Princeton Speaker Question:alnico vs ceramic?

[coyoteblue]

I just got a '67 Princeton and want to change the speaker. It has a Jensen P10Rri right now, which sounds pretty good, but the high end is shrill. Most people here recommend alnico speakers over ceramic ones for this amp, in particular Weber 10A125's and Eminence 1028k's. I'd like to know if there are any other alnicos people like and also whether anyone uses a ceramic speaker for the Princeton. It seems that ceramics are often recommended for the Princeton Reverb, but not the Princeton. Why is this? Apart from the two speakers mentioned above, what else works for you.

 

[Top Geezer]

I'm interested in this question too....thanks.

 

[coyoteblue]

Any thoughts?

 

[Allthumbs56]

Hey Coyote,

When I first got my 68 Prinny it had the Eminence alnico. I found it a bit flubby. I built a baffle and put a G12H30 in and that not only got rid of the flub but increased the volume considerably as well (more efficient). My 79' Reverb has the fixed baffle so I went with a Rajin Cajun there and she's just as happy as the 68'.

 

[GuitarsFromMars]

I have a 1965 Fender Princeton.I have a SA10M Scumback in it.It takes about 30-40 hours to break-in,but has an extremely sweet,well defined,woody tone with a complete lack of ice-pick high end.It's a marvelous speaker and everyone who has used it,is impressed by the sound quality,of the amp,and it's speaker.YMMV.

 

[Big Al Z]

70 Princeton with a Rajin' Cajun works fine for me. Not flabby at all. High end is not too bright. It is very sensitive to the guitar that is used - but that might be more of the amp. I find myself adjusting the treble to take care of the difference.

 

[bosstone]

I used to be an AlNiCo guy but I have definitely switched to ceramic. I do like Celestion Blues in AC30s and I do like JBL's in some black face Fenders but I don't have an AC30 and no longer have any black face Fenders.

 

[Axe_78th]

I had a customer a couple of months ago looking for a Princeton Reverb. I found him a mint '68 locally. He got a new baffle for a 12 inch speaker and I gave him several speakers to try. An 50 watt alnico Silver Bell, a 12A150, A 100 watt ceramic Blue Dog, a Cannabus Rex, and a Governor. He's a very picky vintage guy and I was sure an alnico would be his choice. The winner.....the ceramic Blue Dog.

 

[GAT]

I have 2 BF Princetons, both with 12" baffle and Blues, killer tone.

 

[mrface2112]

that's a can o' worms there.

to my ears, alnico speakers aren't as "hifi" sounding and tend to be a little darker than their ceramic counterparts. they also seem to distort differently (and sometimes sooner than) their ceramic counterparts.

example: i've put the Weber 8A125 and 8F125 in silverface champs, and the ceramic version is a little louder, cleaner, clearer and has nicer highs than the alnico. that's not to say that the alnico's not a great speaker (it is!)....but i think i like the ceramic one better. it's just closer to what i was looking for. i've got the weber alnico blue pup in a little Vox Pathfinder and it takes distortion pedals EXTREMELY well.

that said, i just put an Eminence Copperhead in my '65 Princeton Non-Reverb, and it's excellent. it's a ceramic. I went with the copperhead b/c i've been using Webers for years and wanted to try something different. it still needs to be broken in.....but it seems to compliment the sound of the Princeton quite nicely.

the Copperhead's a pretty inexpensive speaker and for that small investment, i think it's definitely worth a try in your Princeton. i really want to try the Weber 10F150P, though.......it's the ceramic version of the 10-150 frame and Blue Pup cone. Should be a little American and a little British.

really though, like all things, it's a matter of taste.


cheers,
wade

 

[wingwalker]

In a Princeton a Weber 10F125 or 10F150T is damn hard to beat...unless of course you have an original mid 60's C10N!

 

[mrface2112]

In a Princeton a Weber 10F125 or 10F150T is damn hard to beat...

i totally agree! the only reason i went with the copperhead was b/c the price was right and i was in the mood for something different.

i'll be picking up a new weber for it soon enough......but i think i'm going with the 10F150P for a change. the original Oxford sounded good.....even through the nasty buzz that the blown cone was serving up. :-D


cheers,
wade

 

[wingwalker]

i totally agree! the only reason i went with the copperhead was b/c the price was right and i was in the mood for something different.
i'll be picking up a new weber for it soon enough......but i think i'm going with the 10F150P for a change. the original Oxford sounded good.....even through the nasty buzz that the blown cone was serving up. :-D
cheers,
wade

I like the 10F125 myself...it's not as powerful, the magnet is smaller and the cone is a little thinner as well but the 10F150 has added magnet weight which fills out the bottom more and adds headroom and punch which some guys like but if you go with the 10F150T the T version uses the 10F125 cone so it's not as dark sounding as a typical 10F150...both the 125 and the 150T are great speakers!

 

[WahmBoomAh]

What`s your desired end with it ? Bluesy, crunchy, Stones ? Jazz amp ?
The non reverb`s are set up to run clean all the way .
If I wanted grunt,dirt etc .. I`d go PR w maybe an alnico

If your looking to run it loud and clean .... I`d go ceramic ..unless you want a really heavy ev/jbl/type alnico (weber cali alnico )

I tried a few in my Clark Kanee (PR based) and chose a 12" Jensen Neo over a 10"rajin Cajun and a Weber 10f150
Sounds like I added 8 watts and put in new tubes in comparison to the 10`s
Not ice picky while being bright and detailed

 

[coyoteblue]

I'm surprised by all the ceramic recommendations. I want a speaker for smokey blues with highs that round off nicely, perhaps like the Copperhead. With the Jensen, I have to turn tone down on my guitar to about 5 to stand it. I just heard about the hemp-cone Lil'Buddy which also might fit the bill. Ted Weber recommends the 12A125. Why do you guys prefer the ceramic version of this speaker...has anyone tried both in a Princeton?

 

[mrface2112]

Ted Weber recommends the 12A125. Why do you guys prefer the ceramic version of this speaker...has anyone tried both in a Princeton?

i have not. but i've tried the 8 versions in Champs.....and i liked the Ceramic better for the reasons i stated above--cleaner, clearer, smoother highs.

of course, the guitar, pickups tubes and everything else are going to play a major role here as well.

i wouldn't at all say one is better than the other......they're both fantastic speakers. i just preferred the ceramic in that amp. and i like the Copperhead in the Princeton a LOT.

that said, i DO plan to pick up a 10F150P for it as soon as funds allow.


cheers,
wade

 

[melody maker]

I'V been complaining alot about the harsh, ice pick tone of my s.f. deluxe. A tech suggested a Jensen c12k to cure my woes. Is he on track? Are ceramics less brite than alnicos?

 

[doc]

The Lil Buddy is a great speaker. For your planned use I'd definitely go with that or Alnico. Ceramic is the ticket if you need more clarity and volume. For some speaker compression and a bit of dirt Alnico is best. For smooth, the Lil Buddy is great. For you I'd say an "early breakup" Alnico from Weber is the best choice.

 

[SkydogFan81]

I have a reissue Jensen in my BFDR and switched it for a Tone Tubby AlNiCo, I love that speaker

 

[56_Special]

I had a Rajun Canjun in my Princeton. Swapped it out for a Weber alnico and I like it a lot better. The alnico really suits this amp. That said, I but the Rajun Cajun in a Vibrolux with a Cooperhead and it sounds outstanding. Those Eminence speakers are truly excellent.