Pro Junior: Ramrod vs. Ragin Cajun

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs' started by FenderGuy53, Feb 27, 2009.

  1. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    I want to replace the stock speaker in my new Pro Junior with something warmer.

    I like the Emmy Patriot Ragin' Cajun and Redcoat Ramrod. If you print the spec sheet .pdf files for these two and lay one on top of the other, there's very little difference between the two frequency curves.

    For classic rock and blues, how do these two speakers size up in a PJr combo cab?

    Thanks for any help.
     
  2. Telecaster62

    Telecaster62 Member

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    I use a Celestion Vintage 10 in my Pro Junior and love the tone. In my opinion the Pro Jr. is more in the traditional Marshall sound camp than Fender and a British flavored speaker accentuates that. I would go with the Ramrod. I would also think the tighter British type cone would keep the bass from getting flabby. I know mine is solid and sounds very much like a mini Marshall. It's almost plexi-ish. With the stock American type speaker it was boomier and somewhat flatulant. LOL
     
  3. AstroStrat89

    AstroStrat89 Member

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    Just dropped a RC in mine. To be fair this is an amp that I've gone back and forth on. And after a few unsuccessful Craig's listings I decided to try it out again with an RC.

    I feel your pain in a way because it would be very nice to be able to see what the frequency curve is like on the stock speaker. Because you can't really make a decision on either unless you have a reference. If the stock speaker is mid scooped and you get a "flatter" speaker all you're really doing is boosting your mids. How do you know how to get where you want to be, if you don't know where you are.

    I just got to a point where I was like "Screw it, I'll never know until I just start trying them out." $65 in not a ton of $$ to throw away, and worst case I would have a quality speaker to build upon.

    After I've bored you with the rant here is probably what you really care about...

    First off I respectfully disagree with the opinion that the Pro Jr. is more of a Marshall sound. My Marshall Lead 20 (big bro to secret recording amp the Lead 12) is much different then the Pro Jr. Maybe an old 18 watter, but not what I would call Super Lead or JCM 800 at all. Neither is it a Black Face sound either. Too me its an older small tweed with more "balls"

    Now here is what you'll get with the RC. It's loud, very loud. Which if you want more clean head room its great. I play mine angeled up and 3 is very loud and clean. As far as the tone (in its strictest meaning), it really isn't much different to me from the stock speaker. it still sounds like a Pro Jr, its just more Pro Jr. Maybe a bit more on the upper mids. But what it will get you is some very nice detail, some killer responsiveness, and a much bigger sound over all. Since installing there have been quite a few wow moments where I was wondering where did that come from? I didn't know this amp could do that. But you will probably get that from any quality speaker upgrade. Just in different ways.

    Hopefully that helps a bit. Clear as mud right? If your looking to make the tone "warmer" you may want to at something that drops off the highs a little more.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2009
  4. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    Agreed. I know that I want a "bigger" sound without having to go to a bigger cabinet. I also want a strong LOW response and a strong, but not overpowering HIGH response. "Warmer" would be good, too.


    I like your metaphor - "older, small Tweed..." I also happen to agree with it.


    Hmmm. You've said alot here. Don't think I want more of the same; think I want something different - something warmer, but still having the upper detail.


    I think you alluded to this earlier, but according to Emmy's freq charts, the Ragin' Cajun and Ramrod have similar LOW and MID ranges with distinctive, peaked HIGH ranges. There's very little difference between the two charts.

    Ironically, the Lil' Buddy achieves a higher freq response than both the RC and the Ramrod in the LOW and MID ranges and achieves almost the same level in the HIGH range. The BIG difference is that there is no real peak in the Lil' Buddy's HIGH range. The LOW-MID-HIGH range is rather flat.

    My fear with the Lil' Buddy is that the HIGH range may get lost in the mix...
     
  5. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    I think AstroStrat89 has it right - the PJr is more in the mold of the old, Tweed sound, than the newer, BF sound.

    That said, I agree with your conclusion: The Ramrod uses the best parts of the Ragin' Cajun and the Lil' Buddy - aggressive LOWs, warm MIDS, and agressive HIGHS.

    It's a shame that the Ramrod gets such shoddy reviews in H/C.
     
  6. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    Oh, I forgot to ask: Are the Emmy speakers simple, drop-in replacements for the stock speaker in the PJr? I don't want to have to deal with misaligned screw holes and such.
     
  7. jammybastard

    jammybastard "I'm losing my edge, but I was there..."

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    I put a Jensen reissue in my almost 10 years ago and it sounds fantastic.
     
  8. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    I'm not a big Jensen fan, but which one?
     
  9. mockoman

    mockoman Member

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    I got deeper bass & warmer highs with a Weber 10F150T.
    Also,smoother breakup.

    Simple drop-in replacement...


    Edit:There's a used one in the emporium-I'm not affiliated...
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2009
  10. AstroStrat89

    AstroStrat89 Member

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    the RC was a drop in. Remember use the "X" pattern when tightening:)
     
  11. Electric I

    Electric I Member

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    Had a cajun in my scxd & while I liked it, the ramrod suited me better.
     
  12. Telecaster62

    Telecaster62 Member

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    Well, I'll chime in again here and respectfully disagree. I've played several Clark 5E3 tweeds and my Pro Jr. is not in that camp. It's much more like the late 60's plexi I owned in the early 70's. The tweeds are much more "organic" for lack of a better word and the Pro Jr. is much more midrange in your face honk like the old Marshalls. The PJ does not break up with picking dynamics. It can be boomy or farty like the tweeds but the resemblance ends there. I think it needs a tight speaker to rein it in and definitely not the Jensen "American" type sound. Again, it could very well be that my amp is different than yours and not all amps of the same model sound exactly the same. Good luck with the speaker search. I gigged my Pro Jr last night in a small club with my Tele and it was great. I really think a lot of this amp. To me it's the best sound per dollar value that Fender has offered in many years.
     
  13. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    After A/B'ing the Ragin' Cajun and the Ramrod several more times, I am really warming up to the Ramrod (forgive the pun). I really don't like the "midrange in your face honk" of the stock speaker. The Ramrod has a moderate, warm midrange and seems to be a better match for the PJr.

    I agree that the PJr is one sweet little amp. We just have to make it our own.

    Thanks for your insights. Much appreciated.
     
  14. AstroStrat89

    AstroStrat89 Member

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    you actually got them, or just the web site clips?
     
  15. jackson

    jackson Supporting Member

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    I have an older tweed pro jr with the blue alnico speaker, and I'm not going to change anything. I can't imagine getting much more out of this tiny 1x10 amp.
     
  16. AstroStrat89

    AstroStrat89 Member

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    I've heard 2nd hand that those early ones with the alnico speaker are quite a bit better than current MIM Pro Jrs. In fact those speakers are highly prized when they come up from those who actually swap them out.

    It would be interesting to put that up with the current stock speaker to see if they are even voiced the same way.
     
  17. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    No, I listened as closely as I could to the Ragin' Cajun and Ramrod tone clips on Emmy's web-site.

    I ordered the Ramrod and it should be here by Thursday.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2009
  18. bazooka47

    bazooka47 Member

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    Agreed. I have an older tweed Pro Jr. that was modded into a 20-watt Marshall circuit. I had been playing it with the stock Fender AlNiCo. Recently installed a Ragin Cajun. The RC speaker is much louder and "in your face" which is exactly what I wanted. I would not describe the tone as being "warm". It is brighter, cleaner, and louder than the stock spkr., with much better bass response. I like it. Other players have marveled at the amount of sound coming out of that tiny amp.
     
  19. AstroStrat89

    AstroStrat89 Member

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    Please don't take what I say here the wrong way. Over all I just want to help you making an informed decision on a speaker. Which one is really doesn't matter.

    My my point is that you can't really gage how the speaker is going to sound in your amp from those clips. All you can really do is compare the speakers against each other. Remember the clip you like is not just the speaker but an amp and to lesser extent a guitar. My RC sounds nothing like what I though it would when I installed it, and I was ready for that when I hit the checkout button. While its a better than stock speaker I am ready to accept that one of the other speakers would be even better. At least now I can compare the frequency charts and guess how another speaker may sound in my amp.

    Let say that an amp has a mid scooped tone, install a mid scooped speaker and it will probably be pretty over the top on the lows and highs. But install a mid bumped speaker an you will probably nice even tone (obviously this is to personal taste)

    But because we really have little insight to the amp used in the clips and really how the stock speaker is voiced its a shot in the dark picking a speaker to obtain a certain goal. Unless you found a chart on the stock speaker. I had a pretty long rant on this a while ago, because I was frustrated with trying to pick a speaker, and wondering why i really needed to replace the speaker at all to get the most out of and amp.

    I hope you are pleased with it. If your like me you're not going to get a chance to try 10 different speakers before settling on one.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2009
  20. FenderGuy53

    FenderGuy53 Member

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    AstroStrat89:

    I know that the Ragin' Cajun is a very popular speaker replacement for the PJr. I also know that FREQ chart for the Ragin' Cajun is very similar to that of the Ramrod. Comparing the clips to each other, the Ramrod seems to be more suited to my taste, which is a warmer, more saturated tone.

    As you say, speaker selection is not an exact science. There may be a period of trial and error. The important thing to note, though, is that you can't begin the journey until you take that first step!

    Thanks for your insights.
     

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