PRS 245 Nitro issues - bad ebay deal

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by tildeslash, Dec 20, 2009.


  1. tildeslash

    tildeslash Supporting Member

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    I bought a PRS 245 Nitro with 57/08 pickups on ebay.
    Here is the auction in question.
    [​IMG]http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290377321714

    Looks like the seller kept this on a guitar stand since he received if from PRS since Feb/2009. And due to the nitro finish the back and bottom of the guitar stand made a pretty deep imprint into the guitar. Most likely due to the heat from being place in a display windows that probably faced the sun every day.

    He only disclosed this in his auction "Small Burn Mark on Back of Neck From a Guitar Stand". Now if you look at the pictures - how is this considered a small burn mark.
    http://www.eazyapp.com/guitars_web/prs_245_nitro.htm

    It is a pretty significant depression and it's deep.
    He did have many pictures of the guitar but he never show any that displayed he "burn mark".

    I wrote him stating the item is not as described and that he basically mislead/misresprensented the item. This was his reply back.
    "I apologise for any miscommunication and for not providing any photos of the burn mark, it is not our intent to intentionally mislead or misrepresent any of our guitars. We'll take what ever steps necessary to make it right, your satisfaction is important to us. Might I suggest that since it's under warranty, that you contact PRS first and see if they can repair or refinish the spot on the neck. You basicly bought a new guitar with the warranty for just over dealer cost, maybe that would be an option, but let me know, we will work it out to your satisfaction."

    PRS websites states I have to have the dealer do this and he is pushing this off onto me. Also they don't cover finish marks like me as it's not under warranty.

    So I am basically ****ed.

    Direct verbiage from the PRS website.

    Warranty
    The guitar is warranted through the authorized PRS dealer it was purchased through. If you are the original owner of the guitar and you are experiencing problems that you feel are warranty related, please contact your authorized PRS dealer immediately for warranty parts and/or services.

    Finish
    Also about their finish and I know it doesn't pertain to the SC-245 but I am sure the website is just not updated yet. Please note, if your guitar is a CE model or a Swamp Ash Special do not hang or set the guitar in a guitar stand with surgical rubber, as it may have a chemical reaction with the nitro-cellulose sprayed on the neck, eating through the finish of the neck. This will not be covered under PRSÂ’ limited lifetime warranty.

    I will call him Monday and see what happens.

    My question is this:
    If he agrees to contact PRS for warranty - I should not be paying any money in any shipping cost right?

    Also - PRS warranty - how long do you think this is going to take?
    Weeks if not months?

    What is wrong with people - don't they check the items before listing it.
     
  2. jiml

    jiml Supporting Member

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    Sounds like they want to help you out. I would have them contact PRS (not sure if they are a dealer or not) though.
     
  3. movingpictures

    movingpictures Member

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    Can you return it? A good luthier can easily fix laquer issues like this. If a return is out of the question, this could be an alternative.
     
  4. sanhozay

    sanhozay klon free since 2009 Silver Supporting Member

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    Why didn't you ask to see a picture of the small burn mark before you purchased? If there wasn't a picture but that damaged was stated on the auction then I would have requested a pic prior. That's just me. Their language sounds amicable and appear eager to want to resolve to your satisfaction.
     
  5. mesa/kramer

    mesa/kramer Member

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    Stunning guitar.

    Not right that this guy didn't include pictures of the damage.

    Was looking around and this guitar seems to be going for $3,015 new, so you did get a "really" good deal, and the damage is on the back of the guitar and only visible up close.

    I would try and get the guy to refund $300 more, to bring it down to $2,000.


    [​IMG]
     
  6. ajazzguy

    ajazzguy Member

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    its a GREAT looking guitar and im sure sounds great, and im sure the dealer can repair it either through PRS or by his own repairshop.
    and maybe he can compensate you with other shop candy?

    btw, i have a mccarty and im sure it would be so much better if it had nitro...so...
     
  7. pirateflynn

    pirateflynn Supporting Member

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    It really is a nice looking guitar.
     
  8. Azfarrier

    Azfarrier Silver Supporting Member

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    Personally I think you are hosed. It specifically says in the ebay auction "recently traded" and "used". This makes you not the original owner in PRS's eyes and not eligible for warranty work. Also because the auction did disclose the burn mark paypal will not back you because the item condition is as described in the auction. Your best bet is to see what the seller will do for you but I don't think they HAVE to do anything unfortunately. Sorry man it sucks.
     
  9. Azfarrier

    Azfarrier Silver Supporting Member

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    Got any pics of the damage for us to see?
     
  10. tildeslash

    tildeslash Supporting Member

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    How the heck what I am showing can be described as a burn mark?
    This is no burn mark it's finish damage. Am I wrong in thinking that - I am sure many people when they see this are not thinking it's not a burn mark but it's finish that has been damaged.

    Also the burn mark at the bottom of the guitar where it sat on a stand was also not described.

    Appreciate the input.
     
  11. reeced

    reeced Member

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    "I apologise for any miscommunication and for not providing any photos of the burn mark, it is not our intent to intentionally mislead or misrepresent any of our guitars. We'll take what ever steps necessary to make it right, your satisfaction is important to us."

    I must admit, I'd be a little bit suspicious of their honesty. Yes, they stated that there was a burn mark on the neck, and yes, they could argue it is "small". But, why oh why, do they show two photos of the rear of the guitar - the body and the neck, and deliberately omit the small section where the burn is ?


    "Might I suggest that since it's under warranty, that you contact PRS first and see if they can repair or refinish the spot on the neck."

    I don't know about the laws in the US, but in the UK, it's the seller who is fully responsible for any warranty, and he/she cannot pass the buck to the manufacturer.
     
  12. tildeslash

    tildeslash Supporting Member

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  13. tildeslash

    tildeslash Supporting Member

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    This guy has sold a lot of guitars and most of his descriptions with tons of pictures would lead me to believe that anything major would be disclosed.

    A burn mark vs.damaged finished is not the same thing.
    Also he did not mention anything about the dimples at the bottom of the guitar from being on the stand. That was not disclosed.

    This is more than burn mark. I do admit sometimes when you sell a lot of gear you miss certain thing and upon further reading of his reply - he is willing to work something out. So I should look on the positive until I speak to him on Monday.

    Maybe the holiday spirits will be with me and be good to him.
     
  14. Azfarrier

    Azfarrier Silver Supporting Member

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    I really wish you the best of luck and hopefully he will be willing to do something for you. It's one of the reasons I've only bought guitars described as "new" or "mint" off of the bay. There is no argument then if someyhing isn't right when you get the guitar. New means new and mint means mint, period. Once again good luck and I hope it works out to where you're happy.
     
  15. Azfarrier

    Azfarrier Silver Supporting Member

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    As a side note how does it sound?
     
  16. FlyingDutchman

    FlyingDutchman Member

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    Damn! That neck pic is awful looking, sorry....Id send it back. That was definitely omitted on purpose from the auction. I may have asked for more pics but in the end that is unacceptable. I would either look for a nice discount and a repair option or just a refund.

    I was a bit on the fence until I saw the pics..Such a beautiful guitar scarred. The dimples dont really bother me. That neck is not cool though..
     
  17. cmatthes

    cmatthes Member

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    PRS will not handle that damage under warranty, and unless you are the first purchaser from an authorized PRS dealer, you aren't entitled to any warranty benefits anyway.

    PRS has been pretty clear about the fact that they are not going to cover finish damage from surgical-type rubber on stands, leather straps, etc.
     
  18. GASattack

    GASattack Member

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    Im scratching my head here over a couple things ...

    First his auction says recently traded & used in a number of places, yet he tells you in his reply that you 'Basically bought a new
    guitar with the warrenty' - and my pessimistic side says that was to placate you with the warrenty stating "Original owner"

    Second - upon looking closely at the pics he has on the listing, it looks quite obvious that he omitted the damage on the neck
    and kept the guitar angled where you cant see the issues on the edges of the body, with intentions that were not honest.
    On the one pic of the back of the neck, there is one place that looks like an imperfection that you think explains the
    burn mark ....

    Thirdly - I always get leary when a dealer lists this tid bit like this :

    Guitar Galleria
    eBay Auction Policies

    - All items are sold as is, and are described to the best of our knowledge and ability

    - There are no returns or refunds

    In the end, I would copy that ebay ad before ebay takes it down, call him on Monday to see what he is willing to do, to make
    it right, but not get my hopes up too much. If that doesnt work, and you exhaust alll other options, i would head over to my attorney's
    with a copy of that ebay ad and the guitar, and see what they think of the misrepresentation of it ...

    Because in the end, i dont think you could get your $2300 back out of it, if you sold it 'as is' with disclosing the finish problems.

    Good luck, and keep us posted how this is working out for you!

    my 2 cents

    Kevin
     
  19. MKB

    MKB Silver Supporting Member

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    Another suggestion; take it to a good luthier, get an estimate on repair, and send that to the seller. Hopefully he will give you a refund for that amount and you can get the guitar repaired. I have had good success with this method on ebay purchases. Since the guitar is nitro, it should be relatively easy to fix well by someone that knows what they are doing. Or even send pics to PRS and ask them for an estimate. I'd hope that PRS is like other smaller luthiers and want their customers happy with their guitar, whether bought used or not.
     
  20. fngmoe

    fngmoe Member

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    From the sounds of it, you won't have much recourse through paypal. I might try what was suggested above - get an estimate for repair and attempt to negotiate from there. You might be able to get a few dollars back. I guess my question is: how much is your time worth?

    If it's a great sounding and playing guitar, take it as a personal challenge to play the bejeesus out of it wear that neck finish/blem out.
     

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