'Recorderman' OH Technique

Discussion in 'Recording/Live Sound' started by Bassomatic, Jan 19, 2008.


  1. Bassomatic

    Bassomatic Member

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiFOD1EeKhQ

    Anyone ever try this one? Thouhts on results?

    I've got a drum session tonight and we're gonna give this a whirl. A nice and phase coherent approach that should minimize excessive cymbal pickup.

    Psyched!
     
  2. devinb

    devinb Member

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    Conceptually I like this a lot...but I only listened to it on computer speakers, so I'm not sure what I think of the sounds.
     
  3. elambo

    elambo Member

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    Phase alignment in a drum track? I'm not even sure that people would like that. And technically, the only thing in perfect alignment would be parts of the kit that are in a straight line directly in between the mics, the snare or kick in this case. Your ride, for instance, would be MORE out-of-phase.
     
  4. Bassomatic

    Bassomatic Member

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    Phase coherence and alignment are two different things, no?
     
  5. chrisgraff

    chrisgraff Member

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    A great engineer demonstrated this technique to me. The "Glyn Johns" technique, used the over-the-shoulder mic, then a mic looking horizonally across the floor tom, to the snare. Height wise, the mic was slightly "taller" than the floor tom; as if you held a string in the center of the snare, pulled across the head of the floor tom. As in the video, the two mics were of equal distance from the snare.

    A third mic was employed, (either a U47 or fet47), out in front of the kick drum, facing it about six feet away; maybe two feet from the ground. This mic was blended in underneath the other two.

    Do a search for "Glyn Johns" drum technique. I'm probably missing something. FWIW, it sounded fantastic!
     
  6. elambo

    elambo Member

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    In this regard? How so? One signal arriving at two mics at the same time, the goal of this technique. By offsetting the height you're making a bigger deal of floor, wall and ceiling reflections as they'll be even further separated in time in the case of some pieces of the kit.

    If it works I'll certainly try it when forced to use two mics, but just thinking about it a little I don't see how it trumps the tried-and-true two mic setup. I'm open to options.
     
  7. Bassomatic

    Bassomatic Member

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    More off axis, but more out of phase? I guess you're right.

    Anyway, just got back from the session. The sound is interesting - cool panned, as rack tom 1 is closer to the front mic while floor tom is closer to the 2nd, rear, over-the-shoulder mic. I'll have to see what I really think when we go to mix.

    Note: This is *not* quite the same as the GJ techniques, as neither mic is low and horizontal. They form a sort of v from front to back, slightly angled from hi hat (L) to floor tom (R). We also used a snare, kick, and room mic.
     
  8. Jarick

    Jarick Member

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    Yes, and I love it. I was a strict ORTF man until I tried this, then found it was a lot fuller sounding. ORTF gives a very precise image; Recorderman gives one more suited for pop music. Sounds best with large diaphgragm condensers.
     
  9. loudboy

    loudboy Supporting Member

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    I tried it last week, and it's pretty cool.

    I also took K, Sn, and Tom mics, which I'm using.

    An alternative to the spaced pair I usually use.

    As for phase, I always measure from each mic to the center of the snare, when setting up OHs. Just sounds better to me...

    Loudboy
     
  10. mungo

    mungo Member

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    I use it with my band. I've found in our rehaersal spot (a basement) the OH's were to close to the cymbals. This gives a much truer representaion of the kit in our room. I also add a snare and kick for taste.

    Actually I've found, given a good headphone mix, that my drummer seems to mix himself as he's playing more with this technique then others.

    I think it's great if you don't have a really nice room plus limited inputs and you want more of a "roomier" sound

    dug
     
  11. JingleJungle

    JingleJungle Member

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    Beautiful - thanks for posting!
    "Natural" ambient mic techinques are just so "zen", especially when compared to the over mic'd hyper-tech approach some seem to prefer.
    Like watching perfectly executed tai-chi or aikido moves ;) where *more* is a natural derivative of *less* ;)

    It also means that your hard earned $$ can be spent for better equipm't, as opposed to "more" and lesser quality prosumer shtuff.

    JJ
     
  12. mungo

    mungo Member

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    One thing I forgot to mention is if you play with the height of the mic placed over the snare and the other on the drummers right shoulder acordingly you can really play with the space more. Also angling each mic ever so slightly can give you a better balance of the whole kit.

    But the farther you go the room definately can play a detrimental role. So tunning the room has been our goal moreso as of late.

    dug
     
  13. ricoh

    ricoh Member

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    It has worked well for me. I really do not use tom mics and I like the open sound of this set up. I also use SDC's even though I have tried LDC's, I prefer the sound of the SDC's better.
     

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