
  8. rogue.guineapig

    rogue.guineapig Member

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    I'd agree with Benji that it goes way beyond a U2 tone...
    I don't consider my tone anything like U2s!

    I think there are things that might tend to be missing more from a P&W
    pedalboard--that is, a pedal board used only in a church setting.
    super high gain Metal pedals, the whammy pedals, talk-boxes, and the like
    seem to be missing from a LOT of P&W boards.
    That's a general statement tho...there's a lot of guys who may see the
    use for those. With the songs that I end up doing, I see no use for those
    pedals given the way I play the songs. Someone else has total freedom to
    do what they want, it's still a free country. :)
    If you listen to a lot of P&W stuff, say, Hillsongs United, Chris Tomlin, Lincoln Brewster,
    Phil Wickham, and stuff like that, it tends to have a certain feel to the electric
    guitar...all those artists are not exactly the same with their electric guit tones, but that
    are not dissimilar either.
    Anymore I don't hear much chorus/flange stuff, or tremolo, and sometimes just
    a little wah. A good delay and distortion/OD is almost mandatory.
    Again tho, there's not really many RULES. Kinda like Benji said, it's almost it's own
    genre. Just like, say, jazz. Do you hear many metal/fuzz pedals in jazz?
    No. But could someone do it? Sure, if they can make it work.
    So whereas Wah and Tremolo don't seem to have the spot on the P&W board
    like distortion and delay do, I still use a Wah pedal and am getting a Trem pedal.
    So in answer to your question...yes it may be similar to another genre.
    But notice the consistencies with the P&W boards of GENERALLY a lot of delays,
    and distos, and sometimes a lack of more specialized effects.
    Again, GENERALLY. You can still do whatever you want, the goal is to make
    whatever tone/pedal/sound you have fit in the genre you are playing in.
    And maybe, when you boil it down, you could say that in general the basic
    elements of a P&W board and a modern/radio rock board are not all
    that dissimilar either.
    If you are looking for a WHY some of these sounds don't work as well in P&W,
    feel free to PM me...that's a much better conversation for PMs. :)
     
  9. benjisaynomore

    benjisaynomore Member

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    Obviously there is room for artistic license as well. For example, I add effects and go for tones I think sound good. Beyond emmulating what other great guitarists do I also try and add my own original tones. Although 9 times out of 10 i end up right where I started when I try and experiment outside the box. Perhaps I'm just too practical though...I don't keep pedals I don't use on my board.
     
  10. rogue.guineapig

    rogue.guineapig Member

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    well said...heaven knows I could use to do what you do...
    try a few original tones! hrrmmm...maybe this Sunday...
     
  11. TGwaH

    TGwaH Member

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    Yeah, Reverends.


    What, someone had to say it?:AOK
     
  12. rogue.guineapig

    rogue.guineapig Member

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  13. AdamLee

    AdamLee Member

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    hmmmmm. I guess I lucked out. I uses my Wah, Trem, Line6 FM4, HOG, and Mojo Vibe for about every session. As well as the Subdecay BlackStar and Tubezone for gainier stuff.
     
  14. 12guitdown

    12guitdown Member

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    I use a treble boost through an OCD for octave solos sometimes. Trem, chorus and wah are effects I often use too.
     
  15. PosterBoy

    PosterBoy Member

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    I've not got the hang of Wah but I do use tremelo during worship.
     
  16. GuiltySpark

    GuiltySpark Supporting Member

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    There are a few differences in approach, but not necessarily in the gear itself.

    I see a few main differences between it and a regular gig from a technical standpoint.

    The major one is volume. Unless you play in a 3000 seat mega church, you are struggling with balancing the band against one another and the audience. This was easy until live acoustic drummers came along. You are not playing over "crowd noise", hootin', hollering, beer drinkin', dancin' folks. You have to play loud enough to beat a sing-a-long, and not make the audience deaf. Sometimes we have ended up with the monitor mix as loud or louder than the mains. We only seat about 350 people though... Now, throw in that tube amps want to run cranked for best tone, and let the party begin!

    At churches I have been to (and played in) P&W music is often intertwined with goings-on between songs. Speakers, prayers, video clips, etc. When the band stops, dead silence is preferred. Hum ridden tube amps need not apply!

    The other is in performance. Less is more and taste (sometimes restraint) is required. Where rock stars want to draw attention to themselves with flashy antics and flurried solos, the P&W person is trying not to distract people in the audience. Tasty chops are awesome, as long as they don't try to trump the song.

    I run a pretty low end (by TGP standards) basic rig. Strat->Keeley Blues Driver->Plextortion->CE-2->Tube-Vibe->DL4-> Peavey Classic 50. It gets the job done, with no U2 reference in sight.

    I think the U2 thoughts are based on some reality. A lot of P&W when done live at church service only has one electric guitarist. They are usually tasked with playing on the cleaner side of the distortion spectrum (both because of volume and feel), trying to blend an electric guitar into some songs written before electricity was harnessed... It can be a bit challenging at times. Maybe some people try to go the percussive delay route, simply because they are tired of playing rhythm chords.
     
  17. ajchance

    ajchance Member

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    The biggest challenge I've faced is trying to find a good tone at extremely low stage volumes. As someone's already mentioned, that's why the modelling pedal boards run through the PA have a following. I've been through half-a-dozen amps to try and find one that'll work. When you play at 1.5 on the volume knob, even a small wattage amp is barely into its sweet spot. I just built a speaker isolation box with a mic input and am going to try that over the summer. Just as in any genre, the quest for tone never ceases. We just have a different ultimate purpose.
     
  18. wacopacco

    wacopacco Member

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    the whole "good tone at low level" issue was fixed for me the moment i bought a Fender Pro Jr. 15 watts, el84's, and under $300. Perfect amp. Just throw a mic on it and you're golden.
     
  19. Phillip_H

    Phillip_H Supporting Member

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    If you can find one that doesn't hum, that is. I had one, and couldn't stand it. The tone was ok, but it was so noisy that it was pretty much worthless.

    I think I've found the perfect amp for me: the Stulce SA-10. It's a 10 watt Class A EL84 amp with two gain stages. It sounds fantastic clean or cranked and it has a really good master volume.
     
  20. wacopacco

    wacopacco Member

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    mines dead quiet. i must have found a good one.
     

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